A fickle fandom..

[Lego]

A while back I made a thread asking about good and bad experiences that fellow posters have experienced being a anime fan. While that was a interesting thread, most of it came from the "outside world", and not inside the "fandom" itself. I've been wanting to make a thread like this for a while, as I've been interested in what different types of anime fans think about anime fandom in general. Feel free to list as many as you want, and to elaborate.

The Good
The community - This is the one thing that I love about being a anime fan. We may disagree on what shows are good, what characters are the best, or even what to buy, but in the end we're all anime fans. From this forum to places like conventions and IRC, you get a feeling that you belong to a community. Discussing shows, manga, or just news with fellow anime fans(especially here) opens up your mind to new views, or new things.

Diversity - People from all walks of life, religion, and race like anime. I could be watching the same show someone in Italy is watching, and come to a completely different conclusion than them. I also like the diversity in the anime market as well. Shows give off a unique feel(most of the time), and you usually don't see many carbon copies of other shows.

The companies - Now I know that people might not like certain R1 companies, or even certain Japanese companies. But for as long as I've been a anime fan, I've always liked how close some companies feel. We have ADV, Geneon, Bandai, Media Blasters, CPM, and other companies posting here through reps. People like DLW of ADV kid around, chat back to posters, and so on. We even get to chat with voice actors and ADR directors.



The Bad
Certain types of fans - While I'm generally a easy going guy(not a lot bothers me), we've all run into certain types of fans that are either creepy, elitists to the highest degree, or just plain annoying. I've seen certain fans that are obsessed with things like lolicon, hentai, or just fanservice in general. While being into fanservice isn't a bad thing, most of you know what I mean. Then you have people who are elitists. I realize that we all become elitists sometimes, but I'm refering to people who don't buy DVD's because they "fund dubs", or hate R1 companies because they "ruin the show".

As for the annoying, we see it every day heh. I mean sometimes you can see why people either hate anime fans, or anime itself when you have two high schoolers wearing anime shirts talking about how "kawaii" a female character is in the middle of a mall or video game store. Or people who will make countless threads/topics along the lines of "Zomg DBZ is great", or my favorite "zomg which character/music/series/scene is the best" over, and over, and over.

The perception - Usually this doesn't bother me at all. But from recent articles in the US, Canada, and Japan, one would think that we were some fringe group of society that only comes out for food and water(hey, wait a minute..). Although with the popularity of manga, and more mainstream movies using anime and manga as influences(Kill Bill), I think attitudes will slowly change.

Those are just some for starters, as I could go on and on.

[DanielJr]

The Good
+It's something new and worth a chat with people you've never met.
+It's a growing community.
+It's fun with or without friends.

The Bad
-Sub vs Dub "Discussions"
-Strongly opinionated fans
-Newbies dissin' the classics
-Vets dissin' the new school
-Every thread that starts with an argument always ends up with someone looking up a word on dictionary.com. Seriously.
-I hate to say it... but... Eva fanboys. They are the embodiment of all these.

[Speedy Boris]

I'm not a fan of cosplay at all. If I were ever to go to an anime con, I want to dress (and act) like myself, not a character from a fictional universe.

[Fencedude]

[ QUOTE ]
Speedy Boris said:
I'm not a fan of cosplay at all. If I were ever to go to an anime con, I want to dress (and act) like myself, not a character from a fictional universe.

[/ QUOTE ]

Gah?

What does THAT have to do with anything?

[Puppet Master]

The Good

- I don't know at the moment/images/graemlins/sweat000.gif

The Extremely Bad

Eva Fanboys nuff said
- People who constantly try to push their views of a seires on others for one reason or another or come up with some lame reason to hate it(I've seen some pretty bad ones from anime fans).
- One track minded fans aka fanboys in general

[Speedy Boris]

[ QUOTE ]
Fencedude said:

Gah?

What does THAT have to do with anything?

[/ QUOTE ] It's something I don't like about the fandom. But hey, if people are into it, go right ahead. I'm not going to stop you.

[Puppet Master]

[ QUOTE ]
Speedy Boris said:
I'm not a fan of cosplay at all. If I were ever to go to an anime con, I want to dress (and act) like myself, not a character from a fictional universe.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's one thing I forgot about I will never understand why people do that and quite frankly I doubt I want to know.

[musouka]

[ QUOTE ]
Speedy Boris said:
I'm not a fan of cosplay at all. If I were ever to go to an anime con, I want to dress (and act) like myself, not a character from a fictional universe.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:
That's one thing I forgot about I will never understand why people do that and quite frankly I doubt I want to know.

[/ QUOTE ]

Woo, way to judge other people's hobbies. I used to think cosplay was stupid too, until I went to a convention and saw it in action. It was actually one of the highlights.

[Speedy Boris]

OK, I definitely should've worded my initial comment better, and I can see how that would piss people off. I apologize. Here's what I SHOULD have said:

I don't have a problem with people who make costumes of their favorite characters. That's a perfectly fine hobby and I'm sure those who do it find a sense of fulfillment with creating clothes, especially of their favorite characters.

Here's what I DON'T like about it: Those who pretend to BE the character, including talking like them, walking like them, everything. That just creeps me out. If I went to a con with someone who wouldn't break character of acting like Inu-Yasha, that'd get REALLY old, and fast.

Also, let's face it, some people should be banned from dressing in tight cosplay outfits. Like, say, Man Faye. Yeah.

Anyway, I apologize for getting this off-topic, especially since I didn't really explain myself earlier.

[railohio]

[ QUOTE ]
Speedy Boris said:
I'm not a fan of cosplay at all. If I were ever to go to an anime con, I want to dress (and act) like myself, not a character from a fictional universe.

[/ QUOTE ]

Gaaa! You dissin' my hobby? I love to dress up as my favorite character, "railohio," from my favorite show called "Reality." He's soooo cool! He shots a giant Nikon, sports all the latest fashion from Eddie Bauer, and works with numerous national magazines! Honestly, who wouldn't want to live that life?

Err... Yeah, I totally don't get that either but to each his own. No doubt there's some Canon fanatic out there waiting to pounce on my love for Nikon, but as I said, to each his own. Now we return you to your regularly scheduled thread already in progress...

[Puppet Master]

[ QUOTE ]
musouka said:
[ QUOTE ]
Speedy Boris said:
I'm not a fan of cosplay at all. If I were ever to go to an anime con, I want to dress (and act) like myself, not a character from a fictional universe.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:
That's one thing I forgot about I will never understand why people do that and quite frankly I doubt I want to know.

[/ QUOTE ]

Woo, way to judge other people's hobbies. I used to think cosplay was stupid too, until I went to a convention and saw it in action. It was actually one of the highlights.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think it's pointless but to be honest if people want to do it they can. I really don't care I just don't see why people would want to put the money into it. I've heard all about the people who literally try to act and well when the idea of that's kinda creepy.

If it was my intention to "judge" other peoples hobbies it would be quite obvious though. But I do realize im not what people would exactly call "clear"./images/graemlins/stunned0.gif

I'm just happy I haven't ever had to see even an image of the horror that people keep bringing up this man faye thing.

I have never been to any conventions or anything of that sort and I don't really know much about them so I can't really comment on that. If someone wants to say why they do it I believe it could be an interesting thing to know.

[musouka]

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Puppet Master said:
If someone wants to say why they do it I believe it could be an interesting thing to know.

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, because they think it's fun? Just a guess.

[rainking187]

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Puppet Master said:I'm just happy I haven't ever had to see even an image of the horror that people keep bringing up this man faye thing.

[/ QUOTE ]

I bet you'll see it soon, now that you've said that. Someone will post a link that says it goes to something else, the BAM! Man Faye.

That being said, I only have one character that I want to cosplay as, and that's James Sunderland from Silent Hill 2. If you don't know who he is, there's a picture of him here. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/Rainking187/silenthill.jpg) I'd take like a thin piece of PVC pipe and paint it grey, because the pipe is probably the only weapon I could actually make. Most other characters I wouldn't cosplay as, because they tend to have very colorful costumes and I don't like all the attention they would get me. Dressing up as James you probably wouldn't be able to tell I was in a costume at all.

[Scaramanga]

I can only think of one bad. The tendancy of anime fans to be judgemental, especially of each other. I find it ironic that members of what is already a fringe group, find it necessary to denigrate other people within their OWN hobby (as evinced within this very thread.) Sure there are fans that aren't necessarily the epitome of "cool" (whatever that might be,) but I find that's true no matter WHERE you go. I just figure that people who are so often set upon, ostracized, and assumed to be fans of "those kiddie cartoons" or "cartoon porn", would be just a little more accepting of other people's foibles.

Otherwise, I love the fandom by and large. Where else can you find such a diverse bunch of people of all ages who love the same thing? Well you know, besides other fandoms. /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

EDIT: rainking, that's pretty awesome. /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

[cairber]

The Good:
-Meeting new people
-clubs and outtings
-cons
-swapping and sharing deals
-marathons
-good debates about series (not childish name calling debates)

The Bad:
-When you meet those people who won't talk about anything else...you try to steer the convo to get deeper into who they are and they keep bringing it back to anime
-childish debates about series
-being judged for watching anime
-the price /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

[Puppet Master]

[ QUOTE ]
rainking said:
[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:I'm just happy I haven't ever had to see even an image of the horror that people keep bringing up this man faye thing.

[/ QUOTE ]

I bet you'll see it soon, now that you've said that. Someone will post a link that says it goes to something else, the BAM! Man Faye.

That being said, I only have one character that I want to cosplay as, and that's James Sunderland from Silent Hill 2. If you don't know who he is, there's a picture of him here. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/Rainking187/silenthill.jpg) I'd take like a thin piece of PVC pipe and paint it grey, because the pipe is probably the only weapon I could actually make. Most other characters I wouldn't cosplay as, because they tend to have very colorful costumes and I don't like all the attention they would get me. Dressing up as James you probably wouldn't be able to tell I was in a costume at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess it's a good thing that I really don't click the posted links.

[rainking187]

[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:
[ QUOTE ]
rainking said:
[ QUOTE ]
Puppet Master said:I'm just happy I haven't ever had to see even an image of the horror that people keep bringing up this man faye thing.

[/ QUOTE ]

I bet you'll see it soon, now that you've said that. Someone will post a link that says it goes to something else, the BAM! Man Faye.

That being said, I only have one character that I want to cosplay as, and that's James Sunderland from Silent Hill 2. If you don't know who he is, there's a picture of him here. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/Rainking187/silenthill.jpg) I'd take like a thin piece of PVC pipe and paint it grey, because the pipe is probably the only weapon I could actually make. Most other characters I wouldn't cosplay as, because they tend to have very colorful costumes and I don't like all the attention they would get me. Dressing up as James you probably wouldn't be able to tell I was in a costume at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess it's a good thing that I really don't click the posted links.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well that's no fun.

[leongsh]

The fandom? I'm too pessimistic about the fandom. Anyway, here goes...

The Good:
- Diversity
- *goes back to scraping the barrel hoping to find something good*

The Bad:
- rabid fans (Eva fans, Elfen Lied fans, Naruto fans, etc)
- blinkered fans (blinkered in terms of genre/type variety)
- people who criticise or won't watch old anime just because it is old
- people who criticise or won't watch anime because it has old school-type art and designs
- people who concentrate too much on packaging at the expense of the show (the draw of it is the show, dammit!)
- people who write-off shows after 1 episode
- people who believe they have a right to free anime

Bah! I could go on for another few more lines on the bad part. I'll just stop here.

[aleczman]

Hmm, opinion on fandom, eh? Let's see here... let's go with one and one:

Good:
- When they really want to, they can accomplish great things: clubs, cons, etc.

Bad:
- I've been a fan for many years now and the thing that never ceases to amaze me is the hate that many fans have for anime they don't like or understand. To the point of trying to get other people [who happen to enjoy said anime] hate it too. I used to get annoyed and upset but, through the years I've learned to let it "in one ear and out the other." My sanity thanks me for it. /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

Personally, I liked fandom better the way it was many, many years ago! ... (back in the 90s /images/graemlins/tongue.gif)

And stay off my lawn.

[Lego]

[ QUOTE ]
Bad:
- I've been a fan for many years now and the thing that never ceases to amaze me is the hate that many fans have for anime they don't like or understand. To the point of trying to get other people [who happen to enjoy said anime] hate it too. I used to get annoyed and upset but, through the years I've learned to let it "in one ear and out the other." My sanity thanks me for it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with that, as many posters have said this in their replies. The only thing that bothers me in that respect, is when someone is coming at me for being a anime fan, or the old "Only ________ should watch a certain show". I usually take the approach where it's in one ear and out the other for most anime bashers. I mean the standard line is:

*me watching or looking at anime*

Joe Bob: Haha anime sucks, cartoon porn, haha childish cartoons!

Me: Uh, yeh..

It doesn't bother me as much as it used to. It's one of those things where I'm not going to let people decide my interests and hobbies. The other thing that bugs me about the fandom is when a good show comes up, maybe something like CCS, and you get the "If you're male and watch that show, you only want to see Sakura". Or the classic "Only (insert type/group of fans here) should watch this show".

What it comes down to is a lot of people see anime as the "in thing" at the moment, and will bash anything they see as being new, confusing, or popular in general. The thing that I always take comfort in is that anime and manga are million dollar industries. So I know that I'm not the only one who loves them.


[ QUOTE ]
- people who believe they have a right to free anime

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats a HUGE one for me also.

[aleczman]

[ QUOTE ]
Lego said:
I agree with that, as many posters have said this in their replies. The only thing that bothers me in that respect, is when someone is coming at me for being a anime fan, or the old "Only ________ should watch a certain show".

[/ QUOTE ]
Non-anime fans coming at people for liking anime is not that uncommon. I think most of us are used to that. What I mean is anime fans who come at other anime fans because they like a certain show and their need to spread hate. Let's say that a hypothetical anime called Super Duper Galaxy Gymnasts exists. Some fans love SDGG. Some fans hate SDGG.

What I have yet to understand is why some of the anime fans who hate SDGG try to keep the fans who do like SDGG from enjoying it (via insults, constant bashing or hostility method du jour)? Some of that hate is so rabid and passionate that it would seem that the fans are being directly hurt by someone's enjoyment of SDGG. Are there puppies somewhere being killed for every minute of someone's enjoyment of SDGG? I don't think so.

I don't think I'll ever understand... /images/graemlins/sad.gif

P.S. No puppies were harmed during the making of this post.

[Lego]

I understand what you're trying to say alexzman heh. I kind of integrated both ideas into my post, but I end up agreeing with you in the former.

[something]

"Fickle fandom"?

Isn't that redundant? =P

[Lego]

To a point yes heh. I figured I would use the world fickle, since dictionary.com defines it as:

[ QUOTE ]
fick·le Audio pronunciation of "fickle" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (fkl)
adj.

Characterized by erratic changeableness or instability, especially with regard to affections or attachments; capricious.

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought that it fit most of the anime fandom to a tee.

[Oniko]

The Good:

I've had the opportunity to meet a variety of people around the world who share similar interests as I do and had the chance to discuss those interests intelligently.

It's a form of entertainment that both my Hubby and I have enjoyed for years now and get to enjoy together.

Like all forms of art, anime and manga give an interesting perspective on the culture that has created it (anthropology is another hobby of mine.)


The Bad:

The only thing I can really think of are the annoying people who insist on cosplaying at Mitsuwa Marketplace- it's a grocery store for pete's sake- when there are no conventions going on anywhere near the Chicagoland area. They are generally loud, obnoxious and just plain rude. The worst part is they do not even realize the Asahiya staff enjoy mocking them whenever they go through the store. (Thank goodness I've always stayed on their good side.)

I have no trouble with cosplaying and respect the effort people put into doing it (yes, even Man Faye has his place), but why in the world would anyone cosplay just to go to a grocery store? Just because it's a Japanese grocery store doesn't automatically beg for people to behave foolishly. And I seriously doubt anyone would see people cosplaying to go to the standard American grocery store, so why do so to a Japanese one?

Otherwise, I've never come across people who hated anime or manga. And I've certainly never heard people call it pornography to my face nor tell me that I'm too old for cartoons (well, other than my youngest sister when we used to annoy each other.) I suppose I'm one of the lucky few in that respect.

[something]

[ QUOTE ]
Lego said:
I thought that it fit most of the anime fandom to a tee.

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha, yeah, exactly. Fandom is inherently schizophrenic, and is full of crazy fanatics almost by definition. ::shrugs:: Ah well.

[Gildor]

[ QUOTE ]
Oniko said:
[...]


The Bad:

The only thing I can really think of are the annoying people who insist on cosplaying at Mitsuwa Marketplace- it's a grocery store for pete's sake- when there are no conventions going on anywhere near the Chicagoland area. They are generally loud, obnoxious and just plain rude. The worst part is they do not even realize the Asahiya staff enjoy mocking them whenever they go through the store. (Thank goodness I've always stayed on their good side.)

I have no trouble with cosplaying and respect the effort people put into doing it (yes, even Man Faye has his place), but why in the world would anyone cosplay just to go to a grocery store? Just because it's a Japanese grocery store doesn't automatically beg for people to behave foolishly. And I seriously doubt anyone would see people cosplaying to go to the standard American grocery store, so why do so to a Japanese one?


[/ QUOTE ]
Actually, I find that pretty hilarious! I go to the LA (Gardena, actually) Mitsuwa all the time, and have been going for several years. I have never seen anyone cosplaying there, ever. Maybe its because LA anime fandom has other outlets and the Mitsuwa here is frequented by Japanese ex-pats who work at the nearby US HQ of Toyota and Honda, but I have never seen anything like that at all.

[Johnny]

Well, the only experience of 'fandom' I really have is online (mostly here) and is about 90% of that is the fandom in the US but the main thing I love and hate is how picky people are about minor details, and everyone, myself very much included, does it.

Before I came to these forums, I was happy watching anime and leaving it at that, but seeing the amount of analysis and discussion that goes on (a characters motivation for doing something, putting yourself in their shoes etc) really opened my eyes and led to me looking deeper into not just the anime I watched, but also movies etc.

The negative to this (and I'm guilty of these too) is how much of a big deal people will make over cover art, boxes, extras etc. Sure, I love a nice box, R2 cover art and a load of extras but at the end of the day it's the actual content you'll be watching so the above should play second fiddle.
I think a lot of us don't realise how good we have it when it comes to anime being released in the US/Europe.

Regarding "crazed fans", I haven't ever seen any here nor any anytime I've been in the US. But yeah, I would probably count them in with the negative things.

[tangent]

Like johnny, most of my experience with Anime fandom has been online(usually at AoD). Of that experience I would say most has been positive. It's great that fans can get together from all around the world and share their thoughts and opinions about Anime. And with the diversity of Anime there is something for everyone to enjoy.

As for the bad side of Anime fandom, I don't let it get me down. Just like everyday life there are always going to be jerks and idiots. I just ignore them and move on. I'm not going to let people like that spoil my enjoyment of Anime. /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

[cpuuk]

[ QUOTE ]
Lego said:
The perception - Usually this doesn't bother me at all. But from recent articles in the US, Canada, and Japan, one would think that we were some fringe group of society that only comes out for food and water(hey, wait a minute..). Although with the popularity of manga, and more mainstream movies using anime and manga as influences(Kill Bill), I think attitudes will slowly change.

Those are just some for starters, as I could go on and on.

[/ QUOTE ]

In Japan people like us are STILL thought of as weirdos, and they've been doing it longer than we have- so what makes you think our fate will be any different?

I think certain elements from manga or anime will be mixed into society (maybe fashion), but it won't be recognisable as pure manga or anime, it'll be a street hybrid.

[DanielJr]

[ QUOTE ]
leongsh said:
- people who write-off shows after 1 episode
- people who believe they have a right to free anime


[/ QUOTE ]
Yes! I definitely agree here. One thing is admitting to watch fansubs, another is defending it. It annoys me to no end.

And usually people that write off an entire series based on one episode are most likely not worth trying to get them to like it. If they wrote it off on one episode... you know they're gonna be after you ass for every little thing they have a problem with in the series. I've learned from experience to just ignore them.