Hell Girl discussion

[Mr. Nail Bat]

Okay, so I finally watched the first volume of this series, and I have to discuss it, because it has been a long time since I felt this strongly about an anime series.

First, I must avail myself of the knowledge of those who have seen beyond the first five episodes. In the future, does the series get less formulaic? Right now, it seems to have a very rigid structure of Abuse-Website-Offer Made-More Abuse-Offer Accepted-Violent Death-Ferry Ride-Troubled Look-Candle.

It would be a nice change of pace, for instance, for one of the "victims" to decide *not* to tear off the red thread.

However, what really inspired me to post was that this seems like the most sadistic series I've ever seen. I think it was the second episode that made me think that: Ryoko is forced to choose between being raped and murdered (not necessarily in that order) or spending an eternity in hell, which in her vision of it earlier in the episode, is a gang-rape. Essentially she is forced to choose between rape now and rape later. That seemed horribly cruel and arbitrary, and left a very bad taste in my mouth. The first volume made me feel like a voyeur, or a patron of a geek show.

I guess congratulations are in order to the personnel behind the show for making something that inspires such strong emotions, but I must admit to feeling uneasy about viewing any subsequent episodes.

[pianocello]

Yes. The show becomes less formulaic when Hajime and Tsugumi show up. I thought the emotional climax of the 1st season was done very well. In the 2nd season, it focuses more on Ai's helpers rather than the characters-of-the-week. Oddly though, the 2nd season has more unintentional humor and strangely enough, also has one of the all-time best onsen episodes that actually is better than any of the onsen episodes in shows like Girls Bravo or Amaenaideyo! :> :D :blush:

[something]

That seemed horribly cruel and arbitrary, and left a very bad taste in my mouth. The first volume made me feel like a voyeur, or a patron of a geek show.
Jigoku Shoujo is a cruel show. That's just the kind of series it is. The choices are often horrible (though sometimes just plain dumb), and that's one of the things I grappled with early on. There's worse, and there's not nearly so bad. There's a good bit of variety. I came to really like it though, and that feeling carried through the second season.

A big question I always had is what kind of hell they have in mind. Demonic ass rape 24/7/365, or more of a "constantly wandering lost soul" kind of thing? I think they avoid getting really specific on it, because I'm convinced it varies enormously case by case. And, of course, because it leaves us feeling uneasy if we can only guess at what will really happen. And making the viewer feel uneasy is what Jigoku Shoujo does well, even though it's not a horror anime in the sense of trying to frighten the audience.

I've actually made many (non-spoilery) posts addressing your concerns and more besides in a number of threads from GA and R1 to Recs, building a bit more each time, and have linked it before in other Jigoku Shoujo threads. But I don't really want to go finding it yet again... :sd: I should probably save links to the more detailed posts I make so I can find them again easily. I'd say to check some of the recent Jigoku Shoujo threads in recommendations, I probably linked everything from there, and it should all have links to the other posts I made as well. That's if you want a more detailed answer.

[aagranov]

I have to say this is an extremely disturbing and cruel show. What's the point in vengeance now and eternal pain and suffering later? It's a false choice and it seems that Hell Girl is a sadist.

[something]

I have to say this is an extremely disturbing and cruel show. What's the point in vengeance now and eternal pain and suffering later? It's a false choice and it seems that Hell Girl is a sadist.
This is a REALLY good example of a show where making snap judgments early on will really skew your perception. Calling her a "sadist" is, just... really wrong.

[aagranov]

I have to say this is an extremely disturbing and cruel show. What's the point in vengeance now and eternal pain and suffering later? It's a false choice and it seems that Hell Girl is a sadist.
This is a REALLY good example of a show where making snap judgments early on will really skew your perception. Calling her a "sadist" is, just... really wrong.

It's just that little smirk on her face when she says "Care to give death a try" before sending her victim straight to Hades.

[pianocello]

it seems that Hell Girl is a sadist.


(rewatches Jigoku Shoujo: Futakomori ep 19)

Mmmmm.....Ai's ass..... :laugh:

[aagranov]

it seems that Hell Girl is a sadist.


(rewatches Jigoku Shoujo: Futakomori ep 19)

Mmmmm.....Ai's ass..... :laugh:



hey I haven't watched the fansubs! I'm a paying customer!

[Richard J.]

It's just that little smirk on her face when she says "Care to give death a try" before sending her victim straight to Hades.When you see her origin, and get a better understanding of why she's doing this, you'll probably understand her personality better. Ai's not a sadist in my opinion.

[Drgnfuel]

Yes it is a cruel show. It invokes many feelings. Especially of what is right or wrong. You have these poor people in these horrible situations where it seems like there is no way out. Enma Ai is their heroine. As sick as it is they feel so tortured they don't mind selling thier souls and their torturer's to the devil. Make sure you stick it out through the whole series. It is very formulatic in the beginning but it eases it's way into something more. This is by far one of my fav animes. It really makes you think and evokes so much emotion. Cause you can almost always see both sides.*wants to rewatch his 2 volumes now*

[aagranov]

Yes it is a cruel show. It invokes many feelings. Especially of what is right or wrong. You have these poor people in these horrible situations where it seems like there is no way out. Enma Ai is their heroine. As sick as it is they feel so tortured they don't mind selling thier souls and their torturer's to the devil. Make sure you stick it out through the whole series. It is very formulatic in the beginning but it eases it's way into something more. This is by far one of my fav animes. It really makes you think and evokes so much emotion. Cause you can almost always see both sides.*wants to rewatch his 2 volumes now*

I really hope it improves. I want to be *moved* not just revolted by what I see.

[Ashyukun]

I really hope it improves. I want to be *moved* not just revolted by what I see.

It definitely improves- stick with it.

[ZhenJi]

I tried to watch the first volume in one sitting and it was a bit much. Later I read in Chris' review that one episode at time helps with appreciate the show better. I still have some reservations about the formulaic plot, but I the animation is so beautiful I am willing to stick with it. Just my 2 cents.

[something]

It's just that little smirk on her face when she says "Care to give death a try" before sending her victim straight to Hades.
A smirk is the far less than they tend to deserve. Hardly makes her a sadist, to say the least. Ai reveals herself slowly over time, you can't make snap judgments about her motivations.

hey I haven't watched the fansubs! I'm a paying customer!
::looks at released Jigoku Shoujo DVDs on his shelf:: Uh, so are we.

[Isuzu Inugami]

I have to say this is an extremely disturbing and cruel show. What's the point in vengeance now and eternal pain and suffering later? It's a false choice

See, this is what keeps hanging me up about this show. Is there any meaning to what's going on, or are these little disaster stories just backdrop to whatever Enma Ai's story turns out to be, whenever that plot eventually starts moving? Is the show actually saying anything with all of this?

Because that artbox is awfully tempting, but jeeze, if these people with their ominous tattoos are just so much fodder for each week's misery, I'm inclined to pass....

[something]

Is the show actually saying anything with all of this?
Yes.

[Isuzu Inugami]

Is the show actually saying anything with all of this?
Yes.

Crap. Now I really want that box.

[zaldar]

So at a friends house today saw the first two episodes of Hell Girl. Interesting, really I don't think either made decent bargins. The second maybe but the first was just unbelieveable. I mean damming your soul to hell just for that? Anyway was Hell Girl supposed to be in hell when the meetings were takeing place and her house? I mean if thats hell it really didn't look that bad...

[something]

There's an existing Jigoku Shoujo thread opened just a week ago by Geoduck or so that you might want to check out.

So at a friends house today saw the first two episodes of Hell Girl. Interesting, really I don't think either made decent bargins. The second maybe but the first was just unbelieveable. I mean damming your soul to hell just for that?
The reasons in this show (having seen both seasons in full) range from tragically unavoidable to laughably silly. There's definite variety in motivations.

Anyway was Hell Girl supposed to be in hell when the meetings were takeing place and her house? I mean if thats hell it really didn't look that bad...
The show is actually pretty consistent about *not* explicitly articulating its vision of the afterlife. I'm of the opinion that it's because it varies on a case by case basis. The vile murderer who gets sent to hell by a victim's friend is, I feel, probably going to have a very different experience than the victim or victim's avenger will. But that's just my guess, or maybe my wishful thinking. It's not really the show's intent to depict what happens after the fact.

As for Ai, I can't quite remember if her house is "in hell" per se, but I can say that it's not supposed to be taken as representative of the place everyone goes when they are condemned or die after condemning. Don't plan on frolicking around with Ai in the pretty flowers and taking a dip in a cool stream if someone pulls the string on you =P

[zaldar]

There's an existing Jigoku Shoujo thread opened just a week ago by Geoduck or so that you might want to check out.

So at a friends house today saw the first two episodes of Hell Girl. Interesting, really I don't think either made decent bargins. The second maybe but the first was just unbelieveable. I mean damming your soul to hell just for that?
The reasons in this show (having seen both seasons in full) range from tragically unavoidable to laughably silly. There's definite variety in motivations.

Anyway was Hell Girl supposed to be in hell when the meetings were takeing place and her house? I mean if thats hell it really didn't look that bad...
The show is actually pretty consistent about *not* explicitly articulating its vision of the afterlife. I'm of the opinion that it's because it varies on a case by case basis. The vile murderer who gets sent to hell by a victim's friend is, I feel, probably going to have a very different experience than the victim or victim's avenger will. But that's just my guess, or maybe my wishful thinking. It's not really the show's intent to depict what happens after the fact.

As for Ai, I can't quite remember if her house is "in hell" per se, but I can say that it's not supposed to be taken as representative of the place everyone goes when they are condemned or die after condemning. Don't plan on frolicking around with Ai in the pretty flowers and taking a dip in a cool stream if someone pulls the string on you =P

Ok thanks I don't know the japanese names for things usually and for personal reasons I try not to read threads about things I can only see through fansubs or buy buying region 2 dvds. Frankly for things released in R1 I would like it if the R1 titles were used but that just me.

Thanks for the info though. The second episode was much more tragic than the first and I definitly hope to see it someday *looks at his credit card debt and the bargin bin on right stuff crap genon titles* just not right now though my friend got the discs from best buy for 15 bucks...

[PrincessLaLa]

I started to watch Jigoku Shoujo (Hell Girl) and i was wondering if the rest of the show was all about people requesting revenge. >< like do we find out anything about Ai and the others? as in how they became the way they are? or an overarching story? ^^

[something]

This show is generating a bizarrely large number of threads asking the same thing. I can't tell if it's really resonating with people (for better or worse), or if I'm just noticing it more because I posted so extensively on it before.

Anyways, see here (http://www.animeondvd.com/forum/showtopic.php?tid/27132/), posted recently. There are also a number of Recommends Forum threads I've written quite a lot in, and one of them should link all the posts I'd made previously too.

For the quick answer though, yes, you find out more. Particularly in season two.

[TheDreaming]

Just several thoughts for now(just finished it on Hulu):

1. Yuzuki disappearing while kissing Ai = stratospheric moment beyond imagining!

2. I want that spider DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD!

3. There better be a season 4. :beat::beat::beat:

[bored@lazy]

Really? After finishing it I just thought season 3 ended up being a waste of time, and the show would have been better off finishing at the end of Season 2.

[TheDreaming]

Really? After finishing it I just thought season 3 ended up being a waste of time, and the show would have been better off finishing at the end of Season 2.

Yeah but then we'd never get the Yuzuki/Ai kiss. :(

[something]

Holy crap that's a necrobump. :sd: You should probably just clarify in your subject line so people know you're commenting on season three, since the thread implies season one.

Really? After finishing it I just thought season 3 ended up being a waste of time, and the show would have been better off finishing at the end of Season 2.
Mitsuganae was quite good, for all the wrong and all the right reasons.

It was good because it became a totally ridiculous self-parody when it didn't feel like being serious. That would have gotten old if it was all it did but thankfully it wasn't.
It was also good because when it was serious, it did it as well as either of the first two seasons.

Yuzuki alone justifies it. She is the best thing that ever came out of Jigoku Shoujo, and one of my most beloved characters of that year. And yes, that kiss was fucking beautiful. <3

[TheDreaming]

The only thing is I wish the writers had been more hard-core after episode 13(when Aiki gets banished). I wanted to see Yuzuki in utter anguish, despair, heart-rending grief. She should have not been able to go to school, get out of bed. I found it hard to believe she just went on with her normal routine. But it is what it is.

[bored@lazy]

Just to clarify I did enjoy season 3 whilst I watched it, it's just that the ending seemed to make seasons 2 and 3 rather inconseqential. There was no real progress, everything was pretty much business as usual.

[Ashyukun]

Just to clarify I did enjoy season 3 whilst I watched it, it's just that the ending seemed to make seasons 2 and 3 rather inconseqential. There was no real progress, everything was pretty much business as usual.
Which was, to some extent, the point- as long as there's evil in the world, there will be people willing to send others to Hell and there will be a means to do so.

In practical terms, it seemed pretty obvious to me that the writers didn't WANT to be making a third season, but the second had been successful enough that they were pushed into it. So they said, "Fuck it- how can we make this as ridiculous as possible?" and managed, as something said, to be both a hilarious parody of itself as well as having some serious impact when it needed to.

[something]

In practical terms, it seemed pretty obvious to me that the writers didn't WANT to be making a third season, but the second had been successful enough that they were pushed into it. So they said, "Fuck it- how can we make this as ridiculous as possible?" and managed, as something said, to be both a hilarious parody of itself as well as having some serious impact when it needed to.
The really weird thing is, Jigoku Shoujo never sold well. The first season averaged 2,858. The second season was 2,291. The last season was 1,497. It's honestly quite bizarre. Those are emphatically not the sales numbers of a three season, six cour franchise with its own live action TV drama and other media.

Maybe it got good ratings - but most of its airings were in the typical late-night anime slots, although Tokyo MX aired it at 6:30PM. Animax aired at 5PM but they're a pay channel, so I don't think it's quite the same. The other airings were all midnight or later.

Yeah, I got nothing. It obviously made money somehow, I just don't know how that was.

[TheDreaming]

Just to clarify I did enjoy season 3 whilst I watched it, it's just that the ending seemed to make seasons 2 and 3 rather inconseqential. There was no real progress, everything was pretty much business as usual.
Which was, to some extent, the point- as long as there's evil in the world, there will be people willing to send others to Hell and there will be a means to do so.

In practical terms, it seemed pretty obvious to me that the writers didn't WANT to be making a third season, but the second had been successful enough that they were pushed into it. So they said, "Fuck it- how can we make this as ridiculous as possible?" and managed, as something said, to be both a hilarious parody of itself as well as having some serious impact when it needed to.

I agree they definitely went for the laughs in some of the stand-alone vengeance stories(the plug, the turtle), and then to end it like THAT.:depressed::depressed::depressed:

[Jaynin]

As far as the humor in the 3rd season, at first I was puzzled at the injection of humor and was wondering why it got quite ridiculous in some parts, but as the season went on I started to think that this season is actually quite a bit darker than the other two, in that many more of those condemned in this season are innocent, or have no relation to or only have a brief passing encounter with their accuser and that the humor may have been an attempt to alleviate the series from being too depressing but ended up overcompensating really.
After I finished watching the discs I was kind of disappointed there was no staff interview in the extras like in the first season because I was curious to hear any comments they may have had on the tone of this season.
Overall I really like the series and wouldn't mind seeing more if they decided to continue.