Non-Miyazaki Ghibli: better?

[chloes_fork]

I know this is probably heresy, but of the several Ghibli films I've seen, I find I prefer those not directed by Miyazaki (Whisper of the Heart, The Cat Returns) to those that are (Nausicaa, Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away). Part of it, I think, is that Whisper and even Cat feel more grounded, less fantastical and whimsical to me than the Miyazakis; Cat, for all its fanciful and magical elements, still spends a lot of time in the "real" world, and Haru seems a more normal girl than Miyazaki's larger-than-life heroines.

Some of this is obviously down to personal preference, since I've always been resistant to pure fantasy (for example, The Lord of the Rings, prose or film, bores me to tears). But even putting that aside, I think there's simply more emotional resonance and character depth in Whisper and Cat, even if they may lack Miyazaki's grand-scale vision. I was curious what others might think.

[DanielJr]

Let's see if I understand... What you're trying to say is that you prefer character-based stories compared to plot heavy stories? Most Miyazaki films are plot heavy, but the rest of the Ghibli directors are all about the characters, plot is only secondary, if anything only but a catalyst to speed up characterization.

While I'm all for characters, I think in the end I prefer the large scale stories compared to the more "grounded" character-based dramas. So I'll say I prefer the Miyazaki movies, though I'm not a big fan of his alleged "best" works. Porco Rosso is certainly a favorite of mine. /images/graemlins/happy.gif (Go figure it's his only movie without a [boring and overdone] self-righteous heroine.)

[chloes_fork]

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DanielJr said:
Let's see if I understand... What you're trying to say is that you prefer character-based stories compared to plot heavy stories?

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Yeah, I generally prioritize character and emotion over plot -- which is why, when people complain that something as exquisite as Gunslinger Girl doesn't "go anywhere," I just /images/graemlins/relief1.gif. And even with a more concept- or plot-focused show like Lain or Noir, it's the characters I tend to connect with and remember, more than the Big Ideas or the Big Story. So that certainly may be a factor here.

[jecca-neko]

You do have a point in that the non-Miyazaki movies are a lot more character based. I very much enjoyed Grave of the Fireflies, Whisper of the Heart, and The Cat Returns (I don't care for My Neighbors the Yamadas or Pom Poko, hence me skipping that Ghibli "wave"), and my reason for enjoying them *is* because of the characters.

However, I really enjoy the Miyazaki films as well. Miyazaki is good at making the settings seem facinating. I like Nausicaa's poison forest, Kiki's town, Spirited Away's bath house, Howl's castle, Porco's plane/the sky (closest thing to a setting in this movie), Mononoke's steam town, Totoro's forest, and Laputa's... well, Laputa. The fantastic elements also appeal to me as well, being one who enjoys fantasy.

[Pfil]

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chloes_fork said:
I know this is probably heresy, but of the several Ghibli films I've seen, I find I prefer those not directed by Miyazaki (Whisper of the Heart, The Cat Returns) to those that are (Nausicaa, Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away). Part of it, I think, is that Whisper and even Cat feel more grounded, less fantastical and whimsical to me than the Miyazakis; Cat, for all its fanciful and magical elements, still spends a lot of time in the "real" world, and Haru seems a more normal girl than Miyazaki's larger-than-life heroines.

Some of this is obviously down to personal preference, since I've always been resistant to pure fantasy (for example, The Lord of the Rings, prose or film, bores me to tears). But even putting that aside, I think there's simply more emotional resonance and character depth in Whisper and Cat, even if they may lack Miyazaki's grand-scale vision. I was curious what others might think.

[/ QUOTE ]
Personally, I'm not sure why Cat Returns is held in such high esteem by so many. I mean, it was fun, I enjoyed it, but it came off as pretty lightweight compared to other Ghibli productions. Especially the animation, which was pretty plain (they didn't even bother to shade the cats in many of the scenes; the whole thing looked more like an OVA than a feature film).

Whisper of the Heart though, that was a good movie. Of the directors other than Miyazaki and Takahata who have worked for Ghibli, Kondou is the only one I could see living up to their standards and take over after they retire, which just makes it even sadder that he kicked the bucket some years ago. (I haven't watched Mochizuki's Umi ga Kikoeru yet though, based on his other works I probably wouldn't mind him taking over either, but I don't think that's going to happen.)

What I'm really curious about is how Gedo Senki, which is directed by Miyazaki's son Gorou, will turn out, and in the case that it is successful, whether he'll go on making more movies for the studio.

On the whole, although I love all of Ghibli's movies, I tend to prefer Miyazaki's adventure movies over Takahata's everyday-realism. Miyazaki's movies are simple and clear-cut, but have that magical quality that is missing from 99% of today's world's popular entertainment. His movies are the only ones that still can make me as excited as when I watched Star Wars years ago as a kid...

My favorite Studio Ghibli to this day remains Umi ga Kikoeru. Ironicly, the list of favorites following the number 1 slot is dominated by Miyazaki's films.

[bctaris]

I was thinking along this line after watching Whisper of the Heart last week, which felt much more personal, and was much more endearing, than most of Miyazaki's work. My favorites of Miyazaki's are Porco Rosso, Totoro and Spirited Away, while the rest are fairly hit and miss (I try to love Nausicaa, but finally seeing it after a decade of reading his manga over and over--still my favorite epic comic, period--it just lacks the same spark.)

But Whisper, Pom Poko, Fireflies and Yamadas (as I've only seen all that's been released on the Disney end), again just have a bigger impact on me. I love all of them, with the first two on top. (Only Yesterday, the first half of which was actually the first Ghibli I ever saw years ago in school, I know I’ll like just as much.) The down-to-earth stories simply resonate for me better--and unlike yourself I'm not timid about loving fantasy as Miyazaki so revels in. My tastes are simply all over the place and sometimes unpredictable.

(The Cat Returns, however, I'm sort of the same opinion as Hunter Pfil. I like the first half, so similar in tone to Whisper, of course, but the rest seemed like something by a director not sure of his allegiances between Miyazaki on one hand, and Takahata, et al, on the other.)

[Azumangaman]

Well, since there are only 2 movies not by Miyazaki here (I know of The Cat Returns and Whisper..) I've only seen the Cat Returns, and I really liked it.

It seems to me that Miyazaki's movies are pretty slow paced. Each of his movies I've seen (although I really like them all) except Howl's Moving Castle had me getting a bit bored at some point throughout the film. I personally found Nausicaa awful and couldn't finish watching it.

The Cat Returns was not the case for me however. I found it to be really funny and overall an above-average watch. The next anime movie on my list to buy is Whisper Of The Heart, so I'll see then. Hmmm....I didn't know Grave of The Fireflies was a Ghibli film? Another fantastic Miyazaki-less release. However, I found my neighbours the Yamada's to drag on a bit.

So, in the end I guess it would be a tie for me. However I have a feeling that when I see Whisper Of The Heart I'll change my mind /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

[EmperorBrandon]

I am in agreement on Whisper and Cat. While I'm not totally sure on if I'd put them above all Miyazaki movies... I really need to watch them all (Miyazaki's and non-Miyazaki's) again to see how my opinions are at this point... those two seems to appeal to me greatly on a level that some of the Miyazaki ones do not. Still haven't seen the Takahata movies yet, so can't say anything on him just yet.

[xyz]

Whisper is definitely on top of my list as a Ghibli favorite. Second favorite is Only Yesterday. Whisper is perfect in my eyes: strong in story telling, characters, music and the beautiful scenery. It stirs a feeling of sweetness and nostalgia (that of the adolescence stage). I found myself watching it numerous time with the same smile on my face at the end. Only yesterday's strength from this POV is the characters and the soundtrack that goes so well with the nostalgic landscape in the countryside. Storytelling is choppy but overall I still like it a lot. I love the details on certain reactions of the characters. It makes them real.

Miyazaki's films are imaginative with nice themes and I like them as well but they're a bit further down the list.

[DKL]

Didn't read through, but I'll just add something:

What I liked most about Miyazaki movies is that even though they have all this fantastical stuffs tossed in, Miyazaki conveys a lot of his characterization and ideas very VERY subtly... I mean, it's not all bombastic and stuff (or whatever the word is)

It's a nice contrast... I mean, between the fantasy (which is all dynamic) and the subtly of everything else (which is all... subtle... yeah)

that said, WHISPER was also my favorite Ghibli movie... it's too cute to not like

[Suwako Moriya]

Honestly I've only really seen Spirited Away and Kikki's Delivery Service. Both being Miyazaki if I'm not wrong. So I don't have much of an opinion either way. However I can say this much. While I did enjoy both movies based on what I remember about them. I don't think Miyazaki is the divine perfect person that some do. I think that's the best way to put it.

[DKL]

I remember someone saying that Miyazaki tends to have an over-emphasis on those down-to-earth moments (or whatever you call them... like, subtle actions that brings stuff closer to reality like how characters would put on shoes or eat or whatever)

... like... too much detail and too much time goes into conveying them as opposed to going over more story (or something else)...

that seemed like a good argument

But then, people can counter that by saying that's what Miyazaki's magic is... yeah

[Mahlernut]

It's probably worth pointing out here that Miyazaki's the one who wrote the screenplay for Whispers and storyboarded the film. While it's certainly different from the films that he's directed, I don't know that the clear cut line that people are drawing between Whispers and Miyazaki's other films actually exists. Miyazaki clearly prefers helming more epic films (though Kiki and Totoro are both just as intimate, to my mind, as Whispers), but considering how significant the contributions he made to Whispers are...well, his voice is clearly much more complex than some people are giving him credit for in this particular comparison.

[chloes_fork]

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Mahlernut said:
It's probably worth pointing out here that Miyazaki's the one who wrote the screenplay for Whispers and storyboarded the film.

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I knew that, actually, and considered it when making my original post. Still (and hopefully without getting too highfalutin'), one school of film criticism holds to the auteur theory -- that the director is the ultimate "author" of a film, notwithstanding the various creative contributions of others. It probably is too simplistic an approach in practical terms, but it's a useful basis for discussion, especially since there does seem to be a distinction to be drawn here. And even you acknowledge that the projects Miyazaki chooses to helm personally as director are different from those he doesn't.

[Mahlernut]

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chloes_fork said:
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Mahlernut said:
It's probably worth pointing out here that Miyazaki's the one who wrote the screenplay for Whispers and storyboarded the film.

[/ QUOTE ]
I knew that, actually, and considered it when making my original post. Still (and hopefully without getting too highfalutin'), one school of film criticism holds to the auteur theory -- that the director is the ultimate "author" of a film, notwithstanding the various creative contributions of others. It probably is too simplistic an approach in practical terms, but it's a useful basis for discussion, especially since there does seem to be a distinction to be drawn here. And even you acknowledge that the projects Miyazaki chooses to helm personally as director are different from those he doesn't.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can buy into the auteur theory, depending on the situation. But without knowing exactly how Ghibli produces its films, and what role Miyazaki played in relation to the director, I can't personally see it as a strong enough argument to state unilaterally that Whispers (and other similar films non-epic films, like my aforementioned Totoro and Kiki) doesn't reflect as strongly on Miyazaki's proclivities as a film maker as Nausica or Howl's. In the end, I personally find too many wonderfully intimate moments in all of his films (all of which, IMHO, focus on the characters and details to much greater extant than they do on the plot or any attempt to be particularly epic) to buy the distinction regardless. But, that's just me /images/graemlins/happy.gif

[fantasydewdrop]

I haven't seen enough of the non-Miyazaki Ghibli to be able to compare them all, but of the ones I have seen, I find them pretty equal to Miyazaki's stuff. Of course, I don't think all of Miyazaki's movies are at the same level of awesome, either (but even his worst is still better than the majority of movies out there /images/graemlins/tongue.gif). I love Cat Returns and think it's better than Laputa, but I love Kiki's and Howl's more than Cat Returns. /images/graemlins/happy.gif All three of them are whimsical, fun, magical movies that make me feel the way Disney movies used to make me feel back when they were good. But, Kiki's and Howl's has old-Miyazaki-ladies. He always has the best old lady characters. How can you not love his old lady characters? They have such spunky personalities. ^-^ Howl's was such a treat in that department since two of the main characters were old ladies. /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif And I like all the little details Miyazaki puts in to make the characters seem more real. I love the huge, fantastical worlds he creates. He creates the kinds of worlds I'd love to live in.

And I mean "spunky" in the non-perverted sense of the word.

[Mononoke]

I can respect your opinion; Miyazaki is not for everyone (though I personally like his work a great deal). But do you really mean what you've said? So far the examples you gave, Whisper and Cat Returns, are from Ghibli's "niche" directors who have done only one film each. What about Takahata's (the other major Ghibli director) works? Does he fall under the "everyone else" that you like better than Miyazaki? Or is it that you prefer the niche directors to the main ones?

[Mononoke]

Of all the Ghibli directors, I'd actually categorize Takahata as weakest, if such distinction were to be made. Out of his films (Grave of the Fireflies, Only Yesterday, Pon Poko, Yamadas), the only one I enjoyed was Grave. It's excruciatingly sad and I can only watch it once a year at most, but it is quite well done. I have no idea what happened when it came time for the other three, but none of them did it for me at all. I found them either too weird (Pon Poko) or plain uninteresting (OY, Yamadas).

It isn't that I dislike slice-o-life shows (I don't; in fact I'm rather fond of such works as Gunslinger Girl and Lain), so it must be something else. I hope his next film will be better.

[jecca-neko]

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Azumangaman said:
Well, since there are only 2 movies not by Miyazaki here (I know of The Cat Returns and Whisper..) I've only seen the Cat Returns, and I really liked it.


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There's more out in R1 land. Pom Poko, My Neighbors the Yamadas, and Grave of the Fireflies (CPM released this one).

[chloes_fork]

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Lamhirh of the Stars said:
But do you really mean what you've said?

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Erm ... I think so.

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So far the examples you gave, Whisper and Cat Returns, are from Ghibli's "niche" directors who have done only one film each. What about Takahata's (the other major Ghibli director) works? Does he fall under the "everyone else" that you like better than Miyazaki? Or is it that you prefer the niche directors to the main ones?

[/ QUOTE ]
Quite simply, my sample is incomplete. I've only seen the Ghibli films named in my original post. Unforgivable, perhaps, if I were claiming to do an authoritative analysis of all the studio's works. But I tend to think discussion threads on Internet forums can be a bit more casual. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Chloe]

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Lamhirh of the Stars said:
Of all the Ghibli directors, I'd actually categorize Takahata as weakest, if such distinction were to be made. Out of his films (Grave of the Fireflies, Only Yesterday, Pon Poko, Yamadas), the only one I enjoyed was Grave. It's excruciatingly sad and I can only watch it once a year at most, but it is quite well done. I have no idea what happened when it came time for the other three, but none of them did it for me at all. I found them either too weird (Pon Poko) or plain uninteresting (OY, Yamadas).

It isn't that I dislike slice-o-life shows (I don't; in fact I'm rather fond of such works as Gunslinger Girl and Lain), so it must be something else. I hope his next film will be better.

[/ QUOTE ]

See, I agree and disagree with you. Grave is no doubt in my mind, really good, but for a Ghibli film is way out of character since it is really tragic; none of the other Ghibli's reach it's depths. I don't like to compare that to other Ghibli's for that reason.

I've seen Only Yesterday recently, and it really impressed me; I'm almost 40 and I think that really will resonate better for a middle-aged person then a younger audience.

Pom Poko I've seen twice, and while it has some moments it has yet to thrill me. I have not yet seen the sub version yet though, so I need to give that a whirl before I finally decide how I feel about this one. I've yet to see the Yamadas, and I curious since it seems to get few strong supporters, at least here on AOD. Overall though, I think Takahata is at least as strong as Miyazaki, though they definitely have different styles.

Chloe's Fork: I think your sample is incomplete, yes. What you say about Miyazaki being more fantastical and less grounded in reality does not apply as much to Kiki's and Totoro, and you mention you have not seen those. Those are much closer to Takahata's more realistic style, and I think they are two of the best Ghibli's going.

Now my sample is incomplete too, since I have yet to Whispers, and Omoide Poro Poro, in addition to the above mentioned Yamada's. So my opinions may very well change in the future too, but I don't think Miyazaki and Takahata are as far apart as might seem at first glance. I think they go wherever their particular story takes them, that's all.

[chloes_fork]

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Kingmole said:
Chloe's Fork: I think your sample is incomplete, yes. What you say about Miyazaki being more fantastical and less grounded in reality does not apply as much to Kiki's and Totoro, and you mention you have not seen those. Those are much closer to Takahata's more realistic style, and I think they are two of the best Ghibli's going.

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Interesting. Mahlernut mentioned those same two titles as well. Maybe I should check them out; it's possible I've just happened to choose the "wrong" Miyazakis for my personal tastes.

[Mahlernut]

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chloes_fork said:
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Kingmole said:
Chloe's Fork: I think your sample is incomplete, yes. What you say about Miyazaki being more fantastical and less grounded in reality does not apply as much to Kiki's and Totoro, and you mention you have not seen those. Those are much closer to Takahata's more realistic style, and I think they are two of the best Ghibli's going.

[/ QUOTE ]
Interesting. Mahlernut mentioned those same two titles as well. Maybe I should check them out; it's possible I've just happened to choose the "wrong" Miyazakis for my personal tastes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given what you've mentioned as being elements in Whispers and Cat Returns that you enjoyed, I think you'll love them. Kiki is, possibly, my all time favorite Ghibli character...right up there with her cat /images/graemlins/catgirl0.gif

[bctaris]

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Lamhirh of the Stars said:
It isn't that I dislike slice-o-life shows (I don't; in fact I'm rather fond of such works as Gunslinger Girl and Lain), so it must be something else. I hope his next film will be better.

[/ QUOTE ]

Though if Gunslinger Girl and Lain are your most at-hand examples of what you consider "slice of life" material, I might see why Only Yesterday and Yamadas held little interest. Those would not be the first shows I would think of. /images/graemlins/sweat000.gif Things like NieA_7 or Piano would be more apt examples of what the label means, I think

[bctaris]

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Mahlernut said:
It's probably worth pointing out here that Miyazaki's the one who wrote the screenplay for Whispers and storyboarded the film. While it's certainly different from the films that he's directed, I don't know that the clear cut line that people are drawing between Whispers and Miyazaki's other films actually exists. Miyazaki clearly prefers helming more epic films (though Kiki and Totoro are both just as intimate, to my mind, as Whispers), but considering how significant the contributions he made to Whispers are...well, his voice is clearly much more complex than some people are giving him credit for in this particular comparison.

[/ QUOTE ]

Point noted. It is an interesting dichotomy within Ghibli, it seems.

[raistlinmajere]

Mimi o Sumaseba is my favorite, but I hate Pom Poko and Omoide Poroporo (the Takahata ones)

[chloes_fork]

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Mahlernut said:
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chloes_fork said:
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Kingmole said:
Chloe's Fork: I think your sample is incomplete, yes. What you say about Miyazaki being more fantastical and less grounded in reality does not apply as much to Kiki's and Totoro, and you mention you have not seen those. Those are much closer to Takahata's more realistic style, and I think they are two of the best Ghibli's going.

[/ QUOTE ]
Interesting. Mahlernut mentioned those same two titles as well. Maybe I should check them out; it's possible I've just happened to choose the "wrong" Miyazakis for my personal tastes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given what you've mentioned as being elements in Whispers and Cat Returns that you enjoyed, I think you'll love them. Kiki is, possibly, my all time favorite Ghibli character...right up there with her cat /images/graemlins/catgirl0.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
All right, sold. I'll add Kiki's to my next order batch, and consider Totoro after that. Thanks for the input, both of you. /images/graemlins/happy.gif

[BonnKansan]

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Kingmole said:
I've seen Only Yesterday recently, and it really impressed me; I'm almost 40 and I think that really will resonate better for a middle-aged person then a younger audience.
...
Now my sample is incomplete too, since I have yet to Whispers, and Omoide Poro Poro, in addition to the above mentioned Yamada's.

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Just so you know, Omoide Poro Poro is the Japanese title for Only Yesterday, so you've seen that one already /images/graemlins/happy.gif.

[ObiKenobi]

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chloes_fork said:
I know this is probably heresy, but of the several Ghibli films I've seen, I find I prefer those not directed by Miyazaki (Whisper of the Heart, The Cat Returns) to those that are (Nausicaa, Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away). Part of it, I think, is that Whisper and even Cat feel more grounded, less fantastical and whimsical to me than the Miyazakis; Cat, for all its fanciful and magical elements, still spends a lot of time in the "real" world, and Haru seems a more normal girl than Miyazaki's larger-than-life heroines.

Some of this is obviously down to personal preference, since I've always been resistant to pure fantasy (for example, The Lord of the Rings, prose or film, bores me to tears). But even putting that aside, I think there's simply more emotional resonance and character depth in Whisper and Cat, even if they may lack Miyazaki's grand-scale vision. I was curious what others might think.

[/ QUOTE ]

The screenplay and storyboards for Whisper of the Heart were done by Miyazaki. I'm not sure I follow in how you can say its a non-Miyazaki movie as he had just as much influence on that movie as the ones he directed.

[jecca-neko]

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chloes_fork said:
All right, sold. I'll add Kiki's to my next order batch, and consider Totoro after that. Thanks for the input, both of you. /images/graemlins/happy.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with the others - if you like Whisper of the Heart and The Cat Returns, you'll love Kiki's and Totoro. Both do have small fantastical elements (Kiki is a witch and Totoro is this big living plushie... thing) but they are the more realistic of the Ghibli films. Kiki's especially - she's a witch but really the movie centers around her (non-magical) delivery service and her interactions with the people in the town she lives in.

Have you seen Porco Rosso? You might like that too even though it's another Miyazaki film. Ignoring the fact that Porco was turned into a pig, it's simply about a guy who loves the sky and his airplane, and the adventures he has in both.

[Mononoke]

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Kingmole said:
See, I agree and disagree with you. Grave is no doubt in my mind, really good, but for a Ghibli film is way out of character since it is really tragic; none of the other Ghibli's reach it's depths. I don't like to compare that to other Ghibli's for that reason.

[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed - Grave is quite unlike your typical Ghibli film. Perhaps it was thought to be a little too sad -- in Japanese theaters, Grave and Totoro were shown back to back as a double feature. If you went for Grave you could have Totoro to cheer you up afterwards /images/graemlins/happy.gif.

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I've seen Only Yesterday recently, and it really impressed me; I'm almost 40 and I think that really will resonate better for a middle-aged person then a younger audience.

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I think you hit the nail on the head here. Only Yesterday is targeted towards middle-aged people (Takahata has said so specifically), and perhaps if one doesn't have that amount of life experience it might be harder to appreciate the movie. I saw it for the first time several years back when I was 19, which might have something to do with why I didn't care for the movie.

BTW, you mentioned below that you hadn't seen Omohide Poroporo yet. But actually, you have! For that is the Japanese title of Only Yesterday (lit. Memories Falling like Teardrops).

Whisper of the Heart is a classic. Netflix it today! /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Mononoke]

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bctaris said:
Though if Gunslinger Girl and Lain are your most at-hand examples of what you consider "slice of life" material, I might see why Only Yesterday and Yamadas held little interest. Those would not be the first shows I would think of. /images/graemlins/sweat000.gif Things like NieA_7 or Piano would be more apt examples of what the label means, I think

[/ QUOTE ]
Heh, interesting. I consider "slice-o-life" to be synonymous with "character-heavy show, usually slower paced", which is why I consider GG and Lain to be included in that label. I could have said Someday's Dreamers and Haibane Renmei instead. Would your conclusion re: OY and Yamada still follow had I named those shows instead?

[bctaris]

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Lamhirh of the Stars said:
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bctaris said:
Though if Gunslinger Girl and Lain are your most at-hand examples of what you consider "slice of life" material, I might see why Only Yesterday and Yamadas held little interest. Those would not be the first shows I would think of. /images/graemlins/sweat000.gif Things like NieA_7 or Piano would be more apt examples of what the label means, I think

[/ QUOTE ]
Heh, interesting. I consider "slice-o-life" to be synonymous with "character-heavy show, usually slower paced", which is why I consider GG and Lain to be included in that label. I could have said Someday's Dreamers and Haibane Renmei instead. Would your conclusion re: OY and Yamada still follow had I named those shows instead?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, actually--Dreamers and Haibane are certainly more in the ballpark. /images/graemlins/wink.gif But I should concede that "slice of life" should certainly mean slightly different things to different people. Though for me it's basically what you said about being character heavy (or centric) and slower paced but also something where a central plot or coherent and organized story-line is very minimal or non-existent. Character plays and studies, really.

Lain sort of is like that, but its main pull is the mystery surrounding the characters, and the search for its meaning. Gunslinger Girl I'll admit I only know some from early bits of the manga, so I don't know if any sort of plot is or becomes secondary in the story. (NieA_7 and Haibane Renmei actually eschew the mysteries that appear to be built up around the characters to focus squarely on how something (ultimately indefinable) has changed those characters. Bringing it back around, I think much non-Miyazaki and some Miyazaki Ghibli does this; or like Yamadas, is strict character play instead.)

[chloes_fork]

Actually, I would consider Gunslinger Girl slice-of-life, of a rather odd sort. It's like, if you're a traumatized little girl turned into a cybernetic assassin by a secret government agency, here's a slice of your life. /images/graemlins/sweat000.gif It takes an extreme, harsh, and violent situation and treats it with a gentle, even mundane touch. For all the cruelty of the premise, it's an unexpectedly beautiful show.

[Chloe]

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chloes_fork said:
Actually, I would consider Gunslinger Girl slice-of-life, of a rather odd sort. It's like, if you're a traumatized little girl turned into a cybernetic assassin by a secret government agency, here's a slice of your life. /images/graemlins/sweat000.gif It takes an extreme, harsh, and violent situation and treats it with a gentle, even mundane touch. For all the cruelty of the premise, it's an unexpectedly beautiful show.

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You know, the more I think about it, it's almost a crime for them to even market this as Girls w/Guns genre materiel. It is so much more, and it completely threw me with that ending. Not what I expected at all. Chloes_fork is right, they spend a huge amount of time dwelling on tiny details of the girl's everyday life, even if it is in small bite sized pieces. What assassin in any other show is concerned about what her partners are getting for their birthday??? /images/graemlins/sdsmiley.gif

Lamhirh,Dr.Bonnkansen: D'OH! /images/graemlins/anger100.gif I knew that! ...the one I have not seen is I Can Hear the Sea, or whatever it is called in Japanese. I always get those two confused, especially since until recently I had never seen either one of them.

I have yet to get Whispers, or even Howl's moving castle, but they are probably going on my next order; I've just been digging out of the hole the last DDD sale put me in(so no buying recently /images/graemlins/depresse.gif).