Ponyo on the Cliff (Ghibli/Miyazaki) discussion

[Lego]

While I'm not a huge Ghibli guy, some new has come out about Miyazaki's latest movie.

3-19-07 (3:05AM EDT)---- Gake No Ueno Ponyo To Be Miyazaki's Next
At a press conference held on March 19th, Toho and Studio Ghibli announced Hayao Miyazaki's next directed film will be the full length anime feature Gake no Ueno Horyo or Gake No Ueno Ponyo ("Ponyo On A Cliff") (there are several different pronunciations currently circulating), it will be released to theaters in Japan in July, 2008. This marks the master animator's first return to the director's chair in 4 years. At that time he made Howl's Moving Castle which grossed 19.6 billion Yen at the box office, drawing in excess of 15 million people. The plot will based on an entirely original screenplay and tell the story of "goldfish princess" and a 5 year boy who lives in a seaside town and vows to become a man. Miyazaki based the scenery on Setouchi in Okayama prefecture where he lived in 2005. According to producer Toshi Suzuki, the story is in someway based on Miyazaki's real life experience with his eldest son Goro (director of Gedo Senki) when he was 5 years old. The theme will be "Little Mermaid" with a thick Japanese twist. The story is halfway completed presently. He adds Ghibli will return return to their "zero point" with no CG to be used in animation process. The illustrations will be "drawn simply like those of a child". These guidelines wil pose a different challenge than past works. They are quite eager to get on with it.

[Andrew Cunningham]

Well, that sounds much better than the weepy melodrama the rumor mill had him working on.

[Lego]

Well, that sounds much better than the weepy melodrama the rumor mill had him working on.


I like some Ghibli movies but things like Howl's and Earth Sea bored me to tears. This sounds pretty interesting though.

[Andrew Cunningham]

Howl's was weirdly bad. I mean, the book had a good story, and the second he abandoned it the entire thing just spiraled out of control and made no sense at all structurally.
Sayonara Zetsubo Sensei spent all of volume 8 working in barbed digs against Earthsea and the nepotism that allowed Goro to direct without having to prove he had actual talent.

But Porco Rosso may be the greatest animated film of all time.

[Takato]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*

[EmperorBrandon]

I liked Mononoke, but it's likely my least favorite out of the Miyazaki films I've seen. I haven't watched Howl's yet. I actually have it and still haven't got the DVD out of shrinkwrap (need to watch it this week since I have time).

[Andrew Cunningham]

Nausicaa is actually a Mononoke clone -- the Mononoke Hime picture book was first published long before he started work on Nausicaa, and he kept coming back to those ideas over the next dozen years.

[Salock]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*
Not at all. While I do not think it is better than Princess Mononoke, I'd still rank it higher than his other films.

Of course, when it comes to Studio Ghibli in its entirety, nothing beats Whisper of the Heart.

[Arcturus]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*
Not at all. While I do not think it is better than Princess Mononoke, I'd still rank it higher than his other films.

Of course, when it comes to Studio Ghibli in its entirety, nothing beats Whisper of the Heart.

Howl's, I think, is a movie that gets better with repeated viewings.

Spirited Away is still my number one Ghibli movie, with Whisper of the Heart a close second.

[christianlf]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*

I liked Howl's, but I don't think it fares well in comparison to some of his other work. But, I found it enjoyable all the same. Conversely, I think Mononoke is his best movie work. I do prefer the Nausicaa manga, though.

[Helschadenfreude]

Am I the only one that didn't like Totoro,Laputa and Whisper of the Heart? I mean it's blashemy and I say they're okay to those who gush.. but I really didn't get it... I like princess Mononoke and Howl's a lot though.

[Captain Impulse]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*

Nope, I loved Howl's. My only complaint was the slightly rushed ending. I think most of the criticism of Howl's comes from the fact that the anime viewing community has "matured" over the years and thus Miyazaki's "magic" is starting to wear on people, because they've seen it all before in one aspect or another. I would imagine a viewer fresh to Miyazaki would find it to be a breath of fresh air compared to the other crap that's released these days.

[Andrew Cunningham]

Dismissive much? Miyazaki's worst is still better than 90% of everything else, and each scene works really well, but it really doesn't hang together as a whole.
The clumsy anti-war message is shoehorned in and not allowed to develop into much of anything, the villain is randomly reduced to an old crone depriving the film of any kind of climax, and the central conceit of the novel -- that the old woman is actually a witch and doesn't know it -- is never stated clearly, only suggested by her randomly growing younger and older. I honestly couldn't tell if me knowing that part about the story was making me assume that was the explanation, or if it was actually supposed to be the explanation and everyone who hadn't read the book was just confused.
I think a lot of the harsh words it receives are because Miyazaki has such a strong track record with his previous films. We hold him to a higher standard. He should know better than to go into production before the script is done.

[pianocello]

The plot will based on an entirely original screenplay and tell the story of "goldfish princess" and a 5 year boy

The mention of a 5 year old boy worries me though. Having had enough of those annoying brats in Eureka 7 , I'm wondering whether we're either going to get something very childish or whether we're going to have some annoying brat annoying the audience for 90% of the movie.

[Puppet Master]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*

No not really I liked Howl's Moving Castle as well.

[EmperorBrandon]

Am I the only one that didn't like Totoro,Laputa and Whisper of the Heart? I mean it's blashemy and I say they're okay to those who gush.. but I really didn't get it... I like princess Mononoke and Howl's a lot though.

Well, there's already two people in this thread that have admitted Whisper of the Heart is really high on their list. It's likely my top favorite myself, or close to it (haven't rewatched it enough at this point)

[ooga]

Howl's put me to sleep so hopefully this one is a bit better.
I can't fault Miyazaki for it though, I think the source material was a bit on the dull side. Then again he probably chose the story, so maybe I should fault him for it. Damn you Miyazaki!! :P

[Herufaiya]

Ghibli fans should also be looking forward to Bokurano, as the main staff is almost entirely members of Ghibli.

[jojo_home]

I wish Miyazaki would go back to his understated phase like in the late 80s and early 90s.

[jojo_home]

Whisper of the Heart is up there for me along with Totoro and Kiki, although I admit it is a bit on the leisurely side.

[jojo_home]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*

Nope, I loved Howl's. My only complaint was the slightly rushed ending. I think most of the criticism of Howl's comes from the fact that the anime viewing community has "matured" over the years and thus Miyazaki's "magic" is starting to wear on people, because they've seen it all before in one aspect or another. I would imagine a viewer fresh to Miyazaki would find it to be a breath of fresh air compared to the other crap that's released these days.


I might be the only one who doesn't like Miyazaki's action movies as much as his "stroll through the fields and do nothing" ones. I thought Laputa, Nausicaa, Mononoke and Howl were all weaker than Kiki, Totoro and Porco. I guess I don't like the fact that I always feel Miyazaki flinches when it comes to action scenes. I always get the feeling he's simultaneously exciting the audience as well as condemning them for enjoying violent action.

[Mazinkaizer]

Am I the only one who actually likes Howl's Moving Castle? I actually think it's my favorite Studio Ghibli film. I think it's a lot better than Princess Mononoke. *coughnausicaaclonecough*

Nope, because along with Laputa & Naussica they're my favorites :)

[ooga]

I might be the only one who doesn't like Miyazaki's action movies as much as his "stroll through the fields and do nothing" ones. I thought Laputa, Nausicaa, Mononoke and Howl were all weaker than Kiki, Totoro and Porco.


Porco Rosso was pretty action packed. More than Howl IMO.

[Andrew Cunningham]

But it's whimsically full of action. Not really intense.

[EricMcG]

Since this morphed into a "I like this Miyazaki best" thread...
I find Princess Mononoke to be his best work, and a top 10 film in any genre. It has the most depth of any of this other works and a superb translation from Neil Gaiman. It's one fault is that it doesn't convey the passage of time well.

Kiki's Delivery Service comes next for feel good film.

Castle of Cagliostro for pure fun.

Nausicaa as an artsy fable enjoyable to watch without being preachy

Howl's Moving Castle for it's tech/magic world and the growth of all main characters within a 2 hour show. No mean feat in itself.

Laputa classic action adventure

Porco Rosso action adventure comedy

Spirited Away mainly for artistic design and middle story, beginning and ending were very weak. Only the French dub was good, even the Japanese I found weak in places.

Whiper of the Heart, The Cat Returns (somewhat related) not my cup of tea. Enjoyable enough to watch.

[StudioZEL]

Laputa and Porco Rosso are my favorites of Miyazaki's movies! ^_^

[FUNiRepBlue]

Am I the only one that didn't like Totoro,Laputa and Whisper of the Heart? I mean it's blashemy and I say they're okay to those who gush.. but I really didn't get it... I like princess Mononoke and Howl's a lot though.

Well, there's already two people in this thread that have admitted Whisper of the Heart is really high on their list. It's likely my top favorite myself, or close to it (haven't rewatched it enough at this point)

I like Whispers of the Heart as well. Although I liked The Cat Returns more. I liked what he did with Howl's Moving Castle, I thought Spirited Away was a masterpiece as well as Princess Mononoke. Kiki's Delivery Service is a classic. I haven't seen Earthsea yet but so far only one Ghibli film has been released I didn't like (and didn't buy) and that was My Neighbors the Yamadas. I don't know if it was the drawing style or what but I couldn't get into it and just didn't care for it.

Back to the topic though, I am pumped about this new one. A Japanese style Little Mermaid? I'm sold already. Actually just having that Pedigree name Ghibli sold me...I watch everything they release and out of all the releases only not liking one isn't bad..
(again just my 2 cent opinions :D )

[chronoclast]

A trailer for Poyno on the Cliff has leaked online and can be seen here: http://twitchfilm.net/site/view/trailer-for-miyazakis-ponyo-on-the-cliff-arrives-online#extended

After watching it, I really want to see this film now.

[Lego]

A trailer for Poyno on the Cliff has leaked online and can be seen here: http://twitchfilm.net/site/view/trailer-for-miyazakis-ponyo-on-the-cliff-arrives-online#extended

After watching it, I really want to see this film now.

Cuteness overload ;)

[djanss]

A trailer for Poyno on the Cliff has leaked online and can be seen here: http://twitchfilm.net/site/view/trailer-for-miyazakis-ponyo-on-the-cliff-arrives-online#extended

After watching it, I really want to see this film now.

And let's see, is it going to be another completely out-of-context dialogue free music video for the pleasant, new-agey end-credits song, conveying absolutely nothing of the plot and atmosphere, like the trailers for his last several films?
<clicks>
Apparently so. At least the morning-show hosts have a better idea what's going on.

(And the trans-Pacific Ghibli-Pixar friendship continues, as we now know that Hayao has seen "Finding Nemo".) :)

[JINROH]

I am a self confessed Ghibli addict,and anything Miyazaki,has so far in my eyes been plain magic.Good to hear less or no CG will be used.And Howl is one
of my favorite Ghibli movies.I really cant wait to see this.In fact I think I'll toss on the dvd for Howl right now !

[Atomsk]

Actually I wouldn't mind if Miyazaki produced a full CGI movie. It's not like CGI will automaticaly make an anime awefull. Just look at "The ghiblies" and the curry commercials Studio Ghibli made. I'd love to see an entire movie made like that.

Anyway, a new Ghibli movie is always worth checking out. Goro better return to managing the ghibli museum.

[danth78]

Since we're all giving our 2 cents, I liked Kiki the best of all Ghibli's films. I love Miyazake's art and enjoyed his Nausicaa manga, but overall, I think Ghibli/Miyazake is really overrated. Mononoke was just weird, Spirited Away was okay but felt too long, Nausicaa was a little too messianic for my taste (like ego-insertion for the viewer -- you are the chosen one!), and I lost interest in Porco Rosso after seeing the titular hog win a air-to-sea battle by being reckless and getting lucky.

Speaking of Whisper of the Heart, I enjoyed the scenes out of the girl's book the best! I wished the whole movie was about that! I haven't seen Mr. Cat returns...is that what it's about?

[jojo_home]

Well, the trailer is cute.

I'm cautiously optimistic. I have never "bought" Miyazaki's romances (San and Ashitaka, Chihiro and Dragon Boy, Howl and Sophie, Sheeta and Pazu) so I don't know if this will end up acceptable to me. Not that I don't like those movies, but I just think Miyazaki's romances seem very contrived.

I did like Whisper of the Heart, but more for the mood and atmosphere than the romantic subplot.

My favourite Miyazakis are the less bombastic ones--Kiki, Totoro, Porco.

[HellKorn]

The trailer really didn't do anything except reveal the color scheme. The constant "KAWAII!" started to grate and the song falls way too short compared to Totoro.

[...] I lost interest in Porco Rosso after seeing the titular hog win a air-to-sea battle by being reckless and getting lucky.

Blasphemy!

On the subject of the Ghibli films, Porco Rosso is my favorite. Miyazaki was in a transitional period then and really hit all the right numbers.

After that would be Princess Mononoke (about the closest we'll ever be to his epic Nausicaä manga, considering the simplicity of that movie adaption), followed by Spirited Away (which is derivative of his prior work and a bit scattershot, but easily the best directorial effort).

To round out the top five, it's a toss-up between Whisper of the Heart and Only Yesterday.

[Quarkboy]

Hey, I went and saw this movie tonight so here's my little spoiler free review:

I hate to say it, but this was my least favorite Miyazaki movie I've seen. That still means it's better than most stuff hollywood puts out, but even so this is far from the masterpieces he's produced in the past. Unfortunately the movie tries very hard to be a movie for small children, but seems to approach it by taking a movie like spirited away and then placing limits on it to leave it accessible to children instead of creating a movie designed for children from the ground up.
When I say limits, I mean a couple of things: One, the movie has very few main characters... 3, to be precise. The titular Ponyo, Sousuke aged 5, and Sousuke's mom Risa (perhaps Lisa... not sure the official romanization). Everyone else gets pretty dinky screen time. Also, the movie takes place almost entirely in one small seaside port town, and even further restricted to either sousuke's home or the kindergarten/nursing home combo where Sousuke goes to school and his mom works at the nursing home (or the road/ocean between them). Also, the plot itself is limited to basically 3 acts, and the overall story is quite simple. And finally, the animation is limited, purposefully. Only once or twice does the incredible complexity and fluidity the Ghibli is capable of come out, and most of the time the animation is good, but far simpler than previous ghibli works. On the plus side, the integration of CG effects is flawless.
All this would make for a good kid's movie, except the contents simply don't deliver. The slow pacing and leisurely pans over nature remain, and the humor comes completely from the innocent childlike behavior of the sousuke and ponyo... so it's really only funny to adults (children wouldn't think acting like a child is particularly funny). It's not a love story, either, unless you consider 5 year old crushes love. So then, is it an adventure? Not really. Is there danger? Only superficially. Evil people that have to be defeated? Unlike most miyazaki movies where there are usually sympathetic villains with maybe ambiguous intentions, the villain in this film is only a villain in appearance...

Okay, so maybe it's not a great kids movie, but is it a deep tale of environmentalism, or an anti-war epic, or both? Nope. Although there are some scenes of pollution in the ocean at the beginning, they go away after act one and the movie actually celebrates ships and sailors and people living with the ocean... There's really no clear environmental message at all.

So anyway, I'm not sure I can recommend this movie. I did enjoy it, but only so much as it reminded me of the time when I was a little kid. I think that most children would be quite bored. One interesting point: It has the shortest credit sequence at the end in any movie I've seen in a LONG time. Either hardly anyone actually worked on this film or they managed to hide all the names somewhere.

One other complaint: If it's a movie for children, it sure teaches some bad lessons:
1. If you are lost and a strange man in a striped suit comes up to you and tells you he's going to take you to where you mother is, go with him, it's okay.
2. If you are playing by the ocean and you see a strange looking creature stuck in a glass jar, crack the jar with a rock and then pick it up with your bare hands and bring it back to your house. Put it in a bucket with some water and then poke it until it wakes up.
3. If you are driving in a rainstorm and you come to a river crossing, even if it looks like there's a lot of fast moving water in the crossing you can make it through if you just drive fast enough (especially if you are in a tiny Japanese car).
4. Goldfish's favorite food is ham. They don't like bread.
5. Even if your town is under 30 feet of water for 48 hours, there won't be any permanent damage.