Help me regain my willpower here.

[Ty]

Long story short: I'm tired of waiting for the right tv at the right price. I've spoken out in favor of LCD and against plasma several times here, but every LCD set I've had my eyes set on in the past 3 years has turned out to be a pass. I'm beginning to contemplate my B plan: buy a big cheap plasma set and sit tight for a few years and see where SED and OLED go. Contrary to my analness I am willing to live with just a good picture not a great one so long as the price was nice and the picture is big. True nirvana can come another time.

Having established that I'm thinking about grabbing the Vizio P50HDTV10A. It's under $1,600 at Sam's and 50" is a lot of flatpanel for that price. Room considerations demand a flatpanel as I have no room for a projection set and am really pushing it going with a 50" display at all.

Opinions? Should I cave on waiting for a good 46-47" 1080p LCD to come along in the low $2K range (that meets my standards for motion blur, this is the kicker.... pretty much need 120hz), or should I sit it out for yet another year? I feel I've thought about this so much I need some perspective from others, and I know I can trust you guys. :)

[Skywise]

Specs look pretty nice and it can also resolve full 720P unlike a lot of other plasmas. I think you should try and find a store locally that has one so you can have a look at it in person. Personally I can't deal with the motion dithering from plasma, so before deciding anything I think it's a good idea to see if it's something you notice too. Also a good idea to see how it handles scaling of both SD and HD source material. Can it take native resolution on the computer input? Things like that.

[Ty]

I have studied them in person. The original P50HDM used the Genesis 2310 scaler same as the Oppo971 but I've found the newer sets use a cheaper derivative of the same chipset. Still has DCDi though which is important. It does native res through VGA but that isn't terribly important to me.

I really hear you on the dithering issue, it's a biggie for me but at the same time motion blur (to be fair I should actually say sample and hold retention effect since it's not the LCD response time that's the issue here) on LCD sets is intolerable to me for use outside the computer world. 120hz is my savior but those high end sets that have it are neither affordable nor without problems of their own and my expectations grow higher for those expensive sets to match their pricetags and they're not being met right now. :(

I'm just tired of waiting. I've put off buying an HD set for more than 5 years now (excluding the plasma I tried 2 years ago and returned after a week) but each year I find new reasons to wait. It'll never end at this rate. :) Burn-in on the plasma is a very real concern for me still too since I only believe in OAR and easily 2/3 of my sizable anime dvd collection is 4:3. Between that and 4:3 gaming (I could probably tolerate stretching the games though) I can't see myself escaping burn-in which is why I'm also considering waiting for the replacement for the Westinghouse 42w2. It'll be well below this price as well soon after it streets in April. Trouble is I'm just not impressed by 42" anymore and if I step up to the larger 47" Westinghouse the price becomes high enough to make me think "go all out and get the Sharp 46D92U" you know? So I'm thinking biggest flatpanel I can grab for around the $1500 range and I won't have so much invested in it that I feel bad if it ends up not being perfect or something more appealing comes along in a year.

Think it's worth the risk guys? Sorry for rambling, I just have buying fever bad and I'm either going to satisfy it or I need help squelching it. :)

[stfram]

Think it's worth the risk guys? Sorry for rambling, I just have buying fever bad and I'm either going to satisfy it or I need help squelching it. :)


This is probably blasphemy, but why not just buy a basic widescreen 32" LCD as a stopgap?

Heck, saw one on sale at BB for $699+tax. Heck, get a sweet 24" widescreen LCD monitor as a stopgap, watch your shows on the computer.

Spending $1500+tax on a less-than-pefect stopgap TV seems excessive to me.

If I were spending 1500, it had damn well better be the best model in that range.

[Leon_Belmont]

I bought the 1080P Westy 37" myself. It's less than a grand, gets my HD done for awhile, then I just delegate it to my computer monitor and get a 50-60" of whatever tech is around in like 4 or 5 years. That's my plan.

LCDs are definitely harsh to bad sources though. Gotta play with the settings quite a bit on the player and tv, or else even newer anime will often look like shit.

[Ty]

Think it's worth the risk guys? Sorry for rambling, I just have buying fever bad and I'm either going to satisfy it or I need help squelching it. :)


This is probably blasphemy, but why not just buy a basic widescreen 32" LCD as a stopgap?

Heck, saw one on sale at BB for $699+tax. Heck, get a sweet 24" widescreen LCD monitor as a stopgap, watch your shows on the computer.

Spending $1500+tax on a less-than-pefect stopgap TV seems excessive to me.

If I were spending 1500, it had damn well better be the best model in that range.
Two reasons: I have a 32" and it's way too small and right now the best value in terms of dollars per square inch are actually in the 37-42 size range. That's beginning to migrate up to the 42-47 too. I almost know too much about these darn tvs which is why I can't settle on one. I'm weighing my options here. I'm not "settling" per se with a plasma as they do some things very well. Like all the other current techs they have some flaws, but the only one that's truly concerning to me is burn in due to viewing habits. I can't decide which is more irritating: working to avoid that burn-in or putting up with blur on an LCD. As a means of putting a dose of reality into this decision for me I've chosen to artifically limit my budget to the amount I spent on my previous failed plasma purchase: $1750. I have other big financial plans this year and felt this amount was a good compromise on something I don't really need but can't seem to wait for anymore. :)

[Skywise]

Don't do it then. If you buy it you'll just end up not becoming happy with your purchase and feel that it was money out the window. Just lay low and wait for a while longer until you find something that does fit your needs.

[LOUiE]

I'm guessing you will not be satisfied with whatever you pick up from your description of your last plasma venture. What you want is something that costs at least $3000 and probably a lot more at the moment. I say wait. I know it's hard. I was doing it for 3 years before my 36" CRT monster died 3 weeks ago. I'm still technically at a stopgap because I'm living in an apartment and don't have the correct space for what I truly want to do (which includes the best front projector I can get for under $10,000 and at least a 200" screen to go with it, not to mention a custom-made room for a theatre and a theatre quality sound system). I ended up getting the Sony KDS-50A2000 50" SXRD. It's last year's model SXRD projection. Got it at Circuit City for $1789 total w/ tax & shipping. I am absolutely floored by what it can do with anime through my new Oppo 981HD dvd player. SD cable is tolerable and HD cable is amazing. The Wii puts out an awesome picture through component, though the PS2 leaves something to be desired through component(wonder if I have a setting wrong). I am probably lucky because I am not bothered by any type of motion blur...at least at this point.

Anyways, I would still be waiting longer if it wasn't for the CRT going out on me. I highly suggest waiting if certain aspects of viewing are that noticeable to you.

Unless you already have an HD-DVD or Blu-ray Player or get HD Cable or Sattelite. Then I say get the best thing you can for your budget and worry about what you truly want in 5-10 years. :)

[Ty]

Well I'm at a crossroads here. My original plan from the very beginning was a cheap plasma that would get me HD until SED or OLED came along. Then LCD made such great progress and I decided to pick up a Sharp D92 series when the time was right. That was a concrete plan, so I knew exactly what I wanted and what it would cost me. It's looking like the time will never be right for them now with all the manufacturing trouble Sharp is having out of their new factory, so all my ranting above was me really wondering if I should go back to the original plan. Only difference is then I would've been happy with 42 inches whereas now I can easily get 50 for what I was going to pay before. I just want to hear people say they would or would not agree with my logic.

I'm not buying a temporary booster tv, I'd keep it for at least 3 or 4 years until SED/OLED is established, but those technologies are what I'm truly waiting for. I'm just not keeping my tube set until they reach their primetime.

It's either a 42 LCD or a 50 Plasma and the pros and cons of each about cancel each other out. I like big though... I'm sick of small tvs. :)

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

I have a Westinghouse LVM-42w2 TV Monitor (see my sig ;) ) and I must say that despite it's many bugs, I am quite happy. I know that in April Westinghouse plans to release a new 42" TV with an HD tuner for an MSRP of $1999. This TV will have 4 HDMI ports, I believe 1 HD Component, 1 VGA, 1 Composite, and 1 S-Video inputs.

If I were you and didn't have my heart set on plasma, I'd wait until June and then head on over to the AVS Forum and see what problems, if any, users are encountering with this set. It might be a great deal.

Then again, it might be like my set which has problems accepting 1080p signals from DVI1 and HDMI. I still have 1 fully functional DVI port with HDCP, so I don't mind this as much. On the HDMI port and the DVI1 ports, I have an upconverting DVD player (HDMI) and my PC (DVI1). The only problems with these ports is that the image doesn't properly display (sometimes the image is jumbled) at 1080p. There is a firmware update for my TV that resolves the HDMI port issues, but it involves packing your TV up, shipping it to Westinghouse, and waiting 2-4 weeks for a replacement monitor (you will not get the same monitor you sent in). My current LCD panel in my monitor is great (little to no banding, no dead pixels), so I hesitate to ship it back, be without it for a month, and then discover that I now have a lesser monitor.

In the end, it's your call, but I'd hold out and see what the general public has to say about the new 42" Westy that's coming in April. ::shrugs::

[Ty]

Once upon a time I was pretty much a cornerstone of the 42w2 thread.... which is most of the reason why I could never buy one of them. A great tv for the money, but once you are aware of every little flaw it becomes a psychological block. I skim AVS far more startegically now after that and the D92 debacle. I suspect the TX will have their problems too, but we'll see. The TX series is on the shopping list if I decide not to buy now. Memorial Day sales should a good time to decide.

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

Indeed! Like I said, if you're willing to live with the problems, it's a good set... You just have to be willing to live with the problems. ;)

[JeffDM]

I don't think a little patience would hurt. I wonder if the Visio is a little too cheap to be good news. In my experience, Sam's is pretty good about returns, but transporting something that large is very inconvenient, should you decide you buy it then decide you don't like it, and return it.

[LOUiE]

From your posts, it sounds as if your fear of burn-in is a bit greater than your desire for a larger set. In that case, I'd go with a 42" LCD, possibly wait for the new Westy like you are thinking about. That sounds like the best option with your circumstances, at least for what is out there at the moment.

Or you can wait for reviews of the new Westy, and if good enough, wait for the inevitable 47" model that will come a couple months later. :)

[Ty]

I don't think a little patience would hurt. I wonder if the Visio is a little too cheap to be good news. In my experience, Sam's is pretty good about returns, but transporting something that large is very inconvenient, should you decide you buy it then decide you don't like it, and return it.
The Vizio got the axe. Default color temp tracks nearly 10K and is not user adjustable. They provide RGB primaries to adjust but contrary to what the people on AVS think they're utterly useless without the proper measurement equipment. That and a green push bug on the HDMI input was enough.

Like I say, I swear I really am not that picky but I can't find a set that doesn't have a deal breaking flaw. Accurate color and grey ramps is not an unreasonable expectation, nor is the consistency of those features across all video inputs.

[Ty]

Or you can wait for reviews of the new Westy, and if good enough, wait for the inevitable 47" model that will come a couple months later. :)

The 47 and 42 should premier at the same time in April this time. I'm confident that Westinghouse learned their lesson after the disaster they had launching the previous 47. It all depends upon price really. I have an idea of where the real street prices on the TX series will land, but they're close enough to the Sharp models now it takes away some of the appeal. The Sharp sets are coming down in price far faster than I thought they would, but the banding they exhibit are defects and are not to be tolerated. Until they can fix them they're off the list too.

[ColoradoJim]

Do you absolutely need a flat panel TV for your space? Some of those rear projection sets are pretty thin after all and obviously I posted about the D-ILA display by JVC. I'm guessing you specified flat panel because of lack of floor space? JVC has some models that take up less than 12 inches deep and Sony also has the SXRD sets that are also less than 12 inches.

[mulveling]

This is why I'm really glad I bought a 34" super-fine-pitch Sony HD CRT a little over 2 years ago. The image quality still beats most of the consumer HDTV sets today. It was the right display for the right price at the right time...

Still, the newest HDTV sets are getting tempting - bigger & sexier, some with 1080p resolutions, and the prices are coming down to decent levels.

Like you, I'm extremely picky about LCD/DLP artifacts & issues. It would be difficult for me to live with either one. I really like plasma, but you don't get much resolution for the money - 1024x768 for a 42" set is weak these days.

Have you considered the new JVC DILA rear projection sets? Saw them at BB the other day and they looked super - couldn't discern any annoying artifacts off the bat, other than the usual RP viewing angle issues. Image quality was comparable to a good 1080p DLP minus the motion artifcats :) They were quite tempting, in fact. Between the JVC and the prices coming down on 42" Pioneer plasmas (IIRC the Tweeter website had them for $1600 last week; don't know if they're still available), it's the first time in 2 years I've considered buying a new HDTV.

Edit: Oops, just now saw that the post above me mentions the JVC. Yeah, these look like an awesome TV for the money.

[Ty]

I have nothing against the JVC sets. If I were in the market for RP they'd be my top pick. I just do not have the space for them. The current CRT set throws a wrench in the whole room layout (you don't want to know what I had to do to my 5.1 arrangement to make it even work at all) and I really need to move to something that doesn't stick out from the wall at all. I'll admit I partially want flat just to have it (something too many buyers are sucked into), but I have plenty of valid reasons for wanting a flatpanel.

This thread has actually done a pretty good job of doing what I wanted it to do. I've pretty much talked myself back out of considering any plasmas. I think I'll be watching the 46-47" LCD prices closely for a while. I had almost forgotten all the good reasons why I was limiting myself to a 1080p choice and now I remember them with all the research I've been doing lately.