Anime makes light of domestic abuse?

[sickVisionz]

I was on another site and came across an interesting thread that baffled me so I decided to ask you guys.

Sometimes in anime, a boy might do something that could be mistaken as perverse to a girl. This could be accidentally walking into her while she's in a shower, falling into her breasts or little things like that. In reaction, the female will often physically strike the male character.

The question is this: would you consider that as offensive and inappropriate because it makes light of domestic violence?

[something]

The question is this: would you consider that as offensive and inappropriate because it makes light of domestic violence?
Oh for fuck's sake, no. The only offensive thing is anyone being stupid enough to equate animated comedy with the real world problem of domestic violence.

[Gatts]

The question is this: would you consider that as offensive and inappropriate because it makes light of domestic violence?

Only if you consider things like the Three Stooges or the Keystone Cops, as making light of violence. Slapstick comedy has been around for much longer than anime has.

[TheGreenMan]

Goodbye, Mr. Despair Okay, not really.

Of course, DV, when it happens in anime, is the wife beating on her husband, who usually deserves it (and it's done for humor).

[Isuzu Inugami]

Apparently only when the show in question is Love Hina. :rolleyes: But basically, no, it's slapstick violence; and you can lay into it for being lazy and overdone, but I wouldn't call it some sort of thumbs-up to domestic violence.

[TAS]

The question is this: would you consider that as offensive and inappropriate because it makes light of domestic violence?

Only if you consider things like the Three Stooges or the Keystone Cops, as making light of violence. Slapstick comedy has been around for much longer than anime has.
And Tom and Jerry, Road Runner...
And Pepé Le Pew was a stocker.

[Thomas Alan]

At the risk of taking the topic seriously, it could well perpetuate the myth that it's acceptable for women to be violent towards men. And violent women are candidates for being victims of domestic violence themselves (shockingly, men are more likely to punch someone who has punched them first).

In that sense, it is a bit more serious than The Three Stooges.

[Fencedude]

At the risk of taking the topic seriously, it could well perpetuate the myth that it's acceptable for women to be violent towards men. And violent women are candidates for being victims of domestic violence themselves (shockingly, men are more likely to punch someone who has punched them first).


It just depends on how its portrayed.

I feel like I've seen something that did approach this seriously, but its not coming to me.

[Thomas Alan]

If there's a damaging myth that people really believe that's causing damage to people, then it doesn't matter how it's portrayed so much as that it actually does cement the myth even further.

In this way, you can call it more akin to racially insensitive cartoons of the 30s or even the above example of Pepe Le Pew (some of whose shorts are no longer as widely available). Serious or not, good or not (and some of those insensitive cartoons weren't just good...they were bonefide classics) 50 years from now we may well look back on it and just cringe at the backwards thinking.

Simple slapstick, on the other hand, will always just be silly stuff.

In any case, can we at least agree that the Love Hina stuff is tired and not funny?

[Fencedude]

In any case, can we at least agree that the Love Hina stuff is tired and not funny?

Of course, I don't think you'll get any objections that the crazed overreactions are no longer amusing. Though honestly, series that abuse that trope are far less common, and tend to be not that great anyway. *cough*toloveru*cough*

[One Vorlon]

. . .
I feel like I've seen something that did approach this seriously, but its not coming to me.
Hmm . . . I know I've seen some, also. I know there are some really good examples in "real world" settings, but I can't think of them at the moment. However:

Revolutionary Girl Utena - the vice president smacks Anthea around
Yukina gets smacked around in Yu Yu Hakusho (when she was kidnapped by the gangsters)
That one enforcer in Tenjho Tenge beats the tar out of Bob's girlfriend - and strongly implies that he raped her, too
I could be wrong, but don't we see Gendo Ikari smack Ritsuku's mother around in Neon Genesis Evangelion?
Oh, and don't both Harry and Gene hit Malfina in Outlaw Star?I know there are others, though (I'm certain I've seen a guy backhand a girl while calling her "stupid woman" somewhere) - I'll probably remember them as soon as I post.
At the risk of taking the topic seriously, it could well perpetuate the myth that it's acceptable for women to be violent towards men. And violent women are candidates for being victims of domestic violence themselves (shockingly, men are more likely to punch someone who has punched them first).

Anime wouldn't be the first to imply that - remember Bewitched? How many times did Endora curse, mindrape, or otherwise abuse Darren?

[bored@lazy]

could be wrong, but don't we see Gendo Ikari smack Ritsuku's mother around in Neon Genesis Evangelion?


Nope, never happened.

[sickVisionz]

Revolutionary Girl Utena - the vice president smacks Anthea around
Yukina gets smacked around in Yu Yu Hakusho (when she was kidnapped by the gangsters)
That one enforcer in Tenjho Tenge beats the tar out of Bob's girlfriend - and strongly implies that he raped her, too
I could be wrong, but don't we see Gendo Ikari smack Ritsuku's mother around in Neon Genesis Evangelion?
Oh, and don't both Harry and Gene hit Malfina in Outlaw Star?

For the record, none of the shows mentioned in the other thread were anywhere near as serious as these. I don't think any of the ones you listed are making light of anything because all the acts are seen as something horrific or at least something that shouldn't happen.

The type of shows being mentioned in the original thread were stuff like Hayate no Gotoku and other incredibly lighthearted and slapstick stuff.

[njchobitsfan]

Just the thought of the Three Stooges playing on Japanese television makes me chuckle. Can you imagine Curly's voice? I can hear the seiyuu now :laugh:

Seriously though, slapstick is so prevalent in Japanese comedies it's like a national treasure, I can take it for so long....:rolleyes:

[Quarkboy]

Just the thought of the Three Stooges playing on Japanese television makes me chuckle. Can you imagine Curly's voice? I can hear the seiyuu now :laugh:


Somehow i think Japanese people would get horribly confused by the stooges since they're all Boke and Tsukkomi mixed up.

[something]

Hmm . . . I know I've seen some, also. I know there are some really good examples in "real world" settings, but I can't think of them at the moment. However:
Showing something, and making light of it, and two very different things. Of course anime addresses many different serious topics, whether violence or drug abuse or murder or depression or abandonment or what have you, but it's insane to equate "these issues are raised" with "these issues are systematically trivialized and exploited", the latter being the accusation at hand.

[kadmos1]

Technically, it is. However, the thing with entertainment is that they can somehow make real serious issues supposedly seem funny at times when it isn't supposed to be. I agree that the aspects of fan service titles having the guy get beat up is sexist/abusive during when the character in a particular moment doesn't deserve it because at times he does.

[Gatts]

Just the thought of the Three Stooges playing on Japanese television makes me chuckle. Can you imagine Curly's voice? I can hear the seiyuu now :laugh:


Somehow i think Japanese people would get horribly confused by the stooges since they're all Boke and Tsukkomi mixed up.

Manzai style comedy is more like Abbott and Costello or Laurel and Hardy than Three Stooges or Marx Brothers. Manzai is a duo comedy style not really a team style.

[Gatts]

For the record, none of the shows mentioned in the other thread were anywhere near as serious as these. I don't think any of the ones you listed are making light of anything because all the acts are seen as something horrific or at least something that shouldn't happen.

The type of shows being mentioned in the original thread were stuff like Hayate no Gotoku and other incredibly lighthearted and slapstick stuff.

So was your statement in the original post that anime takes domestic violence lightly suppose to be limited to just comedic slapstick series?

People who are easily offended should stay away from comedy in general. Comedy tends to take the most offensive subjects and trivialize them. To put up another example, some of the most accomplished comedians use serious domestic issues as a backdrop for their comedy.

Red Foxx
Mel Brooks
Richard Pryor
Carroll O'Connor
Dave Chappelle

I could go on for days. All of these people "make light" of serious issues from domestic violence to drug use to theft, prostitution, and murder.

Not being able to distinguish between a comedic scene and a serious one is more of a problem of the viewer. Not everyone is going to have the same comedic view point or tolerance levels. Just because Bill Cosby doesn't like Eddie Murphy's comedy style, doesn't mean he doesn't recognize it as being comedy.

Getting back to anime examples, lets use a litmus test anime, Elfen Lied. This is an anime that switched between serious depictions of abuse and violence and intersperses comedic slapstick. While watching this anime, could you tell the difference between the comedic scenes and the serious scenes? If you can't then there might be a problem.

To use a more recent example, there's Kore wa Zombie Desu ka? Which is the polar opposite of Elfen Lied. It focuses more on the comedy aspects and intersperses serious depictions of violence in between. However it never treats the results of any of the slapstick elements in a serious manner. (so far that is, I've only seen 4 episodes)

[something]

To use a more recent example, there's Kore wa Zombie Desu ka? Which is the polar opposite of Elfen Lied. It focuses more on the comedy aspects and intersperses serious depictions of violence in between. However it treats the results of any of the slapstick elements in a serious manner. (so far that is, I've only seen 4 episodes)
Did you mean "However it never treats..."? If so, yeah, exactly.

Zombie Ayumu getting cut in half with a chainsaw by Haruna = comedy.
Serial killer murdering innocent people = not comedy.

The first is not treated seriously, because it's not serious.
The second is treated seriously, because it is serious.

Making these distinctions should be easy for a sane viewer. People who tend to get riled up about it are usually the same people who willfully ignore the distinctions because their goal is not to comment seriously on the subject matter. It's to rant about genres or shows they don't like, and accusing a show of being morally bankrupt and a bad influence is a cheap and easy way to discredit a show and its fans, and to mask a personal, subjective bias as an objective commentary on a societal ill.

These types tend to betray their biases pretty quickly, though. Happens all the time.

[Gatts]

To use a more recent example, there's Kore wa Zombie Desu ka? Which is the polar opposite of Elfen Lied. It focuses more on the comedy aspects and intersperses serious depictions of violence in between. However it treats the results of any of the slapstick elements in a serious manner. (so far that is, I've only seen 4 episodes)
Did you mean "However it never treats..."? If so, yeah, exactly.

Yes, I missed a word. Fixed. :)