Tenjho Tenge and Ikki Tousen

[scorsesefan]

What's the common opinion on these two shows? Saw the trailers on my Gungrave discs, and seeing as how I was a big fan of the Tekken and Fatal Fury movie way back in the day, they looked to be right up my alley. Thoughts?

[Captain Impulse]

Tenjho Tenge is the superior of the two in my opinion. Both are fight shows with a heavy dose of boobies, but TenTen is better animated and has a storyline that's easier and more entertaining to follow. However in terms of actual raw fanservice, Ikki-Tousen wins out over it, so it depends on what you're looking for.

[Rhodes]

tenten's anime story is based on the manga... but it has its share of "rewrites" and even after you watch the entire tv series and the ova eps... it fails to deliver the "story" since it leaves you hanging. hardly a better story since there is no more tenten anime in any form to finish it off.

Ikki is also based on its manga but has an original finish for the show to tie things up. It's ending is open ended in that they can do a sequal, but the storyline that is presented does come to a close.

both shows has some pretty hot babes in em... however tenten has way more bishi guys. the guys in ikki sort of get shafted.

both shows are over the top when it comes to the martial arts they use... more fantasy than reality although ikki is a bit more passible for real. both shows has folks die... however for tenten all the dying is during the flash back. ikki has current chars who play an important role bite the bullet.

watching both shows, the dub for ikki is better than the dub for tenten. i prefer the opening for ikki way more and the ending is just a bit better as well. also ikki is the shorter of the 2 series so less impact on your $ if your buying or renting.

I enjoy both but have to say ikki is much more worth it than tenten.

[touma]

I am not a fan of fighting shows, but I do like Ikki Tousen. I recently finished watching it for the second time.
If you want a lot of panty shots and booby bombs, including nipples, mixed with a liberal amount of blood, but no guts, flying around then Ikki should work for you.
There is also a lot of comedy, which was my second favorite part of the show after the fan service.
The R1 release has some nice extras, but I think that most of them are for dub fans.
If you want a serious, realistic martial arts show you might not be happy with Ikki Tousen.

I saw only the first disk of Tenjho Tenge. After four episodes I felt like I was watching Ikki Tousen again. So, instead of spending more money I did just watch Ikki Tousen again.

To put things in perspective for you: The only other "fighting" show that I really enjoyed was Real Bout High School. Yes, I am serious. /images/graemlins/sweat200.gif

They suck. Both modestly fun. Both poorly written. I like shonen, and you've be infinitely better off watching any Narutos, Bleachs, and Yu Yu Hakushos you come across. Those shows are infinitely better and infinitely better written.

I at least had a little fun and made it through Ikki. Tenge, I knew had a pretty bad story having read bits and pieces of the manga. So I went in at least hoping that the animation was good because to be perfectly modest, the charater designs are kick ass. But the animation wasn't. They took a lot of shortcuts. The first actual fight (Nagi's one on one with whom I won't spoil), was far and away the most nicely animated of the entire show. After that, every fight was filled with animation shortcuts. Even the original Dragon Balls fights were more fluid. It was pretty bad. Ikki had more meat to its fights (in more ways than one with the blatant fanservice), but were still far from special. Some of the holds would make for neat sexual positions. Some were even used for sexual positions. But as for fighting, not so much.

If you absolutely have to go with one, go with Ikki. In manga forms, Ikki's actually the blatant rip of Tenge, and Tenge looks far superior. But in terms of the anime, Ikki was actually the more polished product. Tenge's theme song is catchy, but its the preview, so watch its preview on Gungrave to your heart's content and move on.

[Speedy Boris]

[ QUOTE ]
Hot Otak said:
If you absolutely have to go with one, go with Ikki. In manga forms, Ikki's actually the blatant rip of Tenge, and Tenge looks far superior.

[/ QUOTE ] But the CMX manga isn't the 'true' version what will all the editing, so as far as U.S. manga is concerned, I'd dare say Battle Vixens (Ikki Tousen) wins out.

As for the anime, I've never seen Tenjo Tenge but I enjoyed Ikki Tousen. It's not top ten material but the action, comedy, memorable characters, and fanservice are all quite good, even if many of its fight scenes just consist of a series of well-drawn still poses with action lines. Great OP and ED, too (and believe me, it's rare for me to like BOTH an OP and ED; usually I like one and hate the other).

Also, Tenjo Tenge is kind of a rip-off in R1, what with being strung out over 8 discs when it could've EASILY been done in six.

[balthier2012]

IkkiTousen bored the SHIT out of me. The ONLY thing it has going for it is ridiculously obvious fanservice shots. It's completely apparent characters go out of their way involuntarily for a fanservice shot. The story well it's about as entertaining, or predictable as watching paint dry on a fucking wall!

Tenjho Tenge, well I'm loving it so far. Two badass concieted punks enter another one of the highschools on their list to conquer. (Basically they go to new schools and fight everyone to show they're the strongest) And at this school things are different. Everyone's a fighter and stronger. So imagine two guys who thought they were the strongest fighters (due to conquering dozens of schools) only to have their hopes and mentality crushed.

[Herufaiya]

[ QUOTE ]
Hot Otak said:
Also, Tenjo Tenge is kind of a rip-off in R1, what with being strung out over 8 discs when it could've EASILY been done in six.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, because Geneon does so many 6-DVD releases for 26 episode series. Ignoring TPs(I've never seen how Gen' does those), name a Geneon release(Ippo excluded due to its length) that has more than 4 episodes on it. If Bandai had done this release, then yeah, 6 DVDs would be expected, but who besides them? 8 DVDs was the basic traidition back in the hayday(Eva, Trigun, Gasaraki), and 7 has barely become standard, as a payback sort of cost to us, some series well under 26 can still hit the 7 mark, and let's not forget the issues involving 13 episode series to this day(though ADV has been trying to do better, let us never forget Generator Gawl).
There is one possible reason and one almost definite reason for Geneon's treatment of TT, 1) They want as many sales as they can to possibly justify producing another season and 2) The Japanese release(for the main series) was eight DVDs, if they did seven, they'd have to find someway to give us the extra coverart, it's far easier to call it an excuse to appease cover art fans by retaining an 8 volume release than it is to not.
None of these may be a reasonable excuse, bu you're asking of Geneon something for which there is no precedent, there wouldn't be a precedent for ADV, nor CPM, nor Viz, 6 DVDs just isn't standard for 26 episode releases.

[chotto]

Two of my favorites. Hardcore fighting, fanservice, and humor. The first disk of either show should give you a good idea of whether you would like the rest of the series. There was a boxset for Ikki, but I don't know if it was limited though.

[Puppet Master]

Tenjho Tenges pretty good despite the ending. I personally found it quite entertaining. The first disc gives you a good idea of what to expect but there is only one thing it fades out of the main story and goes into the past. But even than it's entertaining so despite it's 8 disc release it's worth the $.

[chotto]

[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:The first disc gives you a good idea of what to expect but there is only one thing it fades out of the main story and goes into the past.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's a good point, I'm watching it as it's being released and it was a fairly abrupt change. I think all the first three disks were in the present, so you do get some time before it switches. But it goes back eventually.

[AbeChinchilla]

[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:
Tenjho Tenges pretty good despite the ending. I personally found it quite entertaining. The first disc gives you a good idea of what to expect but there is only one thing it fades out of the main story and goes into the past. But even than it's entertaining so despite it's 8 disc release it's worth the $.

[/ QUOTE ]

The going-back-into-the-past thing is cool, but I really hope it ends in volume 5... because yeah... it's almost an entirely new show now.

[Speedy Boris]

[ QUOTE ]
Herufaiya said:
[ QUOTE ]
Hot Otak said:
Also, Tenjo Tenge is kind of a rip-off in R1, what with being strung out over 8 discs when it could've EASILY been done in six.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, because Geneon does so many 6-DVD releases for 26 episode series. Ignoring TPs(I've never seen how Gen' does those), name a Geneon release(Ippo excluded due to its length) that has more than 4 episodes on it. If Bandai had done this release, then yeah, 6 DVDs would be expected, but who besides them? 8 DVDs was the basic traidition back in the hayday(Eva, Trigun, Gasaraki), and 7 has barely become standard, as a payback sort of cost to us, some series well under 26 can still hit the 7 mark, and let's not forget the issues involving 13 episode series to this day(though ADV has been trying to do better, let us never forget Generator Gawl).
There is one possible reason and one almost definite reason for Geneon's treatment of TT, 1) They want as many sales as they can to possibly justify producing another season and 2) The Japanese release(for the main series) was eight DVDs, if they did seven, they'd have to find someway to give us the extra coverart, it's far easier to call it an excuse to appease cover art fans by retaining an 8 volume release than it is to not.
None of these may be a reasonable excuse, bu you're asking of Geneon something for which there is no precedent, there wouldn't be a precedent for ADV, nor CPM, nor Viz, 6 DVDs just isn't standard for 26 episode releases.

[/ QUOTE ] While not a Geneon series, Fruits Basket was 26 episodes and done in 4 discs, so it's very possible.

[kusanagi-sama]

[ QUOTE ]
Herufaiya said:
[ QUOTE ]
Hot Otak said:
Also, Tenjo Tenge is kind of a rip-off in R1, what with being strung out over 8 discs when it could've EASILY been done in six.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, because Geneon does so many 6-DVD releases for 26 episode series. Ignoring TPs(I've never seen how Gen' does those), name a Geneon release(Ippo excluded due to its length) that has more than 4 episodes on it. If Bandai had done this release, then yeah, 6 DVDs would be expected, but who besides them? 8 DVDs was the basic traidition back in the hayday(Eva, Trigun, Gasaraki), and 7 has barely become standard, as a payback sort of cost to us, some series well under 26 can still hit the 7 mark, and let's not forget the issues involving 13 episode series to this day(though ADV has been trying to do better, let us never forget Generator Gawl).
There is one possible reason and one almost definite reason for Geneon's treatment of TT, 1) They want as many sales as they can to possibly justify producing another season and 2) The Japanese release(for the main series) was eight DVDs, if they did seven, they'd have to find someway to give us the extra coverart, it's far easier to call it an excuse to appease cover art fans by retaining an 8 volume release than it is to not.
None of these may be a reasonable excuse, bu you're asking of Geneon something for which there is no precedent, there wouldn't be a precedent for ADV, nor CPM, nor Viz, 6 DVDs just isn't standard for 26 episode releases.

[/ QUOTE ]

Geneon's Thinpaks are the same discs as the originals, with the exception of sometimes new art (Last Exile), or double thinpak cases with a soundtrack (Chobits and Mahoromatic)

[Herufaiya]

[ QUOTE ]
Speedy Boris said:
[ QUOTE ]
Herufaiya said:
[ QUOTE ]
Hot Otak said:
Also, Tenjo Tenge is kind of a rip-off in R1, what with being strung out over 8 discs when it could've EASILY been done in six.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, because Geneon does so many 6-DVD releases for 26 episode series. Ignoring TPs(I've never seen how Gen' does those), name a Geneon release(Ippo excluded due to its length) that has more than 4 episodes on it. If Bandai had done this release, then yeah, 6 DVDs would be expected, but who besides them? 8 DVDs was the basic traidition back in the hayday(Eva, Trigun, Gasaraki), and 7 has barely become standard, as a payback sort of cost to us, some series well under 26 can still hit the 7 mark, and let's not forget the issues involving 13 episode series to this day(though ADV has been trying to do better, let us never forget Generator Gawl).
There is one possible reason and one almost definite reason for Geneon's treatment of TT, 1) They want as many sales as they can to possibly justify producing another season and 2) The Japanese release(for the main series) was eight DVDs, if they did seven, they'd have to find someway to give us the extra coverart, it's far easier to call it an excuse to appease cover art fans by retaining an 8 volume release than it is to not.
None of these may be a reasonable excuse, bu you're asking of Geneon something for which there is no precedent, there wouldn't be a precedent for ADV, nor CPM, nor Viz, 6 DVDs just isn't standard for 26 episode releases.

[/ QUOTE ] While not a Geneon series, Fruits Basket was 26 episodes and done in 4 discs, so it's very possible.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's part of the reason I didn't accuse Funi...my point is, there's not a lot of precedent, certainly not in Geneon(not a bash).
Oh, I forgot to mention a CPM example, Votoms is 13 on 2 discs, though this is likely due to the age of the show and the fact that most of the extras for the individual releases are on the first set(ep 1-3 commentary and a ROM file). Though, in this case softsubs for Votoms was far more than I expected out of this LE, so...there.
Also, thanks kusanagi-sama for the fill-in.

And...
[ QUOTE ]
AbeChinchilla said:
[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:
Tenjho Tenges pretty good despite the ending. I personally found it quite entertaining. The first disc gives you a good idea of what to expect but there is only one thing it fades out of the main story and goes into the past. But even than it's entertaining so despite it's 8 disc release it's worth the $.

[/ QUOTE ]

The going-back-into-the-past thing is cool, but I really hope it ends in volume 5... because yeah... it's almost an entirely new show now.

[/ QUOTE ]

<span style='color:#dddddd;background:#dddddd'>It doesn't, they go back to the past for three-or-so episodes, then stay in the past until the middle of ep24, then it's present through the end.</span>
But hey, I like the past storyline way more than the present, richer characters, more drama, more intrigue, less stererotypes and cliches. Though, as I've noted in the past, those who like the present storyline really get to feel the pain for this series, but I think this way everyone who enjoys it gets at least half a show that they actually want. Me, I still love both.

[pianocello]

IkkiTousen has lesbians and nipples. /images/graemlins/noseblef.gif
Tenjou Tenge has lots of annoying characters and a story that goes nowhere.

The choice should be obvious. /images/graemlins/catgirl0.gif

Oh wait, forgot to mention that Ikkitousen has a very satisfying ending.

[rainking187]

[ QUOTE ]
Balthier said:
IkkiTousen bored the SHIT out of me. The ONLY thing it has going for it is ridiculously obvious fanservice shots. It's completely apparent characters go out of their way involuntarily for a fanservice shot. The story well it's about as entertaining, or predictable as watching paint dry on a fucking wall!

[/ QUOTE ]

I have to agree with this entirely. Ikkitousen blows. Hard.

[Fencedude]

[ QUOTE ]
rainking187 said:
[ QUOTE ]
Balthier said:
IkkiTousen bored the SHIT out of me. The ONLY thing it has going for it is ridiculously obvious fanservice shots. It's completely apparent characters go out of their way involuntarily for a fanservice shot. The story well it's about as entertaining, or predictable as watching paint dry on a fucking wall!

[/ QUOTE ]

I have to agree with this entirely. Ikkitousen blows. Hard.

[/ QUOTE ]

Both blow pretty hard.

[Herufaiya]

[ QUOTE ]
piano_cello_conducting said:
IkkiTousen has lesbians and nipples. /images/graemlins/noseblef.gif
Tenjou Tenge has lots of annoying characters and a story that goes nowhere.

The choice should be obvious. /images/graemlins/catgirl0.gif

Oh wait, forgot to mention that Ikkitousen has a very satisfying ending.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Goes nowhere" and "satisfying ending" are just your opinions, though, so please don't treat them as fact. For example, while it is true that Tenge's story ends unfinished(the logistics of which I won't bog down this post with), there are numerous emotional revelations that take the place of narrative one's, as with any unfinished show, a trait you'll see in Berserk, Narutaru, 3x3 Eyes, Hellsing, and so on. "Nowhere" is far too strong a word in a genre where everyone, in the end, is left to find their own ending.

[Speedy Boris]

Ikki Tousen is definitely a "either you love it or hate it" show. I lean more towards the "love" camp (wouldn't go THAT far, but I liked it), but truth be told, the show would've been rather bland if it hadn't incorporated the blatant sexuality and humor. Those two factors really make the show stand out from the pack of "school fighting" animes, IMO.

A little off-topic, but does anyone know when Vol. 9 of Battle Vixens is getting released? Nothing is listed on Tokyopop's website and it seems to be in limbo or something.

[pianocello]

[ QUOTE ]
Herufaiya said:
[ QUOTE ]
piano_cello_conducting said:
IkkiTousen has lesbians and nipples. /images/graemlins/noseblef.gif
Tenjou Tenge has lots of annoying characters and a story that goes nowhere.

The choice should be obvious. /images/graemlins/catgirl0.gif

Oh wait, forgot to mention that Ikkitousen has a very satisfying ending.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Goes nowhere" and "satisfying ending" are just your opinions, though, so please don't treat them as fact. For example, while it is true that Tenge's story ends unfinished(the logistics of which I won't bog down this post with), there are numerous emotional revelations that take the place of narrative one's, as with any unfinished show, a trait you'll see in Berserk, Narutaru, 3x3 Eyes, Hellsing, and so on. "Nowhere" is far too strong a word in a genre where everyone, in the end, is left to find their own ending.

[/ QUOTE ]

No offense but to put Tenjou Tenge in the same league as Berserk, Narutaru, 3x3 Eyes, Hellsing is really pushing it. TT sucks. Really bad. I think I made a long post in one of the previous threads detailing all its flaws before.

[TuxedoFred]

Ikkitousen has Kikuko Inoue as Hakufu's mother and I'm pretty sure that at some point she says "Ara ara!", so, there you go.

[darkhunter]

[ QUOTE ]
Herufaiya said:
If Bandai had done this release, then yeah, 6 DVDs would be expected, but who besides them? 8 DVDs was the basic traidition back in the hayday(Eva, Trigun, Gasaraki), and 7 has barely become standard, as a payback sort of cost to us, some series well under 26 can still hit the 7 mark, and let's not forget the issues involving 13 episode series to this day(though ADV has been trying to do better, let us never forget Generator Gawl).


[/ QUOTE ]

Media Blaster always had a good disc count on their releases:
Berserk: 6 Disc
Otogi Zoshi: 6 Disc
Shura no Toki: 6 Disc
and so on.

[scorsesefan]

Wow, it's funny, but this is the first time I've seen opinions split so far down the middle when I asked for a reccommendation. Ikki Tousen has won out though, seeing as how it's only four discs, has lesbians, and doesn't shy away from actually drawing nipples! At least, according to one of you guys.

TT is something I'll have to think a little more about. Unfinished endings don't really bother me that much for some reason. (My initial reactions to Eva aside.) Hmmm..I may invest in this one further down the road. Thanks guys.

[Herufaiya]

[ QUOTE ]
piano_cello_conducting said:
[ QUOTE ]
Herufaiya said:
[ QUOTE ]
piano_cello_conducting said:
IkkiTousen has lesbians and nipples. /images/graemlins/noseblef.gif
Tenjou Tenge has lots of annoying characters and a story that goes nowhere.

The choice should be obvious. /images/graemlins/catgirl0.gif

Oh wait, forgot to mention that Ikkitousen has a very satisfying ending.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Goes nowhere" and "satisfying ending" are just your opinions, though, so please don't treat them as fact. For example, while it is true that Tenge's story ends unfinished(the logistics of which I won't bog down this post with), there are numerous emotional revelations that take the place of narrative one's, as with any unfinished show, a trait you'll see in Berserk, Narutaru, 3x3 Eyes, Hellsing, and so on. "Nowhere" is far too strong a word in a genre where everyone, in the end, is left to find their own ending.

[/ QUOTE ]

No offense but to put Tenjou Tenge in the same league as Berserk, Narutaru, 3x3 Eyes, Hellsing is really pushing it. TT sucks. Really bad. I think I made a long post in one of the previous threads detailing all its flaws before.

[/ QUOTE ]
Once again, your opinion, not fact, please stop treating it any other way, any show "sucking" is not a universal fact, and it is not information you can prove beyond any other perspective than your own. For instance, you could say you hate the character designs and overall animation quality because it doesn't match the original manga enough(as you'd like) and the CG frames are not flowing. However, how one person sees the character design transfer is a variable, so, for the CG animation I'd say it didn't bother me so much as the fight scenes were still communicated well and the drama flowed as equitably, and, were I draw a basis for comparison, I could at least say that it wasn't "as bad" as Kaze no Yojimbo or Gungrave in the area of character movement.
But this is all just how I perceive it, no more, no less, you don't perceive "any better" than another human being as far as the arena of "what it is you like" is concerned.
And yes darkhunter, MB has been good, but MB and Funi still don't control enough of the market, my main point was about established trends in companies like ADV and Geneon, and growing one's in those like Viz.
And yes, I realize the topic's point has now ended, being that it's progenitor has made his decision.
SkullLeaderOne, I wish you the highest enjoyment in your decision, no one deserves to pay for an anime they don't enjoy, and I'm glad you chose to find your answers here.

[Fencedude]

[ QUOTE ]
SkullLeaderOne said:
Wow, it's funny, but this is the first time I've seen opinions split so far down the middle when I asked for a reccommendation. Ikki Tousen has won out though, seeing as how it's only four discs, has lesbians, and doesn't shy away from actually drawing nipples! At least, according to one of you guys.

TT is something I'll have to think a little more about. Unfinished endings don't really bother me that much for some reason. (My initial reactions to Eva aside.) Hmmm..I may invest in this one further down the road. Thanks guys.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really suggest you find something better to spend your money on.

Really.

Its for your own good.

[chloes_fork]

[ QUOTE ]
Fencedude said:
I really suggest you find something better to spend your money on.

Really.

Its for your own good.

[/ QUOTE ]
I tried that with Godannar. He didn't listen, plus it turned out he loved the thing. What can you do? /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

But yeah, Ikki Tousen is another "one volume was one too many" kind of show.

[touma]

[ QUOTE ]
chloes_fork said:
But yeah, Ikki Tousen is another "one volume was one too many" kind of show.

[/ QUOTE ]
For you.
For me it was a "four volumes is not enough" kind of show.

[pianocello]

[ QUOTE ]
Touma said:
[ QUOTE ]
chloes_fork said:
But yeah, Ikki Tousen is another "one volume was one too many" kind of show.

[/ QUOTE ]
For you.
For me it was a "four volumes is not enough" kind of show.

[/ QUOTE ]
Of course. We need an extra volume for the yuri alone!

[Captain Impulse]

Once again, libido wins out over common sense. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Speedy Boris]

[ QUOTE ]
Captain Impulse said:
Once again, libido wins out over common sense. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ] Also because the manga ran longer and had more characters than the anime, which would've been cool to see how they might have been incorporated, had it went longer.

[chotto]

[ QUOTE ]
Touma said:For me it was a "four volumes is not enough" kind of show.

[/ QUOTE ]

I second this motion, why isn't a second season in production?

[Speedy Boris]

You never know, J.C. Staff may make a Battle Club adaption, seeing as how it's the same manga creator for both that and Ikki.

[chotto]

I saw a small write up in the latest NewType about Battle Club and I'd be happy with that for sure.