Fist of the North Star 1986 Movie on 11/21

[kakugo]

Amazon Link. (http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B001DLXN7W/hokuto1-22/ref=nosim)

Thank you Go- er, Toei. :bowsmiley:

The most relevant specs I can pick out:

1.33:1 (OAR) HD Remaster
DTS Stereo
Theatrical Trailer
Photo Gallery

Limited Edition Goods:

Booklet
English Dubbing
Theatrical Version "Multi Ending"

It sounds like the "Multi Ending" is just the inclusion of the alternate international ending (ie: Raou wins) via the English dubbed version, maybe on a second disc? The Korean R3 has the Raou wins ending in Japanese, so it's not as if a Japanese track for it doesn't exist, and I'm not certain which ending actually played in Japanese theaters.

Having seen scans of 35mm theatrical prints I can confirm that the film was shot in 4:3, and that the most impressive gore scenes were uncensored until they made the film prints used for home video (supposedly to quell PTA complaints). Wither or not this new HD remaster will be censored like all existing video versions, or will be a new uncensored print from the camera negative, I can't say.

What I am certain of is that I'll find out this November. :bigsmile:

Edit: Figured out what the extras were trying to tell me.

[mcarocks2003]

It would be amazing to have it uncensored as seen in the original theatrical trailer from 1986.

This will be a really interesting release to keep an eye on thats for sure.

[Skywise]

Blu-ray or no buy. I'm seriously getting tired of the studios trying to milk this for what it's worth by using the HD masters they should be putting on BDs and instead making DVDs.

[Danime]

No English subs..... = fail

[mcarocks2003]

At least this is finally geting it's debut release on dvd, long overdue considering the amount of times the TV series has been reissued.

Hopefully this will mean the movie is now available for R1 licensing, maybe MB will give it a shot.

[Steve_the_Talking_Pie]

Does anyone have screen caps of the gore? I remember hearing this being seen in back alley theaters in Japan. Apparently the Japanese VHS rental version has a couple of original gore scenes from the trailers they included at the end of the movie.

[Buster Darkwings]

It sounds like the "Multi Ending" is just the inclusion of the alternate international ending (ie: Raou wins) via the English dubbed version,

I'm not seeing anything that indicates that it's the dubbed version. The specs are next to each other in this line that says they're limited to the 1st pressing: ※解説書/マルチエンディング仕様/英語吹き替えは、限定生産品です。 but there's clearly a slash separating them.

[kakugo]

Hrm, you're right. But then why would the multi-ending only be included in the LE? It'd either have to be a stand-alone feature or just be a part of the English dub. I can't imagine the two minutes or so worth of alternate footage wouldn't fit on the main disc, so them including the alternate ending via the English version makes more sense, unless they made a full blown featurette out of it. If Toei includes them both via seamless branching, that'd be neat.

I guess it doesn't make a big difference: it's clear that the version used on Japanese video was a last-minute affair complete with Kenshirou being optically printed into the already finished footage, so I'm almost hoping the "Raou wins" ending gets used on the main feature. :)

The uncensored screengrabs are from the trailer that was included as an extra on the 80s Toei LD. Basically the gore was censored via optical censorship, and as you can see here (http://www.fistofthenorthstar.it/film2.jpg) the censorship on all the VHS/LD/DVD releases doesn't match what was actually on the 35mm theatrical prints. The trailer can't be held as proof of much though: the trailer for Ashida's VAMPIRE HUNTER D featured backgrounds and color schemes that were changed completely once it was finished.

[Themepolis]

This is utterly fantastic! Haven't bought an R2 in a very, very long time, but this is a definate. Sure I'd also get the Bluray version, but this is something I've been waiting for for way, way, too long.

Im a bit stumped though- Im aware of the various film cropping issues that come up with Toei made films and such, but I swear I pegged this for a widescreen release. Still, don't care.

[Shawaazu]

I shall be getting this :)

I haven't seen the movie yet, only the TV series, so as far as blood goes for 80's Fist Of The North Star, I am only used to white blood XD

[kakugo]

Shawaazu, while there's a LOT of red and chunky grue on display - even in the censored video release we've had to watch up until now - there's still plenty of white blood and even some intentional optical effect tweakery to make the gore more familiar to those who had been watching the TV show all along. Despite the fact that it's more violent than Kawajiri's filmography put together, it was always intended for middle schoolers...

Ah, Japan. :)

[Skywise]

Lay off the condescending posts guys. It's neither needed nor wanted. I'm going to start handing out infractions if this keeps up.

[Thanatos]

In related news, Kenshirou and Yuria are to have a spiritual wedding ceremony for the 25th Anniversary of the franchise. (9/13/2008) It'll take place at Tokyo's Nihon (Nippon?) Seinen Kan, with 777 people invited, including Hokuto staff, celebrities, fans, and artists.

http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20080811-00000003-oric-ent

Raou previously had a funeral service.

[dejr8bud]

Woohoo finally on DVD...wish it was Blu-ray but I'll get this anyway. Subs would be nice but I've seen this so many times kinda doesn't matter to me.

[mcarocks2003]

I've seen a clip of the alternative ending in Japanese and it's original 4:3 aspect ratio on youtube so I'm pretty sure it will included, not just the English streamline dub ending.

[Mazinkaizer]

I would have preferred if it included English sub, but the reason that i won't get it is to hold for a BD release. Which is bound to happen sooner or later.

[BBQmyNUTZ]

Don't care if its censored or not, this is a must have for me. It is, in my opinion, the best representative of the series.

[kndy]

Hmm...I may want to get this as well. Price isn't too bad. But I would imagine another re-release a few years later for the 25th anniversary release.

[mcarocks2003]

Is this listed on Yesasia and CD Japan yet?

[jing]

Is this listed on...CD Japan yet?

Yep. (http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=DSTD-2894)

[Tofurkey]

A little late, but this calls for a celebration (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj4fh45fBZo).

[LordGeo]

Hopefully this will mean the movie is now available for R1 licensing, maybe MB will give it a shot.

Well, back when we got John Sirabella talking about Hokuto a while back on these forums, he said that while he didn't like the TV series he did enjoy the movie and that it needed a good remastering... Maybe MB will license rescue this movie and give it a DVD release.

[Steve_the_Talking_Pie]

Hopefully this will mean the movie is now available for R1 licensing, maybe MB will give it a shot.

Well, back when we got John Sirabella talking about Hokuto a while back on these forums, he said that while he didn't like the TV series he did enjoy the movie and that it needed a good remastering... Maybe MB will license rescue this movie and give it a DVD release.

I would definitely give this proper R1 support.

[JINROH]

Will this include subs ? If not I will still get it,but I'm just curious...

If it does hit R1,I will double dip on it,like I did with the NFOTNS that ADV put out.

[Mazinkaizer]

The only 2 companies that come to my mind as the possible candidate for the movie are: Media Blasters and ADV. Not that it's certain but IMO they're the only 2 that i can think of giving the movie a shot (if they ever decide to).

[KudosForce]

The only 2 companies that come to my mind as the possible candidate for the movie are: Media Blasters and ADV. Not that it's certain but IMO they're the only 2 that i can think of giving the movie a shot (if they ever decide to).

As long as the movie stays the heck away from Manga Entertainment, I agree with you on this!:bigsmile:

[Thanatos]

Got it.

Good news: Having seen this on VHS and LD, the clarity of the picture blows me away.

Bad news: The movie's still censored. With the same unremastered, late-80s generated video. So you'll be enjoying your glorious HD remaster, when all of a sudden you gain a shitload of grain and lose half the resolution. Oh, and by default, the movie plays the "tie" version, so for the final reel the disc reverts to "censored mode" and also changes aspect ratios.

What really hurts is Toei remastered the uncensored theatrical preview in HD.

I took a lot of captures, but I think these will speak for themselves the best.

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/81/internationalendingye3.png

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/8949/japaneseendinges7.png

It pains me the sequence in which while Raou rides into the city one of his goons kills a man voiced by the coked-up narrator from the TV series is completely in half-resolution video even though the actual killing of the dude happens completely offscreen. Point?

Not going to review this title for content, since I think we all know what we're getting into.

Packaging includes Toei Point Club coupon, upcoming releases infomation (yay, Bebop High School and other seinen 80s OVAs), 12-page movie booklet - which includes every cover and film poster, character data, and interviews with the producer and director. Oh, we also get yet another how to care of DVDs info sheet, just in case you happen to be the sole human being never to have bought a DVD in the past dozen years.

Extras: English dubbed version with "international ending", Japanese dubbed version with "Japanese ending." (Note that you can change the audio on the fly. The disc defaults to play the Japanese audio with Japanese ending (video track 1), but you select the English dub (video track 2) from the extras menu and switch it to Japanese. Also included -

"Special Report" - an early preview/trailer of the film featuring animation not used in the final version - namely a purple alien-like thing and an incorrectly-paletted Raou destroying an entire city behind Kenshirou.

"Theatrical Preview" - same as on the old LD, just now remastered.

"Promotional Film" - a mostly dialogue-less but sound effects preview. Plays almost all of the initial Ken revival/Rescue of Rin, then recycles footage from the theatrical preview.

Kinda surprised there are no Japanese subtitles, as with the other Hokuto movies. I know, different company, but this disc still carries the "Hokuto 25th Anniversary" label and Shounen Jump did release 2 color animanga filmbooks using the film dialogue.

Overall, I'm glad Toei finally released the 86 movie on DVD - no doubt timed carefully with the release of Kenshirou Densetsu, though I am very sadly disappointed that like Macross DYRL, Japanese companies are making Frankenstein HD discs of both remastered and unremastered footage. Does Toei just not want to see uncensored Hokuto no Ken Movie (aside from the pair of uncensored preview killings) this bad, or were they actually stupid enough to lose, damage, or destroy the original film for the censored scenes after they were done editing them?

[BBQmyNUTZ]

Got it.

Good news: Having seen this on VHS and LD, the clarity of the picture blows me away.

Bad news: The movie's still censored. With the same unremastered, late-80s generated video. So you'll be enjoying your glorious HD remaster, when all of a sudden you gain a shitload of grain and lose half the resolution. Oh, and by default, the movie plays the "tie" version, so for the final reel the disc reverts to "censored mode" and also changes aspect ratios.

What really hurts is Toei remastered the uncensored theatrical preview in HD.

I took a lot of captures, but I think these will speak for themselves the best.

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/81/internationalendingye3.png

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/8949/japaneseendinges7.png



This is really heartbreaking... better than nothing at all, but still. I guess that film is more or less "lost".

[kakugo]

Un-farking believable.

The Streamline English dubbed version was finished on 35mm film, so the optically printed censored material printed back to 35mm wither it was edited on video or not. Having seen photos of a 35mm theatrical print I can guarantee that the theatrical run was uncensored, so likely Toei made this new transfer from a censored answer print rather than from the camera negative. Wither the OCN (camera negative) still exists is anyone's guess, but if they have it, Toei evidently doesn't want to bother remastering it. Thanatos, is there any dot-crawl on the censored footage? With the quality of the R1/R3 DVDs it's hard to say if it was edited on video or film. I know there appears to be ghosting, but you can get a similar effect via optical printing.

Still looking forward to getting my copy, but I won't pretend I'm not angry at Toei for using a censored print. It's entirely possible that they literally removed the uncensored material from the negative and then replaced it with the censored footage, but if so there are still probably ancient 35mm prints of the film left over from theatrical showings who's gore footage could have been culled as a special feature at the very least.

P.S. - The Korean DVD actually has Japanese subtitles.

[Tofurkey]

I guess Toupee's not happy screwing up home video releases in R1, and feels it needs to expand its effort to Japan. :rolleyes:

[Thanatos]

Asking if there's dot crawl in the censored scenes is like asking me to find a piece of tomato skin in a mountain of feces, but I'll try.

I don't see any in these shots. Do you?

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/4672/magicfingerwx9.png

http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/8408/magicfinger2xa6.png

To express my feelings, I turn to the unused purple alien:

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/7381/whygod2fg0.png

[kakugo]

I could be mistaken, but I think I do see a bit of dot crawl around Shin's eyebrows and bangs in the second shot. The outlines also have (extremely) faint traces of rainbowing, unless that's just the MPEG compression going haywire.

Compare to the Korean R3 Hong Dang-Moo DVD HERE (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/Kentai/Screencaps/MagicFingerR3.png). The "HD" R2 is eerilie similar. The Toei DVD is sharper, but the R3 also did a better job of hiding the dot crawl via comb filtering: with the exception of the right border, there simply isn't any. The censorship was likely done on 80s era composite NTSC video, printed to 35mm, and finally spliced into a dupe negative/interpositive, which then replaced the original camera negative for all intents and purposes. The R1 Image DVD was taken from a newer 35mm telecine, so it lacks the frame blending on all prior transfers*, but it still had the low-res censored gore footage. The only viable explanation is that the censorship is literally an NTSC resolution effect printed to film, and no level of remastering is going to fix NTSC. Think of these scenes as analog upscaling.

Even so, gross. :puke:

Having seen a photo of an uncensored 35mm theatrical print, I find it hard to believe that Toei couldn't telecine either the camera negative, or even a worn out theatrical print and then create a Frankenstein style uncensored master from the best surviving prints. No, it wouldn't have been seamless, and it might have had a 'grindhouse' vibe, but even if they were caked in dirt and folded in half, they couldn't be any worse than that second R2 shot of Shin....

That said, THIS (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/Kentai/Screencaps/InternationalEndingR3.png) is the R3 "International" ending. Just that little glimpse of the R2 is making me drool. And weep. And make a torch... :beat:

*While the R1 Image DVD has newly printed 35mm OP/ED English titles, it's possible that the bulk of the transfer was a brand new telecine taken from the same primn that Toei used for the LD release of the film - and maybe this HD restoration, too. The print damage on both transfers looks identical to me.

[Buster Darkwings]

Well, I dunno if Toei would be willing to give their Japanese fans an inferior version like they do for their US fans, so I first thought that they would have remastered the original uncensored footage if they could have, but then again I suppose they've got to save something for the Blu-ray. Whenever they get around to releasing Blu-rays, that is.

[Thanatos]

If the Blu-Ray is uncensored, there will be riots. Or just a lot of whining.

*Pleased to have named Shin's "magic finger."

[kakugo]

"You got the touch... You got the poweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeer..." ;)

Maybe the negative was destroyed after PTA complaints... or maybe it's just in a cardboard box hiding under unsold Precure merchandise. Short of Toei releasing a MANLIER REMASTER (which they've already done for the TV series), I guess we'll never know.

[Thanatos]

While filling out the point club information, I noticed a small disclaimer on the back cover asking for the buyer's understanding that some images and/or lines are currently thought to be inappropriate but have been preserved for the sake of historical value. Also warns that the last four minutes of the film are not HD remastered.

[AUSTIN316]

I can't believe I missed news about this release! Seeing the non-remastered footage is dissapointing, as is the fact that the movie is still censored, but it's about bloody time Toei! I agree that it should also be on Blu-Ray but I just went ahead and ordered it anyway. I suppose I will just have to hope I get to buy it again on BD at some point. In its original form would be nice but seeing the state of Japanese these days, it is highly unlikely.

I have a question about the first pressing, is the full Streamline dub included or does it just switch at the end? Is the "international" ending also available in Japanese? Although I will watch it in Japanese more than English, it would be nice to have the old Streamline dub for nostalgia sake. FotNS was one of the Manga Video titles I was most looking forward to coming to Oz way back on 6 Dec, 1994. My how time flies.

Thanks

[Thanatos]

Yes, the English dub track is complete and plays all the way through.

[Thanatos]

Anyone willing to take a bullet for the team and purchase YOU WA SHOCK: LIVE IN ITALIA?

http://www.yamatovideo.com/customer/product.php?productid=2239&cat=1#

A previous VHS release of KEN IL GUERRIERO Il Film is partially uncensored.

[kakugo]

Just got a confirmation from an Italian fan: The Yamato DVD is just as censored as any other DVD release, and apparently has poor video quality to boot. Keep your eyes peeled for that Ken il Guerriero - Il Film PAL VHS if you want to watch Ken fight Shin and Ken save Rin in full color. Sadly, every other edited scene is the same as what we've all seen before.

Got my Toei R2 in yesterday, though I haven't yet watched it all the way through. Overall I'm happy with it so far. A shame it doesn't include the Streamline alternate credits, lest I'd literally have no reason to keep my ancient Image R1 DVD.

I'm pretty sure this will remain THE Hokuto no DVD to own for the next several years, unless some German bootlegger finds a vingage uncensored theatrical print and releases an uncensored Grindhouse version, thus motivating Toei to HD Remaster HARDER. (Worked for Four Flies on Gray Velvet... probably won't strike twice, though. :( )

Stripping off the extras and English dub options would likely leave the disc roughly DVD5 sized, so if you want those (and I sure did) I'd suggest grabbing the first press version while it's still available.

[Thanatos]

I'm pretty sure this will remain THE Hokuto no DVD to own for the next several years, unless some German bootlegger finds a vingage uncensored theatrical print and releases an uncensored Grindhouse version, thus motivating Toei to HD Remaster HARDER. )


I would totally buy "激男HDリマスター" based on title alone. :D I'd like to think that Toei's Blu-ray will be less censored, but if they're OK making a shit quality remastered standard definition disc, I have little hope they'll make yet another master for the Blu-ray.

[kakugo]

Checking over the R1 and R2 side by side, I think Toei has manipulated the contrast just a bit too much for comfort:

Image DVD (1998) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/Kentai/Screencaps/ZR1.jpg)

Toei HD Remaster DVD (2008)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/Kentai/Screencaps/ZR2.jpg)
Despite some overzealous color correction and a touch of digital manipulation, the R2 still beats the R1 by a mile, it's just a shame that Toei wasn't more careful with their classic. Streamline would have had a multiple generation print with worse contrast, so there's simply no excuse for those whites being so bright they literally eat through speed lines.

[AUSTIN316]

Stripping off the extras and English dub options would likely leave the disc roughly DVD5 sized, so if you want those (and I sure did) I'd suggest grabbing the first press version while it's still available.

That's pretty much the reason I got this DVD instead of the Riding Bean BD. Sadly with the state of the Australian dollar at the moment, I could not afford both along with the BGC box. I usually order from HMV.jp because they have cheap EMS shipping but they were out of stock for both the HnK movie and the BGC BD box with neither coming in a week after I ordered them so I made my first amazon.jp order in quite a while because they still had both in stock. There is no telling how limited the first press is so I felt better ordering from amazon.

I popped it in this afternoon after taking a quick look at BGC and it looks fantastic. I skipped through a few chapters and stopped at the scene where the bikers attack the travelers. Such a shame that the censored footage spoils the remaster. The way Japan is these days, I guess there will never be an uncensored version released. If it wouldn't fly in the late 80's, there is no way it would now. At any rate, I am looking forward to seeing it again! It has been many, many, many years since I watched my old VHS.

I was rather impressed that Toei even took the time to remaster the theatrical trailers and promo movie, very nice. Now if only the bastards would start releasing BDs already.

[dejr8bud]

So the English dub and the international ending are LEs? Hmm I find it weird that Toei, down the road, would spend the money to re-release the DVD without them..

[NetMD]

Hey people!

I am a new user on this board. I bought the R2 release of HOK and it was sad that we didn't get a fully remastered film. I don't understand why this DVD cant be sold uncensored with an R-18 rating on the dvd cover.

Earlier this year, Toei with another disturber released a remastered version of the HOK movie in Italian.

Someone uploaded it on you tube and it just like the R2 released in terms of the censoring. The VHS version which was released long ago, contained the Shin torturing Ken scene uncensored.

Which can be viewed here:bigsmile:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2iSaRAbLuv4

Enjoy!

[AUSTIN316]

Cool, thanks for that. Was there any other scenes left uncensored or only that one?

After watching the movie again on Tuesday I have to say that I really really enjoyed it alot more than I thought I would. I have no idea why I thought I would not enjoy it though because I loved it 14 years ago when I first bought that old Manga VHS tape. I did think the violence was a little silly but I enjoyed the movie overall. I think it may have to do with the fact that a very good friend of mine loves HnK (but doesn't like other anime, he is by no means an anime fan) and he kept telling me how much he disliked the movie and how crap it was. I thought that maybe it wouldn't be as good as I once thought it was but boy was I wrong. I loved it!

Finally getting to hear the legendary Kamiya Akira's (my fav Male seiyuu of all time) Kenshiro was rather cool too. Sure the censored, VHS and even less-than-VHS quality scenes were shit but it didn't detract from my enjoyment.... too much. It just let me know when something was coming coming up that was OK to be animated and shown in a theatre in 1986, but deemed to be "inappropriate" after that *roll* Some of them just seemed much worse quality than others to me. The scene were Rei saved his sister from Jaggi for instance, as he ran towards her he sliced some guys up. That looked like an old 4th gen fandub or something.

The ending was a bit of a shock too when the unremastered footage started. It was pretty damn bad.

I was left scratching my head after watching it though, about the whole censorship issue. There was still plenty of exploding heads with bits of brains and entrails falling about that were not censored. The exploding head in the trailer, which I thought would be censored, was not for instance. It was very inconsistent in my eyes.

So I have the question for those here that are "in the know", what is the deal with the censorship? I imagine that being one of those Toei movies-of-an-popular-anime-series, that people took their kids to see it and then complained about the high level of sickening violence? It seems weird that Toei gave the OK for it to be ANIMATED and then fucked the fans over by never giving them the movie as it was intended and originally shown. If the violence in OVAs like Angel Cop and Cybernator (which almost made me heave, frankly, it was sickening) were fine to be released on home video formats, why the hell was HnK forever banned? Is it simply because it was a main stream title?

[AUSTIN316]

After watching that uncensored Italian VHS version on you tube, I saw the same remade scene they did for Yuria Den. My God it was so lame compared to the original. I did not like the art, the animation was bad and the acting had none of the emotion of the scene in the movie.

[AUSTIN316]

So the English dub and the international ending are LEs? Hmm I find it weird that Toei, down the road, would spend the money to re-release the DVD without them..

The silly part about that is that the "international" ending is the one that is remastered! The Japanese ending is in horrible, cropped, sub VHS quality. I am guessing that the international ending was the original and they altered it for video release? It looks even worse than some of the censored footage. It really makes me wonder why the hell they didn't just edit in the last scene of Kenshiro sitting up and then standing there (very badly I might add, it is so obvious it is edited in!) watching Raoh walk away. Instead, they had the whole fight looking like a 4th gen VHS copy. Once the end credit sequence starts, it goes back to remastered footage.

[dejr8bud]

So the English dub and the international ending are LEs? Hmm I find it weird that Toei, down the road, would spend the money to re-release the DVD without them..

The silly part about that is that the "international" ending is the one that is remastered! The Japanese ending is in horrible, cropped, sub VHS quality. I am guessing that the international ending was the original and they altered it for video release? It looks even worse than some of the censored footage. It really makes me wonder why the hell they didn't just edit in the last scene of Kenshiro sitting up and then standing there (very badly I might add, it is so obvious it is edited in!) watching Raoh walk away. Instead, they had the whole fight looking like a 4th gen VHS copy. Once the end credit sequence starts, it goes back to remastered footage.

Oh good lord...I ordered a copy from Yesasia the other day..dunno which version I'll get..

[AUSTIN316]

If you look at the bottom of the description page, yesasia sometimes state if the first press is sold out or not. It isn't as good as CD Japan for that though and sometimes they don't bother.

[dejr8bud]

If you look at the bottom of the description page, yesasia sometimes state if the first press is sold out or not. It isn't as good as CD Japan for that though and sometimes they don't bother.



Ya I saw that on yesasia and CDJapan said first press sold out and Amazon JP who knows..

the first press is the red-ish cover right?

[AUSTIN316]

It's blue actually. I just looked at CD Japan and I see the normal edition is red so hope for a blue cover when you get open the package!

[kakugo]

A couple of things I'll try to adress:

1) The "Raou Wins" ending is less an 'international' ending and more that it's the original ending. The movie was released on Japanese video in late 1986, right when the series was ramping up the second Kenshirou vs Raou arc, so the ending was re-animated into the "Draw" ending specifically to entice fans to keep their eyes on the first TV series' conclusion. Tetsuo HARA and Buronson wrote the screenplay for the movie, so I assume the Raou Wins ending was their idea of the best way to stop the story half way through; give Kenshirou some humility and Raou something resembling humanity, which would happen (in very different forms) in the manga and TV series down the road anyway.

The "Draw" ending literally looks like Ken was superimposed over the original footage. I'm thinking the home video ending was actually finished on vintage composite video, in which case they almost can't remaster it because there's really no film to go back to for parts of it. Yes, Toei could have restored the film footage and then digitally added the shot of Ken in over the theatrical ending footage, but that was simply more time, effort, and/or money than Toei was willing to spend on the project... :angry:

2) The censorship is a complex issue. For one thing, the EIRIN didn't start handing out movie ratings until 1998, and even then a violent fantasy film like Ryuhei KITAMURA's Versus, which had to be edited for an 'R' in the US and got an '18' in the UK uncut, was granted a PG-12 in Japanese theaters. The EIRIN doesn't touch home video releases directly, and even some films refused Japanese theatrical release - like Organ and All Night Long 2: Atrocity - were released on video in Japan without issue, simply because it's outside of the EIRIN's jurisdiction.

With that in mind, the censorship is firmly in Toei's lap. Having seen photos of a 35mm print with Shin scarring up Kenshirou uncensored, I know that at least some of the censorship was last minute... but I also know that the Streamline 35mm master is censored the same way as the Japanese home video release. What this implies is that the footage was censored, and literally replaced on the film negative/master positive/whatever print Toei made their HD remaster and "new" 35mm prints from.

As the guy getting nuked immediately after the credits has a similar double-exposure blur effect but is still taken from a clean film source, I don't doubt that the theatrical release was somewhat censored, too. Odds are it just wasn't censored enough for someone at Toei, and so sequences that likely were uncensored in theaters got an additional layer of video censorship on home video and latter film prints. Without a genuine vintage Roadshow print it's impossible to say which specific scenes were unedited on the big screen, but as some of the editing - particularly Galf crushing some guy's head as Raou marches through Cassandra - looks really clunky and poorly thought out, I don't doubt that the censorship of the title was something Toei did internally, and probably without the help of the film makers.

Maybe it was PTA complaints. Maybe it was the film producers worried they'd scare off the younger target demographic. Maybe Ashida Toyoo felt he'd gone too far and had an AD do the dirty work. Nobody really knows. I've been trying to piece the story together for years now, but short of excavating the Toei vaults with the original editor and director on hand, I'm not sure it's even possible at this point. :(

[AUSTIN316]

Thanks for the insight. The whole history of the exactly what happened with the censorship would certainly be interesting, I would love to know the full story but I guess that will never happen. I suppose the only way to know about the theatrical print and whether or not it was censored would be to hear from people who saw it at a theatre and remember it well enough. At the very least we know the scene with Shin torturing Kenshiro was uncensored because of the film reel shot that was posted in this thread and the Italian VHS release.

I would like to think that the original print, be it slightly censored or completely censorship free, still exists in Toei HQ somewhere. It would be a crime in my eyes if the original movie was destroyed by Toei back in the late 80's for the LD/VHS releases. Even if it never sees the light of day as a home video release. I would love to have a full, uncut BD release but that is purely wishful thinking!

One thing I thought when I bought the movie and saw it for the first time back on 8 December, 1994 (I got the DVD on the 8th of December as well funnily enough!), is that it wasn't as gory as I thought it would be. Seeing the exploding heads blur out and the white blood etc was not what I imagined when I kept hearing about this "ultra violent anime movie", although that is not the reason I wanted to see it. I see why now, it's because the original version (seen via the remastered trailers) is what I imagined it to be and the home version was censored. It's quite a revelation for me.

As for the different endings, I figured the "international" ending was actually the original ending which was changed for the home version. I just don't understand why Toei chose to use such a long piece of horrid looking footage for the DVD when they could have cut to the VHS footage when needed such as the pathetic looking Ken standing there at the end. I see no reason for the whole fight AND the scene afterwards when the kids discuss Kenshiro going in search of Yuria and then finding the flowers, to all have that sub-VHS quality footage when there was remastered footage available. I watched both one after the other and saw no differences apart from 3 shots in during the fight.

[Thanatos]

I'd just like to point out "VHS footage" is not an appropriate term here because it gives the misconception the DVD pulled the censored scenes from a VHS tape. They aren't. The censored scenes simply aren't remastered.

Out of love, I got the Japanese VHS tape to see if the rumors that it was uncensored were true. They weren't, but watching the VHS knowing where to expect the censorship was interesting - I noticed that even on the VHS there was a big difference between the clean footage and the low quality censored scenes. I think I had just never noticed the huge quality drop because I hadn't been actively looking for it.

[AUSTIN316]

I know it is not ACTUAL VHS footage but it looks as even shittier than a VHS tape to me so I refer to it as VHS footage :P It certainly looks much worse than say, Macross Flashback to me and that is the closest thing I can compare it to seeing as they were both tape edited and not from a remastered film source.

[Bumble]

Ya I saw that on yesasia and CDJapan said first press sold out and Amazon JP who knows..

For what it's worth, I ordered a copy from Amazon JP on December 5, and it was the first press version, but a lot can happen in six days!

[dejr8bud]

Mine showed up today..1st press version...from a quick glance it looks good..blows my LD rip on DVD(that has the "draw" ending) away lol

But since the new DVD plays the "draw" ending by default..what ending will the 2nd press etc DVD have? The non-remastered "draw" or the remastered "Raoh" wins/original ending? wierd..

[AUSTIN316]

But since the new DVD plays the "draw" ending by default..what ending will the 2nd press etc DVD have? The non-remastered "draw" or the remastered "Raoh" wins/original ending? wierd..

Seeing as there is a warning about the last 4 minutes being non-remastered at the begining, I will guess the fugly "draw" ending will be it. Quite a stupid decision on Toei's part methinks.