Death Note ending(s) discussion - spoilers

[Dagger]

Now that the last episode of the TV series has aired, would anyone like to compare the endings of the Death Note anime, live-action movies and manga? The live-action version is in some ways drastically different from the original, while the anime ending makes smaller tweaks that could nevertheless lead to a lot of debate.

I figured I'd wait a few days before starting to post my full thoughts, but I thought I'd gauge interest etc. first. :)

[AbeChinchilla]

Disappointment.

It's like they wanted us to feel sorry for Light.

Yeah, right.

Near says it like it is, Light is a murderer.

They didn't do the anime until long after the manga was complete and they still manage to mess up the ending. Wow.

[DKL]

I actually really liked it; it was very cinematic and I'm satisfied with the outcome; Madhouse did a godly job with this show.

The obvious highlight was when Light turned into a little bitch; that was REALLY awesome and was totally satisfying to watch.

I also liked the "it's been fun" atmosphere going on with Ryuk where he seems to find himself strangely nostalgic over the whole thing (which... all things considering, was mass murder); very neat.

Anyway, it's been a blast... I wonder what Tetsuro Araki is gonna work on after though?

(I want more original Galaxy Angel with Death Note production values, to be honest)

[Thanatos]

I really wanted Light to win, but oh well. The anime ending does NOT feature Light begging Ryuk like a pussy to kill everyone, which makes it much better than the manga and live action endings, but on the other hand with no epilogue about what happens to the SPK, police, and world at large the ending feels rather sudden... adittionally, we don't get to see the new Kira who appears at the end of the manga. Overall I think the anime has the best send off for Death Note's protagonist.

[Dagger]

Disappointment.

It's like they wanted us to feel sorry for Light.

Yeah, right.

Near says it like it is, Light is a murderer.

They didn't do the anime until long after the manga was complete and they still manage to mess up the ending. Wow.
I agree and disagree here. At the end of the manga, I was pumping my fists and basically reveling in Light's miserable, useless whining. At the end of the anime, I didn't exactly pity him--nor did I regret his loss--but I was left with a darker, more bitter & troubling sensation. I found that impressive. I couldn't react to the anime with the same clear, black and white vindictiveness, and it made me think a little more than the end of the manga.

I don't think they portrayed Light in a more positive, um, light. Mamoru Miyano sounded so pathetic and insane that parts of the episode just made me cringe. Even before the montage at the end, I couldn't just grin at his collapse like I had in the manga. The voice acting made it that much more real, I guess.

Of course Light is exactly what Near says--but far more so in the manga, I saw here the element of tragedy in Light's self-delusion and the fact that he always chose to keep going when he could at any time have turned back. And DN is very much a tragedy in the classical sense.

Although they cut out the coda, I liked the fact that they added in a hint at Misa's fate. Mikami's manner of death also points toward Matsuda's speculation in chapter 108.

ETA: So does anyone know what's up with the special that's supposed to come out this summer?

[Sheena]

They also implied Misa suiciding even before she learned of Light's death. That kinda felt awkward.

I really liked Ryuk's part in the anime better than the manga. Light begging wasn't that good. They showed him being desperate just fine with pleading to Mikami. But also they skipped the afterlife no hell no heaven bit that Ryuk revealed in the manga. I guess they didn't want to open a can of worms with that angle. But I loved the analogy for the nature of life "you're waiting to die, it's annoying but we had fun in the meantime" by Ryuk in his monologue. Very nicely put and the mood was perfect too.

Part I'll miss was basically thought and hints about the world after Light-kun/Kira's death.

One thing bugged me is the sunset. It's perfect for the mood except that the meeting was supposed to happen at 1 pm. Ok they waited an hour but then the events unfolded within minutes. It couldn't be much more than 2:30 pm by the time Light comes out of the warehouse. Yet, it's already sunset. That's a tad early (at least 2 hours) for November 28th ;)

[Dagger]

Haha, yeah, the timing is a problem. It's easy to pretend that a lot of what happens at the end is abstract, though--Light having visions, Misa killing herself (couldn't that have been a flashforward dream sequence type of thing?). So I didn't mind especially. I have a weakness for surreal stuff.

[AbeChinchilla]

The anime ending does NOT feature Light begging Ryuk like a pussy to kill everyone, which makes it much better than the manga...

We are shown that Light truly "loses" the game in the manga when he goes and begs Ryuk for help.

Ryuk writes down Light's name because he's finally become bored with him. Light's "loss" (beggin' and whinin') was the last straw.

In the anime, it almost seems like Ryuk just writes Light's name down because he feels sorry for him.

[DKL]

Death Note 37

SPOILERS… and foul language.

Wow, what a great ending; it was everything I was expecting it to be.

Okay, let’s start with the basics:

How did Light get his shit ruined?

It comes as to no surprise that Light would eventually eat it, so the quality of the ending would very well hinge on how well Tetsuro Araki (who did storyboards and direction for this episode specifically, it seems) could portray Light’s downfall; though, not necessarily better than his work in Galaxy Angel [particularly the “Attack Castle” episode], it’s a good effort (okay, I kid, I kid).

Well, okay, the surprising ending, ironically, would be if Light had won (and, arguably, it would’ve been fun to see Light gloat and proclaim his victory in the most exaggerated way possible… though, I’m not sure if it would be as satisfying as seeing him in a negative light like we got to today).

The writing, in the vein of all the writing before it, was this huge smorgasbord of convenience and epic-ness; I was also fond of the way the episodes were structured in that there was this HUGE climactic countdown to Near’s death… only to find out the very next episode that Light and Mikami got PWNED; it was funny to see both of them there standing around in the room with their dicks in their hands.

So what’s happening is that, apparently, Near managed to find the whereabouts of Mikami’s hidden note (after previously sort of suspecting that it existed… I think).

What I like about this part was probably Near’s prodigious declaration (complete with motion blur and epic finger puppets) as to how, alone, both he and Mello were not equal to L, but together, they would eventually uncover the hard evidence that L himself was never able to unearth during the time when he was still alive… and thus surpassing L as a “master detective.”

Come to think of it, when I look back on the episode before this one, there was this unusual emphasis on “channeling L’s spirit” in which Light himself was to some extent disgusted that Near even had the nerve to put on an “L” mask and to implicitly dare compare himself to the late and great Ryuzaki; it brings up the nifty contemplation that Light may still have some sort of regret in regards to what he did back then when he had L taken out of the picture (or, to the very least, only ever considered L as a worthy opponent).

Anyway, going back, it seems that Mello’s ultimate purpose in the show was to “take one for the team;” kidnapping Takada (which ran the risk of being killed by her) was apparently the only way to get Mikami to do something behind Light’s back… and, well, it paid off (and only cost him his life… and that last bar of chocolate he didn’t actually finish in episode 35).

Anyway, here comes the good part:

Light’s epic downfall.

After his shameless declaration that Near had “set him up,” there’s this great sequence where Mogi steps forward and gets ready to put the handcuffs on Light (and this is right after an awesome handcuff sequence with Mikami). Light, however, is outright horrified at the idea that he was about to be captured and shoves the cuffs away.

I need emphasis as to how cool that scene was; the part where he runs towards the garage door was really well shot and animated (in fact, it still amazes me how this show manages to effectively glorify small scenes like that).

I was also fond of how Light’s mind was like an open book at this point (he isn’t really talking, but it seems that way given his body chemistry and all the damning evidence surrounding him); great emphasis on conveying emotions through the eyes.

So yes, the big part is when Light FINALLY acknowledges to the people around him that he is indeed Kira.

Again, staging was VERY good; notice how the sunlight cast Light’s shadow on the garage door as he expanded on his delusion of “being god” and “bearing the responsibility.” The use of character acting was pretty amazing; it wouldn’t have the same effect if it wasn’t this well-animated and expressed.

Afterwards, Near just points out the obvious fact that Light is nothing more than a delusional mass-murderer; Light finds himself at a loss and is now aware of the fact that he won’t be able to convince such “simple-minded” people of his life’s epic mission.

I like the shots to the ceiling where you could see the light bursting through; aside from helping with the wonderfully cinematic presentation, it helped convey the fact that Light honestly believes that he still has it in himself to pull this gigantic victory out of his ass (you know, like: “a ray of hope” or something like that).

But you know, surprisingly enough, it’s Matsuda that fucks him up with a gun (of which… for some reason sounds like every other gun in the series) when Light tries to use his trump card (well, Matsuda was actually the person who felt most betrayed, so this is understandable); the moments of back and forth with Matsuda were really intense (reminds me of that one sequence they pulled off with Light’s dad way back when). I was even fond of the moment where he finds it completely insane that Light would try to call the people in the room crazy, when Light himself was a man who drove his own father to the grave; good stuff.

So, eventually, Light tries to go for it once more (using his own blood), but Matsuda takes it up and notch and caps a bullet in Light’s ass (not literally… not literally in the ass, I mean).

There was this cool sequence where Light falls into a puddle of water and starts wailing around for someone to come and help him; it eventually dawns on Light that he’s kinda screwed at this point (since Misa is useless and Takada is dead). He even tries to go to Mikami for help (explicitly asking him to “write”), but this only puts the reality of Light not being a god into Mikami’s head.

Given that reality, Mikami decides to just kill himself (I mean… who wouldn’t? Aside from looking like a complete douche, there really wasn’t anything left for him); even his blood-spout was epic… I approve.

Anyway, Light manages to slip away during the momentary confusion and get out of the warehouse; his former comrades feel this weird need to chase after him, despite the fact that it’s obvious that he won’t get far... I guess it’s this weird feeling of kinship that arises despite the reality of things (ie. Light being a huge douche-face).

I was pretty fond of the “jogging” sequence (though it wasn’t nearly as cool as Mamoru Hosoda’s “running” sequence in The Girl who Leapt Through Time).

It was neat that they gave Light some moments to contemplate what he’s been doing this whole time; there was a particular moment where Light sees a version of himself in the past walk by him (which kinda reminded me of some of stuff Toshiyuki Tsuru did in Gungrave where Brandon and Harry would see child versions of themselves run by)…

I have a feeling that Light was probably thinking something along the lines of:

“Aww… what the hell have I been doing? When I think about it, my path was apparently gilded in gold, yet I somehow ended up doing this shit.”

And if you wanna read into further:

“Maybe Light could’ve changed the world as a politician?”

But yeah, that’s up to everyone else…

Okay, so, some more cinematic stuff happens and it seems that Light is at the end of the line; Ryuk decides that it’d be boring to wait for Light to die in Jail (well, it’s not like he can tell since he can’t see Light’s time anymore), so he just decides to end it here.

(though… uhh… I thought that Light [and Mikami] would get the Death Penalty when he was finally caught… complicated courtroom politics? Who knows?)

I really liked the nostalgic atmosphere Ryuk was putting on; sure… it was horrible murder, but it was fun while it lasted and Ryuk’s life of utter boredom somehow got a little more interesting thanks to his fated meeting with Light; he can’t deny that and, in a way, Ryuk probably fleetingly sees Light as his first human friend.

And, on an interesting note, when Ryuk finally writes Light’s name in the notebook… it seems like this was one of the few times in the series where someone is shown not doing it in this grossly-exaggerated manner; a nice touch and the sense of “normal-ness” enhanced the nostalgic mood.

(still, I was fond of the detail in which Ryuk’s hand was animated… it was surprisingly delicate)

So yes, then there’s the interwoven Misa/train sequence (which… after seeing this episode a couple of times… I think is actually set at different times… probably after Misa finds out about Light [and the truth about him being Kira… unless, uhh… who Kira actually was wasn’t revealed… I wouldn’t know]); I like how you could see the shadows of the electric poles on the other end of the train.

Then, there’s L’s appearance at the end; you can’t really see his face, so it could either be a gloating face [“I win.”] or a sympathetic face…

Or a combination of both; it’s up to the viewer’s imagination.

But yeah, it was very cool to watch L see Light off (considering that Light isn’t really going anywhere after this).

So yes… I’m pretty satisfied with the series; if I was to place it in my favorites… it would probably rank right behind Hanada Shonen Shi (episodes 18 and 19 were amazing, by the way).

Okay, the writing for the plot isn’t necessarily… how do I say this?

…

Intelligible.

BUT, it manages to come across as BRILLIANTLY contrived (to the extent where I’m actually impressed with all the over-the-top scenarios they can come up with).

Though, I have to say that most of the series’ true power lay within Tetsuro Araki’s visual style of overblown visuals; the cinematic presentation of the series is TOP NOTCH (which is sorely missing from the live-action movie… hence me not liking it, despite being indifferent to the story changes); stark lighting, slom-motion, super camera zoom, motion blur, split-screen... all the cinematic bells and whistles are here and executed (most of the time) with great precision and talent.

But yeah… it’s like a new-age version of Osamu Dezaki’s visuals; I really enjoyed the hell out of it. Sure, this has probably been done before, but how many anime shows do it at this level of quality?

I can’t name many.

That said, Death Note is easily one of the most entertaining shows I’ve ever watched, hence being designated as a favorite… Tetsuro Araki really had the right ideas in regards to the show’s visual presentation since he managed to make conceivably boring moments somehow how very entertaining to watch; I’m hoping that he can drag something like this into his next production (assuming Maruyama or whoever allows him to direct again), but I don’t think it’ll be as lavish as this… Death Note had the opportunity of being based on this ultra-popular franchise, so this is probably the only way they were able to do stuff like this (again… epic potato chip eating… how many shows have this?); it was probably a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity, but Araki really cashed in.

It was great.

And… I guess that’s it.

Though, I really do want more original Galaxy Angel with Death Note production values.

[Dagger]

Anyway, going back, it seems that Mello’s ultimate purpose in the show was to “take one for the team"...
In a series that places very little emphasis on normal character development, this was a great way of reversing the viewer's expectations for Mello. The barest explanation by Hal reveals so much: that he's not so petty as to deny anyone other than himself the chance to take down Kira; that he's achieved some kind of self-realization with respect to his & Near's abilities and ways of taking care of things. The second arc constantly emphasized the rivalry between them, but only the synthesis of their efforts ended up accomplishing anything. In fact, it's the exact opposite of what happened with Light and Mikami, who were supposed to be working together but who fatally got in each other's way.

So, eventually, Light tries to go for it once more (using his own blood), but Matsuda takes it up and notch and caps a bullet in Light’s ass (not literally... not literally in the ass, I mean).
But would that have been a sweet twist or what? ;)

Anyway, Light manages to slip away during the momentary confusion and get out of the warehouse; his former comrades feel this weird need to chase after him, despite the fact that it’s obvious that he won’t get far... I guess it’s this weird feeling of kinship that arises despite the reality of things (ie. Light being a huge douche-face).
Episode 37 paid more tribute to chapter 108 than it might at first seem, I think. This segment, for instance, made me think of the part in the manga where Matsuda admits that he always liked Light--always wanted to like him, at least, despite everything. I thought the little moment where Matsuda snaps out of his daze and realizes that Light is leaving spoke to that somewhat.


Ryuk probably fleetingly sees Light as his first human friend.
Heh. I'll grant you nostalgia, though in a purely selfish sense ("Man... now I'm gonna be bored again.") Friends, though? Never. The manga is very brutal in conveying a last-minute reminder of Ryuk's godhood--compared to Light, at least--and while the anime is more subtle about it, I think the point remains, what with him surveying the city at the very end.

I love your observation about the way he wrote Light's name, by the way. One could read this as signifying a core difference between shinigami like him & human Death Note users. (Remember, Rem and Jealous also wrote down names in a calm prosaic way, even when they were under great emotional stress.) To humans, even humans with grandoise plans like Light, the Death Note and all it represents will always be an alien, godly power. Hence Mikami and his sakujo orgasms; hence Light's sparkles and wildly waving arms. It's practically a sacred activity to them. To Ryuk and the other shinigami, though, this power is simply their essence, a totally boring part of what they are, and so they write down names as if they're completing a grocery list.

[DKL]

Heh. I'll grant you nostalgia, though in a purely selfish sense ("Man... now I'm gonna be bored again.") Friends, though? Never.

No... more like... uhh...

How do I put this?

Like after you watch your favorite anime, then it ends... and like, you have to say goodbye to your friends; that's the impression that I got from Ryuk's ending thingy... but it's like...

A fleeting feeling; like he only vaguely thinks that for a brief moment.

Or something like that.

===========

Also, it's easy to associate the writers of the notebook like this:

Light = The Maestro (graceful)
Mikami = The Barbarian (powerful)

Yeah... I thought it was kinda cool that they had their own distinctive styles of writing in the note; that was neat.

[AbeChinchilla]

Ryuk probably fleetingly sees Light as his first human friend.

I don't think Ryuk has EVER considered Light a "friend." He does what the viewer can't do, and that's interact. Otherwise, he's no different than us, he's just watching what Light does. Like watching a television program or reading a comic book...

[DKL]

Surprisingly enough, I used the "anime" correlation in my last post to expand on that point...

It's hard to describe though...

It's like "Hey, maybe..." but then you just move on since the show is over.

[Thanatos]

Hence Mikami and his sakujo orgasms

Greatest noun phrase EVER.

[DKL]

Which reminds me, has anyone seen the GIF animation about swimming and the beijing olympics?

(based on the apparently very popular "swimming lessons" parody of the manga)

[Dagger]

Which reminds me, has anyone seen the GIF animation about swimming and the beijing olympics?

(based on the apparently very popular "swimming lessons" parody of the manga)
Not yet... but I plan on it. :D

[DKL]

WATER RESISTANCE IS HUGE!!!!!

[Dagger]

Summer Special info (http://www.animeonline.com/index.php?page=news_details&action=details&id=102636)

Could be great, could be forgettable...

[pianocello]

Summer Special info (http://www.animeonline.com/index.php?page=news_details&action=details&id=102636)

Could be great, could be forgettable...
At worst, it could be another Shuffle Memories.

(shudders at that thought....)

[DKL]

It's a 3 hour recap episode... apparently...

Oh, but there is some new footage.

Hmm... wonder if I'll be watching this or not?

...

Yeah, I probably will.

[roastedpekingduck]

I liked the Death Note anime, but not enough to make me buy the DVDs immediately.

As impressive as the anime was, I personally felt that the changes it made from the manga were unnecessary and detracted from my overall experience after the complete masterpiece that the manga was.

First the ambiguity made Light's death less satisfying. The anime made him into more of a tragic and slightly more sympathetic character. Perhaps the creators wanted his death to be more ambivalent in nature, but I thought the reason the ending for the manga worked so well was because of how in the end, Light had become an utterly spiteful and pathetic bastard. Absolute power corrupts absolutely, and it was just satisfying to see a thoroughly corrupted person such as Light meet his demise. The lingering several seconds of Light's death in the anime with L hovering over him, as short as that was, really changed the nature of the ending. Also, I'm disappointed that the scene with Light groveling in front of Ryuk was removed. Some may have felt that was annoying, but that scene was perfect in showing how pathetic Light had become, how powerless he was without the note and how much he had come to depend on it.

Also, the really ominous epilogue showing cult worshipping Kira was removed. The irony of that scene was just masterful. Light had turned into a God, but people thought Kira was a righteous figure, while Light in reality had devolved into pathetic groveler by the end who only wanted to preserve his own existence.

Had I only seen the anime, I might have been completely wowed off my socks, but the fact that I read the manga beforehand certainly did dampen my experience. The anime was still good, but I think that the creative team shouldn't have made some of the changes they did. Death Note also could have benefited from a couple of more episodes (I think that's the first time I wished a Shonen Jump anime had more episodes instead of less. :sd: ) manga to elaborate the Near/Mello arc, as some details were cut out to make the arc fit into the anime. I probably wait wait for the boxset to come out a long ways down the road to rewatch Death Note. By that time, I should have forgotten enough of the manga so that I'll stop comparing the anime to the manga while watching. :sd:

[masterpez]

Well, with this 3 hour special coming up next month, it's possible that they'll add in the scenes that you mentioned. I also read here (http://www.animenation.net/news/index.php?id=11369), that there'd be new scenes added during the series' rebroadcast. Not sure if any of this will change people's opinion's of the anime, since I've only seen a few episodes and don't know how drastic things were changed.

[Dagger]

Based on what I've seen, opinions of the anime are pretty favorable compared to the manga. Mainly, I guess, because people were so vitriolic about their hatred of the second arc, which was slimmed down for the anime.

As someone who liked the second arc & didn't have any problems with the manga ending, I actually think the story as a whole would've benefited from being trimmed. IMO they could've fit it in twenty-six episodes with a larger proportion of high-budget episodes and less downtime. But for the most part they stuck to the manga very very closely, so that wasn't possible. It's not as exact an adaptation as, say, Monster, but certainly far closer to the original than any other Jump anime in recent memory.

[pianocello]

I haven't read the manga but having finished the anime and the two live-action movies, I'll share my thoughts(so be warned - spoilers for anime and live-action movies):

A lot of people have commented on how the last few volumes of the manga have a noticeble slump in quality but I found the remaining 12 episodes or so with Near and Mello to be okay and not as bad as many were making them out to be. While Mikami might have been an interesting character, he appeared too late in the story for me to really care about him. I did have a little sympathy for Kiyomi Takada (I did BTW think that her little striptease scene was hot. :virgin: ) so I was enraged when Light killed her cruelly (my hatred for him was as strong as when he killed Naomi Misora). While Matsuda's naiveness was annoying, ironically he did the most damage to Light in the end. BTW, I can't be the only one to think that Near's voice is inappropriate for the role. I don't mind a female VA but she should at least try to sound like a guy here. For half the episodes Near was in, I actually thought that Near was a girl.
While I thought the anime ending was well-done, I would have prefered Light to suffer more humiliation and die in a more painful manner. Having browsed through several forums, I think a large number of people who are supporting Light are merely yaoi fangirls who are upset that their source of yaoi fodder has departed. Quite frankly if Light wasn't so bishie, I doubt there would be so much support for him. Did anyone stop to think that in the final episode that Light was going to just cruelly kill everyone else in the room, even those like Matsuda who had stood by him for years without remorse? Personally, I think the most fitting punishment for him would be for him to be sexually abused by 20 fat ugly sumo wrestlers and hung upside down naked in public. Did anyone else think BTW, that the BGMs playing in his final scenes ruined the mood?

Moving on to the movies. I think several changes that they made to the storyline were for the better. For example, they started off by showing Light having a bad encounter with gangsters and we are immediately drawn in to sympathize with him. I also liked how his father confronted him unlike the anime which had his father dying without knowing the truth. I liked how Sayu was someone who openly went against Kira. I disliked Misa in the anime for how callously she simply killed people but at least in the movies, she did seem to have a twinge of moral conscience when she questioned on why Light would try to kill his own father. I often thought that Near defeating Light in the anime seemed anti-climatic because to me, Near was nothing more than a bootleg copy of L. It would have been more effective if we had seen Near and Mello physically together cooperating to defeat Light.
I was really pleased to see L in the movie defeating Light. His actor's performance was 1st rate and his final scene actually moved me to tears (something the anime was unable to do in any scene).
If I sound like I'm highly praising the movies, unfortunately there were a few things that pulled it down. Despite the positive changes in the story, the movies were let down by a few actors acting terribly. Foremost is Light's actor. In the anime, he was highly intelligent and was able to fool a lot of people and he was also extremely evil. In the live-action, he seemed like a schoolboy loser that suddenly gained the power to take revenge on his enemies. Every time, he tried to fool everyone into thinking he was not Kira, his actor often looked like his face was about to burst out laughing in embarassment and that was extremely distracting for me to watch. Misa's actress was also guilty for overacting at times though she did redeem herself at the end. The real standouts for acting were the actors for L,Soichiro Yagami and Sayu.

[DKL]

I actually really didn't like the live-action movies... (well, I only saw the first one... didn't bother watching the next one because of how tedious it was to watch)

I mean, I was pretty indifferent to the story-changes (though, Naomi didn't come off as stupid as she did in the anime); I was more focused on the fact that it didn't feel like I was watching a movie...

It just felt pretty ghetto across the board; acting, visuals, direction... a part of me has a hard time understanding why people liked it so much; sure, the story is there... but the competent storytelling and style isn't.

They didn't exactly bring the A-game filmmakers here...

A gimmikey story needs gimmikey execution, which is what the anime had, and in spades.

Yeah... I'll play it straight and just say that the overall message of the story does come across as pretty superficial; we don't necessarily know that crime has dropped or whatever unless someone actually tells the viewer, for starters.

I always thought that the focal point of the show was the intense and zany cat-and-mouse games, not necessarily its statement about justice; the reason why any of what the anime had to say came across as effective was because they didn't beat the viewer over the head with it, I felt.

It was concise and simple, giving lots of way for the entertainment and epic awesome-ness.

But yeah: Death Note is just REALLY entertaining, hence why I liked it so much; it's mainstream entertainment at its best.

(and for the record, a live-action version would be awesome... I mean, it should've been, but it wasn't)