PS3 firmware 1.80 tomorrow

[Skywise]

http://www.scee.presscentre.com/Content/Detail.asp?ReleaseID=4372&NewsAreaID=2

DLNA looks very exciting from where I sit, and the upscaling of games and DVDs won't go amiss either.

[Kaikou]

I cannot wait for this update! It will be very interesting to see the quality of the upcoverting, especially in FFXII.

[ic14]

It better fix the problems with Kingdom Hearts 2 on PAL PS3s.

[Fudce]

The streaming to PC intregues me, guess I'll find out more tomorrow.

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

Quick question: What the flip-flop is DLNA? Am I going to have to buy special hardware to stream my video from my PC to the PS3 (other than a router)?

[Big_JIMMBOW]

so is this UK only or global?

[Sensuifu]

Intrested to see what DLNA has to offer. I'm already streaming MP3s from my PC to the PS3, though I'm hoping something like XBMC/MCE with full media streaming capabilities, options, and support will be released.

[Kaikou]

What time do firmware updates usually get released? (hoping for 12AM :P)

[Skywise]

so is this UK only or global?

The PR is up on the US site as well - I just linked to the European one because that was the one I had in front of me.

http://www.us.playstation.com/News/PressReleases/400

[Zanza Hiro]

oh wow, this is a huge update

hopefully this will satisfy all the forum gamers on other sites that always ask about the whole upscaling update :D

[Skywise]

Quick question: What the flip-flop is DLNA? Am I going to have to buy special hardware to stream my video from my PC to the PS3 (other than a router)?

More like special software. Googling gives me this product for example:

http://www.twonkyvision.com/Products/TwonkyMedia/index.html

[Chacranajxy]

This upscaling business has me interested... as long as it's implemented well and not a broken piece of shit. I'm thinking I'll be buying my PS3 literally tomorrow, so we'll see.

[ADC]

So long as the upscaling is better than you get on my Philips DVD "player," it should be fine. Won't make me buy one — there aren't games yet which interest me, nor will there be within the next six months or so. So by the time I'm ready, the 80GB model will be out (so they can obscure the fact that the damn'd thing's still $600 by "adding value").

[WRX]

This upscaling business has me interested... as long as it's implemented well and not a broken piece of shit.
Yeah, me too. If the new update makes PS2 games look better than they would on a PS2 in HD then it'd another big step towards convincing me to buy a PS3. I'll probably still wait for the Ratchet & Clank PS3 game though.

[Ender]

It's available now, I'm downloading it. Unfortunately I don't have an HDTV anymore, so I can't test the upscaling.

[Kaikou]

It's available now, I'm downloading it. Unfortunately I don't have an HDTV anymore, so I can't test the upscaling.

Downloading it now as well and will give a report on how upscaling looks.

Edit:

First impressions playing Final Fantasy XII, are just okay. I was hoping upscaling would prevent black bars from being on all four sides of my screen, but they are still present.

The image looks a bit cleaner overall, but for FFXII the jump in quality isn't much. Selecting the smoothing option produced expected results of a very softened image with detail loss.

Very impressed with DVD upscaling (Normal), which to me looks just as good as my Oppo. There is something called "Double Scale", which on my TV produces black bars on all sides of the screen.

[Buster Darkwings]

In addition to upscaling, the reports say there is an option for 1080p24 output, playing Blu-Ray discs at 720p is now possible, BTB and WTW are no longer clipped, and cadence detection is now present for deinterlacing:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=650544&page=163&pp=30

The PS3 is now one of the best DVD/BD players on the market, and probably the best for the price. Now if they can only add DTS-MA support...

[Sensuifu]

It's available now, I'm downloading it. Unfortunately I don't have an HDTV anymore, so I can't test the upscaling.

Downloading it now as well and will give a report on how upscaling looks.

Edit:

First impressions playing Final Fantasy XII, are just okay. I was hoping upscaling would prevent black bars from being on all four sides of my screen, but they are still present.



I think the 1080p upscaling is still broken for games. I used Tekken5 for testing and not only is the picture quality worse than using progressive 480p mode, the image is locked to the game's native res, yet scaled to fit inside the 1080p frame. In other words, the game is pillarboxed, using what appears to be 480p, and doesn't look any better than it would coming from the PS2.


Very impressed with DVD upscaling (Normal), which to me looks just as good as my Oppo.

I think DVD quality surpasses the Oppo. No contest. I was stunned how PQ actually popped out at me. Excellent update and much needed, I'll probably sell my Oppo now. :D

[Sensuifu]

In addition to upscaling, the reports say there is an option for 1080p24 output, playing Blu-Ray discs at 720p is now possible, BTB and WTW are no longer clipped, and cadence detection is now present for deinterlacing:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=650544&page=163&pp=30

The PS3 is now one of the best DVD/BD players on the market, and probably the best for the price. Now if they can only add DTS-MA support...



Interestingly, DVD playback did receive a major overhaul. From my initial impressions on a few DVDs I tested, PQ exceeded that of my Oppo. Surprising, because before the update the PS3 was no better in DVD playback than the PS2. The PS3 is known to be a superb BD player, and the update makes DVD playback rival the best out there. Still, comparing it to my Oppo (971) isn't exactly fair, considering I display 480/720p which is then scaled to 1080p on my TV. So there is cross-conversion going on still, which hurts PQ. Someone with the 981 could probably give a better comparison, though I doubt it'll be any different, considering there are a lot of problems I spotted with the Oppo after the PS3 update. :sd:

I'm favoring the PS3 as my main DVD player now. :D

[Buster Darkwings]

Do you or anyone have any 30fps DVDs you can check to see how they perform? I won't be able to check mine until the day after tomorrow or so.

R1 titles I know of include Gundam Seed (but not Destiny, not sure about the movies) and Saber Marionette J to X. Possibly Rozen Maiden, as I know the R2s of Traumend are 30fps.

[Skywise]

I think DVD quality surpasses the Oppo. No contest. I was stunned how PQ actually popped out at me. Excellent update and much needed, I'll probably sell my Oppo now. :D

I wouldn't sell it just yet - wait until Secrets tests the updated firmware. HQV is one thing, while real world material is another. Both the ATI and Nvidia video cards for instance are supposed to do well on HQV, but in reality I've found that it's not the case. I wish I could test it myself right now, but since my PS3 is region locked to region 3 I don't really have any discs I can use.

[Skywise]

Quick question: What the flip-flop is DLNA? Am I going to have to buy special hardware to stream my video from my PC to the PS3 (other than a router)?

More like special software. Googling gives me this product for example:

http://www.twonkyvision.com/Products/TwonkyMedia/index.html



Or looks like you could just use WMP. From the AVS thread linked earlier:

Simply go to WMP Tools>Options>Library>Configuring Sharing> Allow "Unknown Device"

[Skywise]

I am a bit annoyed that the upscaling doesn't allow for games that have widescreen support. I was thinking that the Full option would fix that, but when I tried it my projector completely desynched from the PS3.

[Leon_Belmont]

Wow, the first impressions pretty much already have me locked on a PS3. I'd yet to get around for buying an upscaling player yet but have been meaning too, and while I suspect "better than Oppo" may be a bit out of proportion, if it's comparable, then I'm pretty much in.

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

Quick question: What the flip-flop is DLNA? Am I going to have to buy special hardware to stream my video from my PC to the PS3 (other than a router)?

More like special software. Googling gives me this product for example:

http://www.twonkyvision.com/Products/TwonkyMedia/index.html



Or looks like you could just use WMP. From the AVS thread linked earlier:

Simply go to WMP Tools>Options>Library>Configuring Sharing> Allow "Unknown Device"

Cool. So I DON'T have to buy Windows Vista or Media Center in order to take advantage of this... My wallet sighs with relief. ;)

I was up late last night watching Pirates 2 (Blu-Ray = YUM!) and working on my PC, so I did not get a chance to download this update. I'll try to do it this evening, girlfriend permitting, and post the results here.

[Chris Beveridge]

The update is certainly yum; I really liked doing the streaming aspect of it and have been adding thousands of new files to be able to access.

Though it's likely of little importance to most, I love the new slideshow format they've added. The slideshows in general are some of my favorite parts of the system since it lets me show off the high resolution images I take (as well as being a useful screensaver every now and then) and the newest one added is pretty solid.

Definitely becoming a great media center for my theater room.

[ic14]

I dont think adding upscaling makes the thing any less of a rip off.


Er anyway, i cant get the update. It keeps coming up with an error message. Either evey single PS3 owner in Europe is downloading it at the same time, or theres some other problem.

[lostnomad84]

So long as the upscaling is better than you get on my Philips DVD "player," it should be fine. Won't make me buy one — there aren't games yet which interest me, nor will there be within the next six months or so. So by the time I'm ready, the 80GB model will be out (so they can obscure the fact that the damn'd thing's still $600 by "adding value").

I don't think I could have said it any better. The new download is a huge improvement on the media side of things. However, I own an upscale Sony DVD player already and I am not really in the market for a digital media center at the moment either. At least I know or when the games start rolling out on the system and if I ever decide to buy one there will be nice features on the system to toy around with.

[Sensuifu]

I think DVD quality surpasses the Oppo. No contest. I was stunned how PQ actually popped out at me. Excellent update and much needed, I'll probably sell my Oppo now. :D

I wouldn't sell it just yet - wait until Secrets tests the updated firmware. HQV is one thing, while real world material is another. Both the ATI and Nvidia video cards for instance are supposed to do well on HQV, but in reality I've found that it's not the case.


Yeah, I'm waiting to see what Secrets' analysis and benchmarks say. There is a lot of improvement though from what I can tell, and wouldn't be surprised if the PS3 actually outperforms many of the other high ranking players.


I wish I could test it myself right now, but since my PS3 is region locked to region 3 I don't really have any discs I can use.

That's the reason why I'm not going to sell off my Oppo just yet. ;) I realized I'd be without a good region-free player. Well, almost. I could always burn a copy of the non-region disc to play on the PS3, but then that's too time consuming.

[Sensuifu]

I am a bit annoyed that the upscaling doesn't allow for games that have widescreen support. I was thinking that the Full option would fix that, but when I tried it my projector completely desynched from the PS3.

yep. I was expecting the games to take full advantage of 'hardware' assistance, rather than being scaled in 'software'. Unfortunate the games don't look anywhere as nice as the progressive modes.

[Ty]

To check for 2:2 cadence detection? Hopefully Secrets will update their review soon.

[MajinVejita]

yep. I was expecting the games to take full advantage of 'hardware' assistance, rather than being scaled in 'software'. Unfortunate the games don't look anywhere as nice as the progressive modes.

Sadly, you'll have to get used to this. Sony removed the EE chip from the European consoles, therefore any future firmware updates will be software as opposed to hardware driven (since they're for the global market).

My only wish? Region free backwards compatibility. If only that existed, I would throw my PS2 away today.

-Corey

[Zanza Hiro]

man, this is the awesomest firmware update to date!

i just updated and am trying out some of my DVD's, definitely look sharper/clearer then i remember. also put in a few PS2 games, Okami and GoW2 look amazing, FFXII looks good but not as big a difference as some other games

best thing is this new Wifi hub capability. i just enabled network settings on all four PC's in my house, now have access to over a terabyte of music, images and video on my tv! thx Sony, you guys are kicking so much ass nowadays :D

[Big_JIMMBOW]

If anyone's interested, you can go HERE (http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/05/24/ps3-upscales-ps2-games-and-makes-them-look-fantastic-continued/) to view some rollovers of PS3 480 vs. 1080

[ADC]

If anyone's interested, you can go HERE (http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/05/24/ps3-upscales-ps2-games-and-makes-them-look-fantastic-continued/) to view some rollovers of PS3 480 vs. 1080
I sure hope the actual results are better than those rollovers suggest. Otherwise, all they do is blur the images. The upscaled images looked like shit.

[Ty]

If anyone's interested, you can go HERE (http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/05/24/ps3-upscales-ps2-games-and-makes-them-look-fantastic-continued/) to view some rollovers of PS3 480 vs. 1080
Seems fishy to me. Both the color balance and the black level of the scaled images are noticeably different. I seriously doubt that washed out black floor is being introduced by the scaling process.

[Sensuifu]

If anyone's interested, you can go HERE (http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/05/24/ps3-upscales-ps2-games-and-makes-them-look-fantastic-continued/) to view some rollovers of PS3 480 vs. 1080
Seems fishy to me. Both the color balance and the black level of the scaled images are noticeably different. I seriously doubt that washed out black floor is being introduced by the scaling process.


That's actually what happens when games are upscaled, they looked washed out and blurry. At least on my setup they do. Supposedly others don't suffer from it as badly.

[Ty]

If anyone's interested, you can go HERE (http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/05/24/ps3-upscales-ps2-games-and-makes-them-look-fantastic-continued/) to view some rollovers of PS3 480 vs. 1080
Seems fishy to me. Both the color balance and the black level of the scaled images are noticeably different. I seriously doubt that washed out black floor is being introduced by the scaling process.


That's actually what happens when games are upscaled, they looked washed out and blurry. At least on my setup they do. Supposedly others don't suffer from it as badly.
As long as Sony is committed to continuing to improve the features instead of leaving them broken it's not that big of a deal for now.

[Ender]

As long as Sony is committed to continuing to improve the features instead of leaving them broken it's not that big of a deal for now.

I appreciate that they're trying to make improvements, but didn't they figure out back on the PS2 that texture blurring was a bunch of crap? Why is Sony so stubbornly against anti-aliasing?

[Ty]

As long as Sony is committed to continuing to improve the features instead of leaving them broken it's not that big of a deal for now.

I appreciate that they're trying to make improvements, but didn't they figure out back on the PS2 that texture blurring was a bunch of crap? Why is Sony so stubbornly against anti-aliasing?
I suspect they've designed themselves into a corner and cannot easily implement the feature. We know Sony would never admit it if this were the case. Also, I can't help but wonder if all these comparisons are unscaled/unsmoothed against scaled/smoothed. It's my understanding that the features are separate and you can let it scale and NOT use the smoothing.

[Ender]

I suspect they've designed themselves into a corner and cannot easily implement the feature.


I've messed around with a few emulators, and my four year old laptop has no trouble upscaling to 1024x768 and anti-aliasing. Surely if a PC with less power and more system overhead can do it, then the PS3 should be able to do it without breaking a sweat. Hopefully they'll figure this out and work AA into a future update, PS1 games look incredibly good with it.

[Fieri]

It better fix the problems with Kingdom Hearts 2 on PAL PS3s.

I think you better give up hope (http://kotaku.com/gaming/abandon-all-hope/180-firmware-sorry-pal-no-backwards+compatability-relief-263774.php) on that one....

[Brunnen-G]

I've started to notice the washed out colors myself. Testing with .hack//G.U 2 on the green grass. Also that the ps3 seems to underscan some and when i play with the filter off there is a thin grey bar on the right side.

[ic14]

Im not sure whther it was this update, or the previous one but Canis Canem Edit doesnt look like crap anymore on a PAL PS3.

Its all smooth looking, with a lot less jaggies (this is with smoothing turned on BTW, on a SDTV)

Ridge Racer V (the jaggiest PS2 game ive got) is still a bit jaggy, but no where near as bad as it was on PS2 (again, this is with smoothing turned on)

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

UPDATE: Upscaling to 1080p on the DVDs looks very nice. I don't use my PS3 for PS1 or 2 games, so I don't know how that looks.

[Ender]

I bought a new TV today, and PS2 upscaling looks great. Unfortunately PS1 games still look like ass, I really hope Sony continues to refine the upscaling and adds true antialiasing.

[Kaikou]

I bought a new TV today, and PS2 upscaling looks great. Unfortunately PS1 games still look like ass, I really hope Sony continues to refine the upscaling and adds true antialiasing.

I wish they would improve the PS1 emulation altogether. I'm still suprised a lot of the Final Fantasy games have problems.

[ADC]

I wish they would improve the PS1 emulation altogether. I'm still suprised a lot of the Final Fantasy games have problems.
I don't think I am. I remember reading that a lot of PS1 games were developed specifically for the hardware rather than via Sony's APIs, and those games (including the FFs) have the most problems. God only knows how many different problems there are in making PS1 games work on the PS3 even when they're programmed in the "safe" manner.

[Ty]

I bought a new TV today, and PS2 upscaling looks great. Unfortunately PS1 games still look like ass, I really hope Sony continues to refine the upscaling and adds true antialiasing.
Which tv? In all my experimentations so far with flatpanel HD sets I've found that PS2 games look worse than any other generation of game on them oddly enough. I find it amusing and ironic that NES and SNES games look quite good and PS1 games look about the same pixellated mess they've always been. I wasn't expecting the unplayable garbage that greeted me when I started testing out PS2 games though. I guess it goes to show just how low the output resolution of the PS2 really is.

[Ender]

I bought the newest Westinghouse 32" LCD. (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8250144&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050006&id=1169512290376)

[ADC]

I bought the newest Westinghouse 32" LCD. (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8250144&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050006&id=1169512290376)
Sweet. I have its predecessor and have been very pleased with its performance as a gaming screen (which is pretty much all I use it for — not a big TV guy).

[Ender]

Sweet. I have its predecessor and have been very pleased with its performance as a gaming screen (which is pretty much all I use it for — not a big TV guy).

Two of my friends have the same one you do, that's what led me to pick this up. It's a great TV, and the dirt cheap price just makes it even sweeter.

[Ty]

I bought the newest Westinghouse 32" LCD. (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8250144&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050006&id=1169512290376)
The ATI Xilleon video processing isn't doing any favors, otherwise it's a fine panel for the most part. If you don't need size having a smaller tv really controls the damage done to older graphics. My thoughts come from viewing on 40+ screens. The PS2 really suffers at that point. I've found my collection of NES/SNES games to look quite good though. :sd:

[ic14]

Is out now. It fixes a problem with HDMI from what the release notes said.

But for PAL PS3 owners there something more important - it looks like theres been some fixes with the PS2/PSone BC

Cant confirm it (since the website still listed 1.70 when i listed checked) but Kingdom Hearts 2 doesn't have the unbeatable boss in the TRON world anymore.

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

I bought the newest Westinghouse 32" LCD. (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8250144&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050006&id=1169512290376)
The ATI Xilleon video processing isn't doing any favors, otherwise it's a fine panel for the most part. If you don't need size having a smaller tv really controls the damage done to older graphics. My thoughts come from viewing on 40+ screens. The PS2 really suffers at that point. I've found my collection of NES/SNES games to look quite good though. :sd:

I have the older LVM-42w2 monitor from Westinghouse (1080p, 42", no tv tuner) and I agree that the PS2 games can be a bit lacking PQ-wise. Not the TV's fault, though, the set is just magnifying the faults that were already there. It's not that it makes games unplayable, it just looks like when a poorly encoded DVD or any other SD source is used with an HD display. If you're willing to put up with a few quirks/bugs, I'd definitely recommend the cost-effective Westinghouse sets.

[CrazyAsano]

I bought the newest Westinghouse 32" LCD. (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8250144&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050006&id=1169512290376)
The ATI Xilleon video processing isn't doing any favors, otherwise it's a fine panel for the most part. If you don't need size having a smaller tv really controls the damage done to older graphics. My thoughts come from viewing on 40+ screens. The PS2 really suffers at that point. I've found my collection of NES/SNES games to look quite good though. :sd:

I have the older LVM-42w2 monitor from Westinghouse (1080p, 42", no tv tuner) and I agree that the PS2 games can be a bit lacking PQ-wise. Not the TV's fault, though, the set is just magnifying the faults that were already there. It's not that it makes games unplayable, it just looks like when a poorly encoded DVD or any other SD source is used with an HD display. If you're willing to put up with a few quirks/bugs, I'd definitely recommend the cost-effective Westinghouse sets.
I tried playing Metal Gear Solid 3 on my 108" 720p native projector screen and it was so horrible I couldn't even tell what the hell was going on.

[pathos]

Is out now. It fixes a problem with HDMI from what the release notes said.

But for PAL PS3 owners there something more important - it looks like theres been some fixes with the PS2/PSone BC

Cant confirm it (since the website still listed 1.70 when i listed checked) but Kingdom Hearts 2 doesn't have the unbeatable boss in the TRON world anymore.

I don't know what the 'known" hdmi issue is, so I cant confirm its "fixed", but I can confirm it fixed MY hdmi problem.

Basically, when i tried using the ps3 hdmi on my Westinghouse 42 lcd, the screen would blink on and off. It would be fine when first powered up and you were in the ps3 menu system, but the first time the screen refereshed itself (say, like entering a game), the blinking would start.

I tried all sorts of things, nothing worked, and finally went back to using component cables.

After the firmware update, however, it works fine.

I've been using hdmi since without a hitch.

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

I don't know what the 'known" hdmi issue is, so I cant confirm its "fixed", but I can confirm it fixed MY hdmi problem.

Basically, when i tried using the ps3 hdmi on my Westinghouse 42 lcd, the screen would blink on and off. It would be fine when first powered up and you were in the ps3 menu system, but the first time the screen refereshed itself (say, like entering a game), the blinking would start.

I tried all sorts of things, nothing worked, and finally went back to using component cables.

After the firmware update, however, it works fine.

I've been using hdmi since without a hitch.

That was a known issue with the LVM-42w2 monitor from Westinghouse as well as with some other sets. Basically, one HDMI device with HDCP enabled has to perform a "handshake" between another HDMI device before it will display video properly at full 1080p resolution.

In this example, your PS3 will send out a signal on the cable saying "Hey, are you a compatible device", and then wait a specified time for a response. The problem with flickering video occurs because the PS3 would not wait long enough for a response from the TV, or the TV would not respond quick enough, and would then assume that it was on a non-protected input and screw up the signal.

It was a known timing issue that Westinghouse half-way fixed in the most recent revision of the 42w2's firmware (version 1.03). Prior to that version, you could use DVI2 by way of an HDMI to DVI cable without having the constant flicker (the DVI inputs on the 42w2 support HDCP). Version 1.03 of the 42w2's firmware fixed the HDMI input, but DVI1 was still buggy.

If you're reporting that it's working as of 1.80, however, I'll have to give it a try when I get home and see what I get. I'll report the results when I have them.

[pathos]

That was a known issue with the LVM-42w2 monitor from Westinghouse as well as with some other sets. Basically, one HDMI device with HDCP enabled has to perform a "handshake" between another HDMI device before it will display video properly at full 1080p resolution.

In this example, your PS3 will send out a signal on the cable saying "Hey, are you a compatible device", and then wait a specified time for a response. The problem with flickering video occurs because the PS3 would not wait long enough for a response from the TV, or the TV would not respond quick enough, and would then assume that it was on a non-protected input and screw up the signal.

It was a known timing issue that Westinghouse half-way fixed in the most recent revision of the 42w2's firmware (version 1.03). Prior to that version, you could use DVI2 by way of an HDMI to DVI cable without having the constant flicker (the DVI inputs on the 42w2 support HDCP). Version 1.03 of the 42w2's firmware fixed the HDMI input, but DVI1 was still buggy.

If you're reporting that it's working as of 1.80, however, I'll have to give it a try when I get home and see what I get. I'll report the results when I have them.


Hrm, very interesting. Thanks for that. I suppose I had been curious enough to actually try researching that problem, but never really found the time to do it. Now, i dont have to :sd:

[Mr. Spiffy-Pants]

I did a lot of research before buying my TV. ;)