Review: Battle Vixens vol. 1

[gpn]

English Title: Battle Vixens
Japanese Title: Ikkitousen
Vol. # 1 of 6+
Author/Artist: Yuji Shiozaki
Publisher: TokyoPop
Translator: Louie Kawamoto
Originally Published by: Gum Comics
Price: $9.99
Pages: 161
Age Rating: 16+
ISBN: 1591827434
Release Date: 04/04
Review Date: 04/06/04

Grading~
Packaging: C
Artwork: A
Text: F
Content: C (If you don't like fan-service, then D /images/graemlins/happy.gif)

What They Say:
Ages ago, in The Three Kingdoms era, heroes tried to unite China... and failed. After their defeat, the heroes' spirits came to rest in jewels known as Magatama. Those who possess them fight to become Ikki Tosen: One Warrior with the Power of One Thousand!

Hakufu Sonsaku is a busty, beautiful girl with an irresistable lust - for battle! At her mother's request, Hakufu resists her burning desire to beat people up... until a chance encounter with another Toushi at school leads to an all out brawl. Will their first meeting be Hakufu's first beating?

Packaging:
The cover uses the same coiled dragon as seen on the original japanese cover, but the image of Hakufu has been changed. Interestingly, the cover shown on TokyoPop's website shows an image based on the original version. The original image is nothing special, but I would rather have seen TokyoPop stick with it.
Logo Check!! ( 2003 Megs)... Worst... Logo... Ever. Not only did they change the name from the original "Ikkitousen", they came up with a really terrible logo. I expect much better from TokyoPop.
No color pages are included. The original Japanese Ikkitousen logo is reproduced on the second page, but there is no translation for it. The printing in the book looks pretty good. Shading is reproduced well and there weren't any noticable areas where reproduction was too light or too dark.

Artwork:
The artwork is very nice and is easily the hilight of this volume. Shiozaki draws females very well; Hakufu and Ryomou are the two stand out characters visually to me. Fight scenes are paced well and flow smoothly. I find the artwork to be worth the price of admission; which is a good thing as you'll see below.

SFX/Orientation:
This volume is presented in the original orientation of right-to-left and sfx are not translated.

Text:
While the translation is probably decent, the writing in this volume is possibly the worst I have ever read in a manga. As a young lad reading comic books in the late 70's, I enjoyed Keith Giffen's Kirby-esque artwork on the Defenders. I had not seen much of his work since then, but any fond feelings I had towards him as a creative person have been completely abolished by the abyssmal script he produced here. He's decided to "spice up" the dialogue by making virtually every other word spoken by the characters a swear word. I'm no prude and have been known to do my fair share of swearing, but the sheer volume present in this script is absurd. The other problem is that the swearing is so clumsily written. Writers like David Mamet and Quentin Tarentino can make the use of foul-language an organic and natural sounding part of their characters and almost poetic at times, but it's use here seems more like a child who's just learned some new "bad" words and uses them without rhyme or reason to see the shocked faces of his parents. How out of place it seems is made more noticeable by the sections of plot exposition, which are swear-free and read pretty well; unfortunately these passages are few and far between. Much of the sexual oriented language seems out of place and unnecessary as well. Given this title's target audience in Japan, I have no doubt the original version contains swearing and sexual language, but I doubt very much it's to the ridiculous extent of what's seen here.

Contents (Watch out spoilers ahead):
The premise of Ikkitousen is that the spirits of warriors from China's Three Kingdoms era reside within tear-shaped stones called Magatama (a familiar item in many anime and manga), and those who possess these stones gain that warrior's power. The possessors of these stones, Toushi, are frequently fighting each other. Whether the final goal is for one person to possess all the stones, or to gather possessors of the stones as followers has not been made clear at this point of the story. Hakufu is a ditzy blonde with one joy in life: physical combat. She has a killer body, but she's not very self-conscious, which is a good thing since her panties are frequently seen and it seems that her shirt gets torn in every battle. Her Mother has tried to shelter her by making her practice the Japanese tea ceremony and flower arranging, but all Hakufu wants to do is fight. When she gets in her first brawl of the book, she cries tears of joy at finally being able to do what she loves. But Hakafu's mother has really been sheltering her for another reason. The spirit of the Magatama the family holds, is Sonsaku, one of the mightiest warriors of ancient China. Once Hakufu has taken part in a fight though, her destiny is chosen and she must take possession of the family's Magatama and become a Toushi.

To fulfill her destiny Hakufu must move to Tokyo and live with her cousin Koukin and attend a High Scool full of Toushi. To make a good first impression on the other students, her Mother tells her to defeat 30 Toushi as soon as she arrives at school. The other students are happy to test the new girl, but Hakufu proceeds to beat them up one-by-one, much to her delight. She's coming close to reaching her goal of 30 when a huge Toushi named Gakushu shows up to test the girl who has beaten so many students. He tells her she can have a free shot and to kick him as hard as she can. Hakufu kicks him as hard she can to his side, but there's no effect. Gakushu then slaps her aside and declares that she is not worthy as an opponent. Some time later though, Gakushu doubles over in extreme pain and realizes that this is a technique of delayed reaction and he begins to reassess his original opinion of Hakufu. As the story continues, we are introduced to my favorite psychotic, eyepatch and maid uniform wearing Aoi-chan look-alike, Ryomou. Gakushu's battle with Hakafu was not sanctioned by the Toushi leader of the school, Enjutsu, so he must be punished. Ryomou is more the willing to deliver that punishment and relishes every bit of it. Later, Enjutsu decides (or is it really the idea his scheming lietenant Genpou? hmmm...) to have Hukufu executed, so he calls upon a deranged Toushi named Kannei to handle it. Unfortunately for Kannei, Ryomou has taken an interest in Hakufu...

This volume ends with a Chapter 0 side story detailing the backgrounds and battles of some other Toushi who do not appear in the main story. Whether they will appear again at all is not clear.

I had seen some of the Ikkitousen anime via fansubs and was interested enough by it to pick up the manga. Unfortunately the manga (at least TokoPop's version) so far is not nearly as enjoyable. If I didn't like the artwork as much as I do and already have the next two volumes on pre-order, I would not be buying any more of this series. This book is the perfect example of how manga should NOT be adapted, and I have to say it is the worst thing I have read from TokyoPop.

Hopefully future volumes will be better than this, but I won't hold my breath; at least there's the anime to look forward to.

[wanfu2k1]

Thanks for the review GPN, and once again I'm happy to have cancelled my order for this title. Hopefully soon I will have my missing japanses tanks /images/graemlins/happy.gif

[ QUOTE ]
gpn said:
Much of the sexual oriented language seems out of place and unnecessary as well. Given this title's target audience in Japan, I have no doubt the original version contains swearing and sexual language, but I doubt very much it's to the ridiculous extent of what's seen here.

[/ QUOTE ]
If I had known you were gonna post a review, I would have waited instead of dragging the other 2 week old thread out /images/graemlins/wink.gif. The sexual language is, at minimum, 3x more than the originals. Alot of it is at the expense of actually mentioning the magatamas and their related legends or from regular fighting expressions or making Hakufu look even more ditzy and did not even remotely exist in the original. Translation is definitely not good and tons of details are lost (especially in those 2 pages before Chapter 0) but then again, I can't really tell if it was the adaptation/editing that utterly screwed it up. I don't agree that the plot parts read well either (the parts that actually made it past the adaptation). The scanlations I have make it much more clearer about whats going on rather than ...aggression ...in magatamas (huh?!) Personally I can't see how anyone who hasn't seen the anime/read the synopsis would even think about how the Three Kingdom legends or the magatamas relate to the story, or what role Hakufu plays, due entirely to this adaptation. One more thing, there were several parts that were too light and/or had broken lines that exist in the original... maybe it was just a problem with my copy?
Anyway, avoid at all costs /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

[pianocello]

Looks like that's one more title I will be saving $$$ on.

[ryosuke]

Thanks for the heads up, I spent my money instead towards Tuxedo Gin (gotta love the penguins). /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

[wanfu2k1]

[ QUOTE ]
ryosuke said:
Thanks for the heads up, I spent my money instead towards Tuxedo Gin (gotta love the penguins). /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
Tuxedo Gin kicks major booty /images/graemlins/happy.gif The japanese version of Ikkitousen is nice too, if you can read japanese or find some scripts /images/graemlins/sad.gif

I was flipping through this and I agree the artwork is really nice. I didn't get it because of the review, though I might pick it up as the free one in a B4G1F sale...simply because the pictures are really slick. I might wind up liking it for /images/graemlins/noseblee.gif reasons as long as I find it readable. But with that review, I'm holding off on it.

Thanks for the review. I guess I'll be skipping over this one. And to think, if we killed Keith Giffen, WE'D be the ones going to jail...

Joking aside, now I have to debate whether to get the japanese tanks.

[Sze]

I picked Battle Vixens up last night and wish I hadn't. I don't mind the addition of profanity as much as I hate having to decipher Giffen's fragmented sentences and odd slang.

Also, it's disappointing that they're not doing a translation and instead doing an adaption. It bothers me while I'm reading to know that's not what they're actually saying. The artwork is nice so I'll be buying the japanese volumes. Er, does anyone have a link to some text translations? /images/graemlins/happy.gif

[wanfu2k1]

[ QUOTE ]
Faust said:
Thanks for the review. I guess I'll be skipping over this one. And to think, if we killed Keith Giffen, WE'D be the ones going to jail...

Joking aside, now I have to debate whether to get the japanese tanks.

[/ QUOTE ].
Get the japanese tanks, they are awesome you won't regret it.

[mariemisu]

I got this manga and I agree, the translation is terrible. Was there a reason for the name change, from Ikki Tousen to Battle Vixens?

[populuxe]

I picked this up last night. Cute girls, panties, breasts like watermelons... why not?

First off, the title is ridiculous. Battle Vixens? What the hell is wrong with Ikkitousen? The logo, as you said, it equally poor. The font is better suited for a shoujo story about girls who like to shop and talk about boys. It's just so wrong for this type of story.

Your comments about Keith Giffen's script is dead on. I hate saying that, too, since I've been a fan of Giffen's work for something like 15 years. I don't want to sound like I'm piling on. I didn't read any of this thread before I read the book. I wanted to read the book without any preconceived notions. It's just that the conclusions I came to last night mirror yours very closely. I don't want Keith Giffen's "Battle Vixens". I want Yuji Shiozaki's "Ikkitousen" in English. It doesn't matter that it's little more than a fighting manga full of fanservice. Why shouldn't it be treated with the same respect Tokyopop affords Ai Yori Aoshi or Fruits Basket?

[witega]

[ QUOTE ]
martialstax said:
I picked this up last night. Cute girls, panties, breasts like watermelons... why not?

[/ QUOTE ]

You answer your own question below:

[ QUOTE ]
I don't want Keith Giffen's "Battle Vixens". I want Yuji Shiozaki's "Ikkitousen" in English. It doesn't matter that it's little more than a fighting manga full of fanservice.

[/ QUOTE ]

People obviously bought Keith Giffen's 'Battle Royale' and now they are buying his 'Battle Vixens'. As long as people keep buying them, Tokyopop has an incentive to keep providing these lousy translations. And as long as they keep buying them we'll eventually see Keith Giffen's 'Tenjo Tenge' or his 'Gantz' or his 'Peridot'. Every time someone buys a Tokyopop edition of Battle Royale or Battle Vixens, you are telling Tokyopop that you approve of what they have done--and want them to do more.

[MalrocK]

Well, by now everyone knows my opinion on Tokyopop's "Battle Vixens" but let me just cut and past a couple of things I have said in the past:

[ QUOTE ]

Malrock said:
[ QUOTE ]
asagiri2040 said:
To set the record straight (maybe):

First, doesn't "Battle Vixens" appear on various Japanese merchandise items for Ikkitousen?


[/ QUOTE ]

I've addressed this before /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif. Yes, "Battle Vixens" appears on some merchandise for Ikkitousen but from what I can tell, it is only used to describe products that have Ryomou & Hakufu on them. Thus, those two are the battle vixens, not the entire manga.

[ QUOTE ]

Random slang and curses, plus bits of dialogue that Giffen decided were too bland and rewrote to suit his fancy, are prevalent


[/ QUOTE ]
How about every other word is "Fuck" or "pussy" or "cunt"

[ QUOTE ]

Neither of those reasons excuse the end result though, which is why I'm not buying it. Well, and because the art and tone reproduction quality is iffy, and the cover and quality of the book itself pale in comparison to the originals.


[/ QUOTE ]
Nope, none of these excuse the end result /images/graemlins/sweat000.gif. Yes, everything is smaller because they had to resize it, as a result the quality has suffered a little, from what I can tell by reading it at the bookstore /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif. Plus, they took out the color page and changed the cover /images/graemlins/anger200.gif

[ QUOTE ]

*hugs original volumes 1-3*


[/ QUOTE ]
I'm doing the same thing right now /images/graemlins/happy.gif

[ QUOTE ]

Anyone know just how many more volumes there will be?

[/ QUOTE ]
As I mentioned somewhere, I think there are 6 currently. I could be wrong though /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

[populuxe]

[ QUOTE ]
witega said:
Every time someone buys a Tokyopop edition of Battle Royale or Battle Vixens, you are telling Tokyopop that you approve of what they have done--and want them to do more.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, I haven't bought Battle Royale. To tell you the truth, the very concept of Battle Royale turns my stomach. I haven't read the book, and I haven't read any threads about the book. I had no idea Giffen wrote the script for either Battle Royale or Battle Vixens until I bought Battle Vixens last night. Even if I had known Giffen wrote the script for Battle Vixens, it wouldn't have stopped me. In fact, it would have been a selling point for me, since I've liked so much of Giffen's work. But know that I've read Battle Vixens, I can see Giffen's capable of crap work, too. Live and learn, I guess.

[gpn]

[ QUOTE ]
martialstax said:
I don't want Keith Giffen's "Battle Vixens". I want Yuji Shiozaki's "Ikkitousen" in English.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this sums it up just right. I wonder how Keith Giffen would feel if some of his comics work was released in another country and completely re-written. I'm sure he wouldn't like it at all.

Editor Rob Tokar needs to be called out on this too. He deserves just as much, if not more, of the blame for approving this approach to the book.

[Crimson]

I wonder if Tokyopop would maybe consider re-releasing it if they get alot of complaints? I was willing to look past the retarded name change but now they're changing things inside the book so i'm definately not buying it.

So either Tokyopop will wise up and do a proper release or i'll have to settle with buying the Japanese books or just ignore this series.

[SeanGaffney]

So who will be the brave person to face jail time and provide us with real translations? ^^:; As lacking knowledge of Japanese, I won't be hugging the originals, but will be buying Giffen.

[Crimson]

[ QUOTE ]
Sean Gaffney said:
So who will be the brave person to face jail time and provide us with real translations? ^^:; As lacking knowledge of Japanese, I won't be hugging the originals, but will be buying Giffen.

[/ QUOTE ]

Jail time? oh please. If people were getting locked up for providing translations then fansubbing wouldn't exist.

If theres translations for Ikkitousen i wouldn't mind getting the originals but if theres none then i won't be getting this manga.

I won't support Tokyopop's treatment of it by buying their version.

[SeanGaffney]

[ QUOTE ]
Crimson said:

I won't support Tokyopop's treatment of it by buying their version.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I want to see how the manga turns out. So there's not much else I can do.

[Rogueman_8]

thanks for the heads up. Not that it matters much to me since I don't buy any english translated manga. Like all mangas that I read, I might pick the HK editions with the current ones I'm reading (Naruto, Tenjo Tenge, Gantz) as HK editions are very true to the original sources (all sound fx and art are untouched, well, some signs are translated). However, interesting review and a nice reminder how I will never buy any english translated manga /images/graemlins/catgirl0.gif.

[wanfu2k1]

[ QUOTE ]
Sean Gaffney said:
So who will be the brave person to face jail time and provide us with real translations? ^^:; As lacking knowledge of Japanese, I won't be hugging the originals, but will be buying Giffen.

[/ QUOTE ]
Why would you buy Giffen when the japanese origionals are so much nicer. Better paper, color pages, dust cover, ect...

[SeanGaffney]

[ QUOTE ]
wanfu2k1 said:

Why would you buy Giffen when the japanese origionals are so much nicer. Better paper, color pages, dust cover, ect...

[/ QUOTE ]

Because I don't read Japanese.

[animeman]

Me too. I can't read Japanese even I bought the Japanese GNs. I happened to like the first volume and will be buying the series to completion even if the translation is a little off but hopefully the translation gets better when the 2nd volume gets released in June.

It's not just "a little off", it's a complete rewrite. The fact that the only major plot point this series has, has been practically edited out means the only thing left in the text is badly edited Jr. High sex jokes, which I couldn't care less about. Art is the only reason left to get these and that is reproduced better in the Japanese version, so there's no use for Tokyopop's version. To each his own I guess.

I see no chance that it will get any better in future volumes unless by some freak occurrence Tokyopop decides to remove Giffen from the project.

[Hayate Kurogane]

[ QUOTE ]
sky said:
I see no chance that it will get any better in future volumes unless by some freak occurrence Tokyopop decides to remove Giffen from the project.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, they've mysteriously switched writers in the middle of projects before. The first two volumes of s-CRY-ed were written by one writer, and the final three were written by someone else. Too bad the second writer was yet another "let's be creative" guy and the script went to hell. To quote Harold Livingston (producer for the first Star Trek movie, among other projects):

"When something works, you don't piss in it to make it better!"

[akcoll99]

[ QUOTE ]
Crimson said:
I wonder if Tokyopop would maybe consider re-releasing it if they get alot of complaints? I was willing to look past the retarded name change but now they're changing things inside the book so i'm definately not buying it.

So either Tokyopop will wise up and do a proper release or i'll have to settle with buying the Japanese books or just ignore this series.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, TP got lots of complaints about the hack-job on Initial D's manga and promised an un-edited, slang-free re-release. *Checks watch* Still waiting on that one...
That being said, I thought the artwork and character designs were gorgeous and enjoyed the overall story, but thought the dialogue was awful. I enjoy Giffen's work as well, but IMO, his best work was on DC's Justice League titles in the late 80's. It should be noted that he only plotted those stories, someone else did the actual dialogue!
And not being able to read Japanese, I'll go ahead ans swallow my pride every other month and pick up a title that proudly announces its presence to the retailer as *choke* "Battle Vixens." I think all that's missing is the prefix 'Quentin Tarantino Presents...' /images/graemlins/devil.gif

[witega]

[ QUOTE ]
martialstax said:
[ QUOTE ]
witega said:
Every time someone buys a Tokyopop edition of Battle Royale or Battle Vixens, you are telling Tokyopop that you approve of what they have done--and want them to do more.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, I haven't bought Battle Royale. To tell you the truth, the very concept of Battle Royale turns my stomach. I haven't read the book, and I haven't read any threads about the book. I had no idea Giffen wrote the script for either Battle Royale or Battle Vixens until I bought Battle Vixens last night. Even if I had known Giffen wrote the script for Battle Vixens, it wouldn't have stopped me. In fact, it would have been a selling point for me, since I've liked so much of Giffen's work. But know that I've read Battle Vixens, I can see Giffen's capable of crap work, too. Live and learn, I guess.

[/ QUOTE ]

I used the indefinite 'someone buys' because I was talking generally about every purchase of Battle Royale and Battle Vixens. Obviously, I didn't know whether you had bought Battle Royale or not. And I'll also admit my post may have been intemperate because I am actively upset. While Tokyopop made the initial decision to use Giffen, I blame the people who have kept buying Battle Royale for what has happened with Ikkitousen. And I blame those on this thread going 'oh well, I'll be buying it anyway' for the next hackjob we get.

[populuxe]

[ QUOTE ]
witega said:
And I'll also admit my post may have been intemperate because I am actively upset.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't worry, no offence was taken. And I'll admit I'm pretty upset, too. And I wasn't even all that big a fan of Ikkitousen. I hadn't read or seen any before I picked this up. I just knew it involved cute girls and fanservice. It's just that the excessive adaptation was so obvious, it got between me and the story. I just hate it when a writer thinks they have to "punch up" a story because they think it's too boring. Annette Roman's Dance 'Til Tomorrow and Sara Dyer's Kodocha are excellent examples of how a good adaptation brings you into the story, instead of placing itself between you and the story.

[Shiori]

Actually there are 7 Volumes of "Ikkitousen" out in Japan, the 7th was release on March 28th.

I read "Battle Vixens #1" over a month ago now and I'm still lamenting the purchase. As I have all the Japanese tankoubon released to this point owning "Battle Vixens" was only meant to suppliment my collection of "Ikkitousen" volumes but as it stands (and has already been pointed out) it is honestly not worth owning, borrowing or stealing so I won't be adding #2 to my bookshelf anytime soon.

Though my amusement to this day has yet to subside over the line "It's a cl*t, not a yardstick"... aharharhar! /images/graemlins/knowital.gif

Save your money for better English releases, is all I can say.

[Invisible Crane]

You know something surpirsed me with this.

I was reading some of it in a Forbidden Planet store and I was surprised to see that nudity was covered up (i.e the bathhouse part in the manga).

Why do so, I assumed in manga (especially those that are made into TV shows) you were able to do anything without having to worry about censorship constraints (unless the show based on a manga happens to be on satellite, i.e Mahoromatic), violence seems to be no problem (this is a fighting manga after all).

Or did TokyoPop censor it (even though it seems highly unlikely, I mean one little edit to any title and the whole forum would light up like a christmas tree)

[Njr Scrawl]

Keith Giffen again? Pass

I have some Defenders (Marvel), so will see if any are by him. Marvel is Comics Code though, so he would not have been allowed to use gutter vocabulary in their publications.

Battle Royale is bad enough. Perhaps KG has grown old (Defenders is an old title) & if he has little respect for Japanese titles, he might just stick in obscenities because that's what he thinks today's readers want, without caring about translation fineries.

[Invisible Crane]

[ QUOTE ]
Njr Scrawl said:
Keith Giffen again? Pass

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

[MalrocK]

[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
[ QUOTE ]
Njr Scrawl said:
Keith Giffen again? Pass

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

[/ QUOTE ]

he "adapted" and I use that word loosely, Ikkitousen (battle vixens) and Battle Royale

[Invisible Crane]

[ QUOTE ]
Malrock said:
[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
[ QUOTE ]
Njr Scrawl said:
Keith Giffen again? Pass

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

[/ QUOTE ]

he "adapted" and I use that word loosely, Ikkitousen (battle vixens) and Battle Royale

[/ QUOTE ]

He's that bad?

[Mazus]

[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
[ QUOTE ]
Malrock said:
[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
[ QUOTE ]
Njr Scrawl said:
Keith Giffen again? Pass

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

[/ QUOTE ]

he "adapted" and I use that word loosely, Ikkitousen (battle vixens) and Battle Royale

[/ QUOTE ]

He's that bad?

[/ QUOTE ]

Let's just say that I'm a very open-minded person when it comes to adaptions but, even I won't buy manga that's been adapted by Giffen.

[Invisible Crane]

[ QUOTE ]
Mazus said:


Let's just say that I'm a very open-minded person when it comes to adaptions but, even I won't buy manga that's been adapted by Giffen.

[/ QUOTE ]

What does he do that's so bad? (I know that sounds like a stupid question, but I'm not exactly a regular manga reader)

Edit by Kiril: Took out several levels of quotations that made this post difficult to read.

[Njr Scrawl]

TP seem to be using him for violent manga, then giving him free rein, like a certain animé studios giving bad dub ADR writers directors permission to ruin their series.

[populuxe]

[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
What does he do that's so bad? (I know that sounds like a stupid question, but I'm not exactly a regular manga reader)

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll just repost what gpn said in the very first post in this thread:

[ QUOTE ]
gpn said:
Text:
While the translation is probably decent, the writing in this volume is possibly the worst I have ever read in a manga. As a young lad reading comic books in the late 70's, I enjoyed Keith Giffen's Kirby-esque artwork on the Defenders. I had not seen much of his work since then, but any fond feelings I had towards him as a creative person have been completely abolished by the abyssmal script he produced here. He's decided to "spice up" the dialogue by making virtually every other word spoken by the characters a swear word. I'm no prude and have been known to do my fair share of swearing, but the sheer volume present in this script is absurd. The other problem is that the swearing is so clumsily written. Writers like David Mamet and Quentin Tarentino can make the use of foul-language an organic and natural sounding part of their characters and almost poetic at times, but it's use here seems more like a child who's just learned some new "bad" words and uses them without rhyme or reason to see the shocked faces of his parents. How out of place it seems is made more noticeable by the sections of plot exposition, which are swear-free and read pretty well; unfortunately these passages are few and far between. Much of the sexual oriented language seems out of place and unnecessary as well. Given this title's target audience in Japan, I have no doubt the original version contains swearing and sexual language, but I doubt very much it's to the ridiculous extent of what's seen here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm very forgiving of English adaptations, but I have to agree with everything gpn said. Giffen's adaptation sucks. It's a wall between the reader and the story, rather than a gateway into the story.

[wanfu2k1]

[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
What does he do that's so bad? (I know that sounds like a stupid question, but I'm not exactly a regular manga reader)


[/ QUOTE ]
Hmm..just read this thread over again and you will know. You can also cross reference this with the Battle royal thread a while back. Well I'm not sorry I bought the japanese tanks because they are a lot nicer than TP published GNs.

[wanfu2k1]

[ QUOTE ]
Njr Scrawl said:
TP seem to be using him for violent manga, then giving him free rein, like a certain animé studios giving bad dub ADR writers directors permission to ruin their series.

[/ QUOTE ]
Sorcerer stabber orphen comes to mind /images/graemlins/depresse.gif

[Invisible Crane]

[ QUOTE ]
wanfu2k1 said:
[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
What does he do that's so bad? (I know that sounds like a stupid question, but I'm not exactly a regular manga reader)


[/ QUOTE ]
Hmm..just read this thread over again and you will know. You can also cross reference this with the Battle royal thread a while back. Well I'm not sorry I bought the japanese tanks because they are a lot nicer than TP published GNs.

[/ QUOTE ]

Another quick question, what are these "tanks" you referred to?

[pete5883]

[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
Another quick question, what are these "tanks" you referred to?

[/ QUOTE ]

Tank is short for tankoboun (I probably spelled that wrong,) essentially the Japanese term for what we would call graphic novels.

[wanfu2k1]

[ QUOTE ]
pete5883 said:
[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
Another quick question, what are these "tanks" you referred to?

[/ QUOTE ]

Tank is short for tankoboun (I probably spelled that wrong,) essentially the Japanese term for what we would call graphic novels.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah what Pete5883 said /images/graemlins/happy.gif I'm too lazy to type it all out, which always gets me in trouble with some of the denizens in this forum /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Sapphire]

[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
Another quick question, what are these "tanks" you referred to?

[/ QUOTE ]

A totally moronic way of refering the Japanese collected volumes by incorrectly corrupting the Japanese word.

But pointing that out gets me in trouble.

Mariela

[Fencedude]

[ QUOTE ]
Sapphire said:
[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
Another quick question, what are these "tanks" you referred to?

[/ QUOTE ]

A totally moronic way of refering the Japanese collected volumes by incorrectly corrupting the Japanese word.

But pointing that out gets me in trouble.

Mariela

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey, they slaughter our language, don't we have the right to do it to theirs occasionally?

[Sapphire]

[ QUOTE ]
Fencedude said:
Hey, they slaughter our language, don't we have the right to do it to theirs occasionally?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, because you're also slaughtering English.

You should try to be better anyway.

Mariela

[Fencedude]

[ QUOTE ]
Sapphire said:
[ QUOTE ]
Fencedude said:
Hey, they slaughter our language, don't we have the right to do it to theirs occasionally?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, because you're also slaughtering English.

You should try to be better anyway.

Mariela

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd like to mention I've never used the term "tank" in that context.

[Sapphire]

[ QUOTE ]
Fencedude said:
I'd like to mention I've never used the term "tank" in that context.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sapphy-chan awards Fencedude a Gold Star. /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

Mariela the silly

[populuxe]

[ QUOTE ]
Sapphire said:
[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
Another quick question, what are these "tanks" you referred to?

[/ QUOTE ]

A totally moronic way of refering the Japanese collected volumes by incorrectly corrupting the Japanese word.

But pointing that out gets me in trouble.

Mariela

[/ QUOTE ]

I love you, Mariela. But I still say "tanks".

[Sapphire]

[ QUOTE ]
martialstax said:
I love you, Mariela. But I still say "tanks".

[/ QUOTE ]

You only claim to love me.

It's not true!!!

*sobs*

Mariela

[populuxe]

[ QUOTE ]
Sapphire said:
[ QUOTE ]
martialstax said:
I love you, Mariela. But I still say "tanks".

[/ QUOTE ]

You only claim to love me.

It's not true!!!

*sobs*

Mariela

[/ QUOTE ]

In the words of the Comics Shop Guy from the Simpsons, "Don't try to change me, baby."

[wanfu2k1]

[ QUOTE ]
Sapphire said:
[ QUOTE ]
GrantM said:
Another quick question, what are these "tanks" you referred to?

[/ QUOTE ]

A totally moronic way of refering the Japanese collected volumes by incorrectly corrupting the Japanese word.

But pointing that out gets me in trouble.

Mariela

[/ QUOTE ]
I claim it's a abbreviation /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[kabael]

Ah well, 'cause I'm a doof and didn't see a thread about it on the main page, I posted my thoughts here (http://forums.animeondvd.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=483049&page=0&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=7&fpart=1) after finally breaking down and buying the first volume. Too bad I'm the only one who really enjoyed it.

Now I've been avoiding Battle Royale because of the art and the first chapter (I loved both the book and the movie, though for different reasons), so I don't know how that's been handled, but I have to say that with Battle Vixens the re-write turned what would have been a boring and pretty average manga into a pretty damn fan piece of trash entertainment.

The dialogue seemed to flow pretty fine to me. Aside from repeated use of "popping a rod", I know plenty of people who talk pretty much just like that, at least as far as the swearing goes.

And I did see some of the anime and I'm familiar with the basic idea behind Ikkitousen, so maybe the lack of a clear explanation didn't bother me. Plot is absolutely not this manga's strength, though, by any stretch of the imagination, so I'm not sure it lost much. Exposition would have dramatically slowed it down and sticking faithfully to the original sounds like it would have pretty much ruined most of its fun, I think. It's the dialogue that makes this more than just girls fighting in their panties.

It's unfortunate that it couldn't remain true to the original, I think, partly because I certainly don't want to support the idea that importing companies can or should change things to suit their whim or taste (and because it's a shame that the original wasn't better), but in this case it worked, I think.

Editing/changing is not inherently bad or evil (there's a reason that work goes through an editing process before release), but I certainly wouldn't trust most anime/manga companies do to it. This time the end result is better than it would have been, but there are far more cases what the opposite (or worse) has happened, and as a general rule "no edits" is definitely best.

(speaking of which, could anyone who knows post just a few sample translations of original lines? I'm curious to see how different it is and how much was lost)