Final Fantasy XIII Discussion

[Kaikou]

This topic is specifically for all posts related to Final Fantasy XIII. Therefore, the Final Fantasy Mega-thread will be free of FFXIII posts. Same rules apply as far as spoilers, which means that anything related to the story of the game is to be posted with spoiler tags.

[pathos]

I haven't heard anything about versus in awhile, so I was wondering myself about it too.

Of course, since I'm always such an optimist, I just assumed the game had been scrapped entirely :P

[Kaikou]

I haven't heard anything about versus in awhile, so I was wondering myself about it too.

Of course, since I'm always such an optimist, I just assumed the game had been scrapped entirely :P

I'm hoping for a simultaneous US/UK/Japan release. Fall/Christmas 2010 would be my best guess on a potential release date.

[Fencedude]

I'm hoping for a simultaneous US/UK/Japan release. Fall/Christmas 2010 would be my best guess on a potential release date.

I'm not going to hold my breath.

[Kaikou]

I'm hoping for a simultaneous US/UK/Japan release. Fall/Christmas 2010 would be my best guess on a potential release date.

I'm not going to hold my breath.

I won't be holding mine either. I still think this game has a strong potential to still come out for Xbox 360, regardless of what Square-Enix says.

[ADC]

I'm hoping for a simultaneous US/UK/Japan release. Fall/Christmas 2010 would be my best guess on a potential release date.
I'm not going to hold my breath.
I won't be holding mine either. I still think this game has a strong potential to still come out for Xbox 360, regardless of what Square-Enix says.
Microsoft can afford to pay for it, so why not? But if they pay Square to delay agito XIII until they can get a Zune game player out, that's where I have to draw the line.

[broodwars]

1up has an article up on the FF XIII battle system, specifically the Paradigm Shift mechanic.

http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=9013668

So FF XIII models itself after X-2 with the Paradigm Shifts standing in for instant class changes, does it? Interesting, though I wonder how that is linked to this game's version of the Sphere Grid (does each character have a "sphere grid" for each class type, or is there one big one with branching paths ala FF X? Maybe just one for the entire party?). It sounds interesting enough and strategic, though potentially a bit tricky to manage on the fly.

[Fencedude]

Oooohh....HP refils after battles.

I'm more than willing to accept complex random encounters if I don't have to constantly fret about my HP.

Also after playing Ar Tonelico, "Paradigm Shift" amuses me.

[broodwars]

Oooohh....HP refils after battles.

I'm more than willing to accept complex random encounters if I don't have to constantly fret about my HP.

Yeah, I'm definitely in that same camp. I loved that in Wild Arms 4 and 5 your health regenerated after the battle, because if gave the developers license to make the battles themselves more strategic and meaningful (which actually turned out to be unfortunate for me, since that meant battles dragged on a bit and increased the chance of the games crashing on my PS3 before I could get to a save point). It also means that you as a player don't have to hold back in battle for the sake of conserving HP/MP down the line. It won't be for everyone (just as the game's linearity won't be), but I like it.

[Suwako Moriya]

Oooohh....HP refils after battles.

I like the sound of that. I think it it would be good in general if more RPGs followed the idea of essentially setting up their systems in such a way that players would be allowed to go all out even in normal battles. Simply because it leads to more interesting battles. At least potentially anyway.

[Senku]

Oooohh....HP refils after battles.

I like the sound of that. I think it it would be good in general if more RPGs followed the idea of essentially setting up their systems in such a way that players would be allowed to go all out even in normal battles. Simply because it leads to more interesting battles. At least potentially anyway.

When I first saw this concept, I think it was in WA4, I was pretty hesitant to accept it. But after playing through WA5 and how much fun I had with that game, I actually like not having to worry about HP every single minute of the game.

Not that I'm one of those people who are "freaking out" about party AI, but I know I can control my party better then the AI in Persona 3 (that was referenced in the article) I guess if it's the same level as that or higher, it'll be fine with me.

Overall, I'm looking forward to this battle system.

[Suwako Moriya]

When I first saw this concept, I think it was in WA4, I was pretty hesitant to accept it. But after playing through WA5 and how much fun I had with that game, I actually like not having to worry about HP every single minute of the game.

I was familiar with the concept of HP regenerating to full after battle thanks to playing SaGa Frontier. Which also gave a way for you to keep your WP and JP up. Assuming you made proper use of at least two parties.

In any case, I read the article and at least on paper the system for Final Fantasy 13 sounds like it has quite a bit of potential. Hopefully it will be one of those systems that's also good in execution.

[HitokiriShadow]

1up has an article up on the FF XIII battle system, specifically the Paradigm Shift mechanic.

http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=9013668


Thanks for that. This is the kind of thing I've been waiting months for. I really wish SquareEnix would have released this kind of information themselves, before they started revealing a lot more character and story information that I wanted to know.

What little I knew of the battle system had intrigued me and was the main reason I was looking forward to this game. It sounds like FFXIII has a pretty good battle system and I can't wait to try it out. I liked the Sphere Grid system, so I'm pleased to see that something similar is returning.

I had heard about the HP refilling a few days ago. I didn't know much else, aside from the Paradigm Shift basics I had heard months ago. How I feel about HP refilling after battles depends on how well it fits with the game's battle system and other game structure elements, but it can have some positives. Doing so can allow for tougher enemies, as the enemies have to be challenging in their own right rather than just how badly they can run down your MP and healing supplies. And sure enough, the article shows that FFXIII is doing just that. I have no problems with how FFs and RPGs traditionally handle items and (not) healing after battle, but I also have no problem with FFXIII going this direction.

I'll have to wait and see what exactly people mean by describing the game as excessively linear to decide how I feel about it. If they mean its like FFX, then it probably won't bother me. If its something else, I'll have to wait and see, but as long as the end game has a good amount of optional content and lets me go back to the previous areas if I choose to, I probably won't have much to complain about.

Edit: Oh, and as for the party member AI thing... I'll have to see how it plays out. It works in some games and not in others. I really prefer direct control unless its a Tales/Star Ocean type battle system, FF games traditionally have direct control of all party members (with the exception of some guest characters, perhaps), and I don't really want this to become the standard for FF games, but its entirely possible (and quite likely) it will work well here, so I'll wait until I play it to decide how I feel about it.

[Kaikou]

When I first saw this concept, I think it was in WA4, I was pretty hesitant to accept it. But after playing through WA5 and how much fun I had with that game, I actually like not having to worry about HP every single minute of the game.

I was familiar with the concept of HP regenerating to full after battle thanks to playing SaGa Frontier. Which also gave a way for you to keep your WP and JP up. Assuming you made proper use of at least two parties.

In any case, I read the article and at least on paper the system for Final Fantasy 13 sounds like it has quite a bit of potential. Hopefully it will be one of those systems that's also good in execution.

I personally like the way they handle things in Chrono Trigger. You still have to think about healing your party after battle, but if someone dies they have 1HP, which negates having to use an item or magic to revive them.

I'm not sure how I'll like having my HP refilled after each battle, as I was extremely disappointed when I first played Final Fantasy VII and found out that all status ailments were gone after leaving a battle. I want to have to cure those status ailments on my own and if I can't heal them then I want the challenge of having to either deal with a dead party member or trying to survive until I can obtain a healing item or reach a town.

[tadakichi]

Not that I'm one of those people who are "freaking out" about party AI, but I know I can control my party better then the AI in Persona 3 (that was referenced in the article) I guess if it's the same level as that or higher, it'll be fine with me.

That bit kind of annoyed me, because out of the three other examples he gave (FFXII, DQIV, and Bioware games), FFXII and DQIV let you turn off or override AI control, and I believe at least some of the Bioware games are the same way. I wouldn't mind if it was an option, or even the default, but if bad AI that I can't turn off gets my party wiped out in a tough boss battle, I'd say it's a legitimate grievance.

Of course, the game's already out, and I haven't read any complaints about the AI, so it's probably not a huge issue. Is there any way to fine-tune AI behavior similar to Gambits? Preferably better than Gambits...

[Fencedude]

Edit: Oh, and as for the party member AI thing... I'll have to see how it plays out. It works in some games and not in others. I really prefer direct control unless its a Tales/Star Ocean type battle system, FF games traditionally have direct control of all party members (with the exception of some guest characters, perhaps), and I don't really want this to become the standard for FF games, but its entirely possible (and quite likely) it will work well here, so I'll wait until I play it to decide how I feel about it.

MARIN FUCKING KARIN

;_;

Death is a hunter unbenown to its prey...

[TheGreenMan]

Cute scene between Fang and Vanille. It's not spoilerish:

http://www.viddler.com/explore/GamingParodies/videos/144/

[Kaikou]

Cute scene between Fang and Vanille. It's not spoilerish:

http://www.viddler.com/explore/GamingParodies/videos/144/

Any scene containing story elements is considered a spoiler.

This is a warning to you and others to be considerate in posting regarding spoiler content. I also noticed your post in the other thread, which is a spoiler that you posted without the proper spoiler tags. Infractions will be given for any further posts regarding story elements that are posted without the proper spoiler tags.

This particular post is not a spoiler by the way, but telling people the video linked is not a spoiler is a bit misleading.

Also I encourage people to use the mod alert button if they see a spoiler posted, so that we can avoid more users seeing it than need be.

[HitokiriShadow]

Edit: Oh, and as for the party member AI thing... I'll have to see how it plays out. It works in some games and not in others. I really prefer direct control unless its a Tales/Star Ocean type battle system, FF games traditionally have direct control of all party members (with the exception of some guest characters, perhaps), and I don't really want this to become the standard for FF games, but its entirely possible (and quite likely) it will work well here, so I'll wait until I play it to decide how I feel about it.

MARIN FUCKING KARIN

;_;

Death is a hunter unbenown to its prey...

Yeah, Persona 3 would be a great example of that "not in others" category where it works really poorly. Tales of Legendia would be another as my AI allies preferred to cast spells that enemies absorbed, often doing it repeatedly, unless I disabled them from casting it. So I had to either disable all of their spells except the one or two I wanted them to use, or disable everything and manually tell them to cast what I wanted every single time.

But until I hear massive complaining about shoddy AI in FF13, I'll remain optimistic about the AI allies.

[ADC]

… I really prefer direct control unless its a Tales/Star Ocean type battle system …
MARIN FUCKING KARIN
Yeah, Persona 3 would be a great example of that "not in others" category where it works really poorly …
To be fair, the SO type battle system has more than its share of artificial stupidity, particularly when it's time for some healing. They're either a day late and a dollar short, or they're using the strongest cure spell ever on a paper cut. It's one of the reasons I've totally given up on the SOs (along with the horrible voice acting).

Honestly, I don't trust Square to do a good job on AI. But (version 1.0) I still haven't played any of the KH games yet, so I could just not know what they're truly capable of. But (version 2.0) most of the other RPG houses doing AI for player control have made a pig's ear of it, so Square's hardly alone. And getting back to being fair, the AI in Persona 3 is some of the best I've seen, Mitsuru notwithstanding.

[broodwars]

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/import-preview-final-fantasy/60558

Gametrailers just posted a pretty good video preview of FF XIII. Be warned that there are minor story spoilers in the video, which detail the basic setup of the plot and its structure (including what the mission of Lightning and co. is as L'Cie).

Several details I was not aware of:

- If you die in battle, you just respawn in the area you were killed rather than being sent back to the save point. A welcome addition from my point of view, so long as the battles are reasonably difficult and strategic.

- There are no shops in the game's towns and whatnot. Instead, you purchase equipment from menus at save points. I really don't like this feature, as while it centralizes all the stores in the game and makes it so you don't need to backtrack it also strips away one more layer of personality to the game world.

[Senku]

I really don't like this feature, as while it centralizes all the stores in the game and makes it so you don't need to backtrack it also strips away one more layer of personality to the game world.

But maybe adding that layer doesn't fit into the game world in the first place.

Now I still don't know anything about the world or whatnot of XIII, but just from the trailers it seems that technology in the game allows for a "one-stop-shop" sort of mechanic. Everything seems regulated and connected, so having shops separate from the "system" would seem out of place.

Then again, once I pop the game in I could completely agree with you.

[broodwars]

I really don't like this feature, as while it centralizes all the stores in the game and makes it so you don't need to backtrack it also strips away one more layer of personality to the game world.

But maybe adding that layer doesn't fit into the game world in the first place.

Now I still don't know anything about the world or whatnot of XIII, but just from the trailers it seems that technology in the game allows for a "one-stop-shop" sort of mechanic. Everything seems regulated and connected, so having shops separate from the "system" would seem out of place.

Perhaps, but why relegate it to a selection in the Save Point menu? Why not just have a traveling merchant (name them Biggs or something) follow you around and periodically update their stock? This is the same stupid decision that Resident Evil 5 made, where they ditched the awesome arms dealer from RE4 and just made shopping this impersonal menu option between chapters.

[Senku]

I really don't like this feature, as while it centralizes all the stores in the game and makes it so you don't need to backtrack it also strips away one more layer of personality to the game world.

But maybe adding that layer doesn't fit into the game world in the first place.

Now I still don't know anything about the world or whatnot of XIII, but just from the trailers it seems that technology in the game allows for a "one-stop-shop" sort of mechanic. Everything seems regulated and connected, so having shops separate from the "system" would seem out of place.

Perhaps, but why relegate it to a selection in the Save Point menu? Why not just have a traveling merchant (name them Biggs or something) follow you around and periodically update their stock? This is the same stupid decision that Resident Evil 5 made, where they ditched the awesome arms dealer from RE4 and just made shopping this impersonal menu option between chapters.

Never really played RE5 yet, so that sucks about the arms dealer.

But I can't say whether it's going to be stupid or not until I play the game.

[Fencedude]

Perhaps, but why relegate it to a selection in the Save Point menu? Why not just have a traveling merchant (name them Biggs or something) follow you around and periodically update their stock? This is the same stupid decision that Resident Evil 5 made, where they ditched the awesome arms dealer from RE4 and just made shopping this impersonal menu option between chapters.

But what if the fact that its all done in an automated fashion is the point?

Its possible that while it was a bad idea in RE5, but a perfectly fine one here. The games are pretty much completely different.

[ilmaestro]

Now I still don't know anything about the world or whatnot of XIII, but just from the trailers it seems that technology in the game allows for a "one-stop-shop" sort of mechanic. Everything seems regulated and connected, so having shops separate from the "system" would seem out of place.
Exactly. It doesn't feel like a problem at all once you're playing the game.

[mighty_vespa]

I really don't like this feature, as while it centralizes all the stores in the game and makes it so you don't need to backtrack it also strips away one more layer of personality to the game world.

So, I can just grind-grind-grind-GRIND in one area, go to the nearest save point and buy the Masamune/Whatever!Super-Sword there? Interesting.

[broodwars]

I really don't like this feature, as while it centralizes all the stores in the game and makes it so you don't need to backtrack it also strips away one more layer of personality to the game world.

So, I can just grind-grind-grind-GRIND in one area, go to the nearest save point and buy the Masamune/Whatever!Super-Sword there? Interesting.

Well, I assume that the shop updates with new equipment each chapter and that the best stuff has to be found, but yeah.

[Fencedude]

I really don't like this feature, as while it centralizes all the stores in the game and makes it so you don't need to backtrack it also strips away one more layer of personality to the game world.

So, I can just grind-grind-grind-GRIND in one area, go to the nearest save point and buy the Masamune/Whatever!Super-Sword there? Interesting.

Nothing generally stops you from doing that in any other game.

[Kaikou]

My excitement for this game is waning, while the general story sounds like an improvement over FFXIII, I can't help but be disappointed that a majority of what happens in battle is handled by AI.

Couple that with the fact that apparently this FF is one of the easiest so far, makes me feel really apprehensive about the series future with the "older" fans. I'd love to see a traditional Final Fantasy with on screen enemies that trigger a ATB.

I wish Square-Enix would make further use of their Crystal Tools and re-make some of the Playstation One era Final Fantasy titles. :relief:

[Rhodes]

“They spent 5 years making huge dungeons which in the end were whittled down by superiors and marketing… Now it’s just a one-way tunnel!”

Wonder if that line and accompanying panel from SZS has anything to do with FF13 or if it predates this game.

[HitokiriShadow]

“They spent 5 years making huge dungeons which in the end were whittled down by superiors and marketing… Now it’s just a one-way tunnel!”

Wonder if that line and accompanying panel from SZS has anything to do with FF13 or if it predates this game.

If it's from a chapter that just came out in the last few weeks in Japan, then its almost certainly referring to FF13. If not, its probably referring to something else. If its from the U.S. release, then there's no way its referring to FF13.

[Rhodes]

“They spent 5 years making huge dungeons which in the end were whittled down by superiors and marketing… Now it’s just a one-way tunnel!”

Wonder if that line and accompanying panel from SZS has anything to do with FF13 or if it predates this game.

If it's from a chapter that just came out in the last few weeks in Japan, then its almost certainly referring to FF13. If not, its probably referring to something else. If its from the U.S. release, then there's no way its referring to FF13.

It's from the JP manga, not sure how recently since Sankaku didnt list the vol.

[HitokiriShadow]

It's from the JP manga, not sure how recently since Sankaku didnt list the vol.

Then its probably from the most recent chapter.

[broodwars]

Gametrailers has a new official trailer up for the English version, complete with the English version pop song and the same minor spoilers (and a lot of new FMV battle sequences) that have been in all the official trailers: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/international-trailer-final-fantasy/60730

Surprisingly, at least in that trailer I thought that pop song worked pretty well. Very good trailer, too.

[Suwako Moriya]

The more I read about this, the more I get the impression that the main goal of this game was to streamline the experience. Or maybe that's not the right word for it. I guess I'll put it another way. I guess it's like going from boiling water to cook pasta to just nuking a frozen pasta dinner in the oven.

[ADC]

The more I read about this, the more I get the impression that the main goal of this game was to streamline the experience. Or maybe that's not the right word for it. I guess I'll put it another way. I guess it's like going from boiling water to cook pasta to just nuking a frozen pasta dinner in the oven.
I think it's more likely a reaction to how open FF12's gameworld was, with all sorts of paths and cul-de-sacs with hidden bosses and what have you. FF12's gameworld was so big and with so much to do, it got in the way of the game's mediocre story and left the player running around with no idea what was going on or where to go next (but utterly mesmerized by the perfectly-modeled ass of his chosen girlie).

[Fencedude]

Gametrailers has a new official trailer up for the English version, complete with the English version pop song and the same minor spoilers (and a lot of new FMV battle sequences) that have been in all the official trailers: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/international-trailer-final-fantasy/60730

Surprisingly, at least in that trailer I thought that pop song worked pretty well. Very good trailer, too.

That song was actually not terrible. Not really to my taste in general, but quite acceptable anyway.

Also first thought: SHE'S A REYVATEIL!

[Rhodes]

New article/interview at Kotaku that says enough FF13 content on cutting room floor to make a 2nd game.

http://kotaku.com/5446974/interview-there-is-enough-discarded-final-fantasy-xiii-to-make-another-game

With the 360 version of this game on 3 DVDs... sounds to me like they had to gut the game in order to make it fit on to as few DVDs as possible... ie core game only and what side/optional quests as they could without going over those 3 DVDs. So I guess Kumeta-sensei's remark in SZS is right... 5 years worth of work whittled away by execs.

[broodwars]

New article/interview at Kotaku that says enough FF13 content on cutting room floor to make a 2nd game.

http://kotaku.com/5446974/interview-there-is-enough-discarded-final-fantasy-xiii-to-make-another-game

With the 360 version of this game on 3 DVDs... sounds to me like they had to gut the game in order to make it fit on to as few DVDs as possible... ie core game only and what side/optional quests as they could without going over those 3 DVDs.

It's possible that they cut all that content out to benefit the 360 port, but I highly doubt it. Content gets cut all the time in the development process, but for some reason people make a big deal about it now instead of looking at the product they actually got. As like is not, the Execs looked at the game and basically said "hey, this game has been in development for an eternity, and we need to release it." So whatever wasn't polished up to Square-Enix standards got the axe, and as like is not the game's better for it.

[Fencedude]

It's possible that they cut all that content out to benefit the 360 port, but I highly doubt it. Content gets cut all the time in the development process, but for some reason people make a big deal about it now instead of looking at the product they actually got. As like is not, the Execs looked at the game and basically said "hey, this game has been in development for an eternity, and we need to release it." So whatever wasn't polished up to Square-Enix standards got the axe, and as like is not the game's better for it.

Yeah, there seems to be this need with this game to blame how it is on someone, ANYONE other than the people who actually made it.

Its Microsoft's fault! Its Squeenix exec's fault! Its <insert next week's scapegoat here>'s fault!

And by and large its from people who haven't actually played the game.

[Senku]

Surprisingly, at least in that trailer I thought that pop song worked pretty well. Very good trailer, too.

I said I would admit it; and I do - The song fits pretty well. I was also impressed by whoever they got voice Hope, not that I think anybody sounded bad, but Hope stood out to me in the trailer.

[Senku]

The more I read about this, the more I get the impression that the main goal of this game was to streamline the experience. Or maybe that's not the right word for it. I guess I'll put it another way. I guess it's like going from boiling water to cook pasta to just nuking a frozen pasta dinner in the oven.
I think it's more likely a reaction to how open FF12's gameworld was, with all sorts of paths and cul-de-sacs with hidden bosses and what have you. FF12's gameworld was so big and with so much to do, it got in the way of the game's mediocre story and left the player running around with no idea what was going on or where to go next (but utterly mesmerized by the perfectly-modeled ass of his chosen girlie).

XII is proof that you can have to much world. So if XIII is more streamlined for the best experience, I welcome it.

[Senku]

It's possible that they cut all that content out to benefit the 360 port, but I highly doubt it. Content gets cut all the time in the development process, but for some reason people make a big deal about it now instead of looking at the product they actually got. As like is not, the Execs looked at the game and basically said "hey, this game has been in development for an eternity, and we need to release it." So whatever wasn't polished up to Square-Enix standards got the axe, and as like is not the game's better for it.

If the content was ready to go and perfect, I don't think MS would have a problem adding another disc. Unless it's in a contract somewhere that it HAD to be 3 discs.

But deadlines are a good thing. Ideas and projects are fine, but it needs to be reined in at some point to make a product, hopefully a good product that will sell.

[ADC]

If the content was ready to go and perfect, I don't think MS would have a problem adding another disc. Unless it's in a contract somewhere that it HAD to be 3 discs.

But deadlines are a good thing. Ideas and projects are fine, but it needs to be reined in at some point to make a product, hopefully a good product that will sell.
Anyway, if all that extra content were not ready for prime time now but close enough that it could be used later, there's nothing stopping Square from adding another game to the FF13 trilogy. After all, Douglas Adams didn't stop at three; why should Yoshinori Kitase?

[broodwars]

If the content was ready to go and perfect, I don't think MS would have a problem adding another disc. Unless it's in a contract somewhere that it HAD to be 3 discs.

But deadlines are a good thing. Ideas and projects are fine, but it needs to be reined in at some point to make a product, hopefully a good product that will sell.
Anyway, if all that extra content were not ready for prime time now but close enough that it could be used later, there's nothing stopping Square from adding another game to the FF13 trilogy. After all, Douglas Adams didn't stop at three; why should Yoshinori Kitase?

I wouldn't be surprised if we saw that stuff re-used in Verses 13 considering S-E's shown exactly nothing about that game in several years. Hell, maybe if XIII does dramatically better worldwide than it has done in Japan we could see a XIII-2 that uses that content.

[Suwako Moriya]

New article/interview at Kotaku that says enough FF13 content on cutting room floor to make a 2nd game.

I understand and am familiar with the fact that stuff gets cut all the time for various. Sometimes it's time constraints and other times they decide it's not such a good idea after all.

Regardless, it's hard not to wonder as to what could have been with that much content cut out. Then again, that could also be misleading. After all, this so called 2nd game might have been more like 15 hour RPG as opposed to a 50 hour one.

[ilmaestro]

The more I read about this, the more I get the impression that the main goal of this game was to streamline the experience. Or maybe that's not the right word for it. I guess I'll put it another way. I guess it's like going from boiling water to cook pasta to just nuking a frozen pasta dinner in the oven.
Think of it as removing the fat and just leaving the muscle.

[Suwako Moriya]

The more I read about this, the more I get the impression that the main goal of this game was to streamline the experience. Or maybe that's not the right word for it. I guess I'll put it another way. I guess it's like going from boiling water to cook pasta to just nuking a frozen pasta dinner in the oven.
Think of it as removing the fat and just leaving the muscle.

Heck, maybe I can pretend the areas that got removed are all the annoying areas in RPGs!

[ADC]

The more I read about this, the more I get the impression that the main goal of this game was to streamline the experience. Or maybe that's not the right word for it. I guess I'll put it another way. I guess it's like going from boiling water to cook pasta to just nuking a frozen pasta dinner in the oven.
Think of it as removing the fat and just leaving the muscle.
In its best form, it could end up like FF4, which (according to legend) includes only 25 percent of the full scenario in the final game; FF4 isn't a perfect game by any stretch of the imagination, but it is a really tight, fun play. I'd like to believe that's the way it'll go. Problem is, I still remember the horror of FF10 too clearly, which is why a lot of the FF13 speculation gives me the collywobbles.

[broodwars]

The latest episode of Gametrailers' Invisible Walls video podcast spent some time covering FF XIII with a panelist who had finished the import version. Something I've missed in previous discussions of the battle system: as we know, you have no direct control over your other 2 party members. However, just like in Persona 3 if your party leader (who you have direct control over) goes down in a fight, you instantly lose and allegedly the AI for healer characters is kind of spotty. Eh, I know that failure in this game doesn't carry a major penalty, but that's still pretty annoying.

[Fencedude]

The latest episode of Gametrailers' Invisible Walls video podcast spent some time covering FF XIII with a panelist who had finished the import version. Something I've missed in previous discussions of the battle system: as we know, you have no direct control over your other 2 party members. However, just like in Persona 3 if your party leader (who you have direct control over) goes down in a fight, you instantly lose and allegedly the AI for healer characters is kind of spotty. Eh, I know that failure in this game doesn't carry a major penalty, but that's still pretty annoying.

MARIN FUCKING KARIN

;_;

Death is a hunter unbenownst to its prey...

[broodwars]

The latest episode of Gametrailers' Invisible Walls video podcast spent some time covering FF XIII with a panelist who had finished the import version. Something I've missed in previous discussions of the battle system: as we know, you have no direct control over your other 2 party members. However, just like in Persona 3 if your party leader (who you have direct control over) goes down in a fight, you instantly lose and allegedly the AI for healer characters is kind of spotty. Eh, I know that failure in this game doesn't carry a major penalty, but that's still pretty annoying.

MARIN FUCKING KARIN

;_;

Death is a hunter unbenownst to its prey...

I think that Bad Breath just became about 100 times more deadly, and that's saying something.

[Fencedude]

I think that Bad Breath just became about 100 times more deadly, and that's saying something.

Well, at least it makes the decision of who gets the Ribbon pretty simple.

[DeadlyMessiah]

The latest episode of Gametrailers' Invisible Walls video podcast spent some time covering FF XIII with a panelist who had finished the import version. Something I've missed in previous discussions of the battle system: as we know, you have no direct control over your other 2 party members. However, just like in Persona 3 if your party leader (who you have direct control over) goes down in a fight, you instantly lose and allegedly the AI for healer characters is kind of spotty. Eh, I know that failure in this game doesn't carry a major penalty, but that's still pretty annoying.

Are you friggin kidding me? I hate it when games do that, as they are just doing it to try to make it difficult instead of actually making it difficult. That kind of ruins the game for me now.

[broodwars]

The latest episode of Gametrailers' Invisible Walls video podcast spent some time covering FF XIII with a panelist who had finished the import version. Something I've missed in previous discussions of the battle system: as we know, you have no direct control over your other 2 party members. However, just like in Persona 3 if your party leader (who you have direct control over) goes down in a fight, you instantly lose and allegedly the AI for healer characters is kind of spotty. Eh, I know that failure in this game doesn't carry a major penalty, but that's still pretty annoying.

Are you friggin kidding me? I hate it when games do that, as they are just doing it to try to make it difficult instead of actually making it difficult. That kind of ruins the game for me now.

Yeah, it's annoying but in all fairness your only penalty when this happens is having the start the fight over again. It's not like in Persona 3 where the game just snaps its finger and erases 2 hours of progress with a Mudo spell.

My guess is that this came about because they weren't sure what to do when the party leader goes down, and weren't willing to program a function to allow you to still give Paradigm Shift commands to your teammates to make them Healers and allow them to revive the party leader. Or you could be right and they basically said "well, Atlus got away with it and those games were rather popular, so I guess it's ok if we do it too."

[broodwars]

http://www.destructoid.com/kitase-confirms-final-fantasy-xiii-dlc-161766.phtml

We're going to be seeing DLC for Final Fantasy XIII sometime in the future after its Western release in March. No big surprise there, considering how it's been a growing influence in games for years, but I wonder what it could be. Maybe some of that content cut from the game that we discussed earlier? The quote makes it sound like it was new content they were thinking of developing for the Western release, but decided not to in favor of a quicker release.

[Senku]

So... not that it's hard to find, but I don't think the US website has been plugged yet, so...

Square Enix's US FFXIII Site (http://www.finalfantasyxiii.com/)

I'm particularly fond of Vanille's pose on her Eidolon, Hecatoncheir. (uh, how do you pronounce that? :sweat: )

[Fencedude]

So... not that it's hard to find, but I don't think the US website has been plugged yet, so...

Square Enix's US FFXIII Site (http://www.finalfantasyxiii.com/)

I'm particularly fond of Vanille's pose on her Eidolon, Hecatoncheir. (uh, how do you pronounce that? :sweat: )

Vanille is definitely the hottest of the girls.

[ADC]

I'm particularly fond of Vanille's pose on her Eidolon, Hecatoncheir. (uh, how do you pronounce that? :sweat: )
I believe it's "Hecka-ton-care." And yeah, Vanille's a cutie.

[Senku]

So, one month to go till release...

We're not getting an LE, are we?

[Betenoire]

So, one month to go till release...

We're not getting an LE, are we?

Not that I was asked when I reserved the title...though there is one for the guide. :sd:

[Fencedude]

So, one month to go till release...

We're not getting an LE, are we?

Just the LE strategy guide it seems.

Preordered both today.

[Suwako Moriya]

We're not getting an LE, are we?Not that I was asked when I reserved the title...though there is one for the guide. :sd:

So let me get this straight. The game is not worthy of an LE, but the guide is.... Words fail me...

Not that I've been that much into guides. Seriously, be it the LE or even just the RE version, you could in theory get a lower priced game with that money.

Speaking of which due to my conflicting feelings in regards to FF13 based on what I heard about it, I'm actually leaning towards the following idea. Waiting for it to go down in price and maybe get it later.

[broodwars]

We're not getting an LE, are we?Not that I was asked when I reserved the title...though there is one for the guide. :sd:

So let me get this straight. The game is not worthy of an LE, but the guide is.... Words fail me...

Actually, considering the EU is getting an LE for FF XIII IIRC it's more like "Americans are not worthy of an FF XIII LE, but their guide is." -_-'

Meh, I'll get the guide if it has good artwork. As for the game, I'll probably get it at launch but I'm waiting on the fence till about a week or so before launch to see which retailer blinks first and offers it at the best deal. Right now, the best deal seems to be Amazon, and that's only because they're offering $10 off on my next game and I'll probably want to pick up Heavy Rain/Star Ocean 4 PS3.

[tadakichi]

Title kind of says it all (http://www.nba.com/allstar/2010/celebrity.game/index.html) (via Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/5469087/final-fantasy-xiii-gets-title-sponsorship-of-nba-all+star-event)). Do note it's the celebrity All-Star game, not the one with actual NBA players.

The Kotaku post and comments are skeptical of the wisdom of this, and so was I at first, but I think Square Enix might be on to something. It's true that Final Fantasy is one of the best-known series in gaming, but I don't think it's quite broken into the gaming mainstream in the west yet. From everything I've read about it, FFXIII seems like the most mainstream-friendly Final Fantasy to date. It makes sense for SE to advertise it to a mainstream audience more than they did for the past few games. If it were a big-budget sci-fi movie, would anyone be surprised to see its name on a sporting event?

[Ryos]

Title kind of says it all (http://www.nba.com/allstar/2010/celebrity.game/index.html) (via Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/5469087/final-fantasy-xiii-gets-title-sponsorship-of-nba-all+star-event)). Do note it's the celebrity All-Star game, not the one with actual NBA players.

The Kotaku post and comments are skeptical of the wisdom of this, and so was I at first, but I think Square Enix might be on to something. It's true that Final Fantasy is one of the best-known series in gaming, but I don't think it's quite broken into the gaming mainstream in the west yet. From everything I've read about it, FFXIII seems like the most mainstream-friendly Final Fantasy to date. It makes sense for SE to advertise it to a mainstream audience more than they did for the past few games. If it were a big-budget sci-fi movie, would anyone be surprised to see its name on a sporting event?

Worst.marketing.attempt.ever. Seriously, they might as well have bought an ad at the Super Bowl.

[Senku]

Actually, considering the EU is getting an LE for FF XIII IIRC it's more like "Americans are not worthy of an FF XIII LE, but their guide is." -_-'

This might be a dumb question, but does the 360 have an LE in the EU also?


I went ahead and preordered both the game and the Deluxe Edition guide at Amazon. I bet something will happen, now that I've made an order :sweat:

[SetisDagre]

Worst.marketing.attempt.ever. Seriously, they might as well have bought an ad at the Superbowl.

Super Bowl was at least the most watched TV event ever.

[broodwars]

Actually, considering the EU is getting an LE for FF XIII IIRC it's more like "Americans are not worthy of an FF XIII LE, but their guide is." -_-'

This might be a dumb question, but does the 360 have an LE in the EU also?

I ran a search for it online, and apparently it does. I don't know where, though.

[Fencedude]

Via Kotaku:

PS3 and 360 Comparison shots (http://kotaku.com/5470957/new-final-fantasy-xiii-screens-let-you-compare-xbox-360-ps3)

Well, supposedly at least.

[broodwars]

Hmm. Looks totally identical to me. I'm not sure whether that's a good or bad thing, given the PS3's technical firepower. -_-'

[Kaikou]

Hmm. Looks totally identical to me. I'm not sure whether that's a good or bad thing, given the PS3's technical firepower. -_-'

The screenshots are identical and looks as if the only difference is the button overlays. I highly doubt both versions will be exactly identical when proper screenshots are taken.

[Randall]

Hmm. Looks totally identical to me. I'm not sure whether that's a good or bad thing, given the PS3's technical firepower. -_-'

Yeah because like Uncharted 2 now that's a way of using the PS3's technical firepower. But of course for me it wouldn't matter since all I care is if the game is good, story is good, and it being available on PS3.

[broodwars]

Hmm. Looks totally identical to me. I'm not sure whether that's a good or bad thing, given the PS3's technical firepower. -_-'

Yeah because like Uncharted 2 now that's a way of using the PS3's technical firepower. But of course for me it wouldn't matter since all I care is if the game is good, story is good, and it being available on PS3.

I know, and I'll enjoy the game on my PS3 just the same. It's just a little disheartening that after all these years in development as a PS3 title, they created a game that can apparently be replicated perfectly on the 360. Well, props to their much-lauded porting engine, I suppose.

Incidentally, I wonder how much Microsoft is apparently paying Square-Enix for the marketing of this game. I was watching the incredibly dull All Star Rookie-Sophomore game last night, and during the commercial break there was a commercial for FF XIII. Not a single mention of it being available for the PS3, just 360 propaganda. -_-'

[Fencedude]

I know, and I'll enjoy the game on my PS3 just the same. It's just a little disheartening that after all these years in development as a PS3 title, they created a game that can apparently be replicated perfectly on the 360. Well, props to their much-lauded porting engine, I suppose.

Incidentally, I wonder how much Microsoft is apparently paying Square-Enix for the marketing of this game. I was watching the incredibly dull All Star Rookie-Sophomore game last night, and during the commercial break there was a commercial for FF XIII. Not a single mention of it being available for the PS3, just 360 propaganda. -_-'

Yeah, but those really don't seem to be actual comparisons. It looks like htey took the same screenshots and layed the different button commands on them.

[Fencedude]

Update! (http://kotaku.com/5471186/square-enix-probing-altered-ffxiii-comparison-shots)

I find this very amusing.

[broodwars]

Update! (http://kotaku.com/5471186/square-enix-probing-altered-ffxiii-comparison-shots)

I find this very amusing.

Interesting. I wonder why Square-Enix doesn't just shut everyone up and release their own comparison screenshots. It's not like it would be particularly hard for them.

[Betenoire]

Update! (http://kotaku.com/5471186/square-enix-probing-altered-ffxiii-comparison-shots)

I find this very amusing.

*snicker*

Wow, some one seems desperate to sooth their choice of systems to fake that.

[Merr]

Update! (http://kotaku.com/5471186/square-enix-probing-altered-ffxiii-comparison-shots)

I find this very amusing.

*snicker*

Wow, some one seems desperate to sooth their choice of systems to fake that.

It wasn't faked. Those were screen shots produced by Squenix themselves. Now they're trying to backpedal by acting like some intern put them in the press kit by mistake or something.

[broodwars]

Update! (http://kotaku.com/5471186/square-enix-probing-altered-ffxiii-comparison-shots)

I find this very amusing.

*snicker*

Wow, some one seems desperate to sooth their choice of systems to fake that.

It wasn't faked. Those were screen shots produced by Squenix themselves. Now they're trying to backpedal by acting like some intern put them in the press kit by mistake or something.

I doubt it. I should have spotted it before because it's so obvious, but all those screenshots are exactly alike aside from control overlays. Now, for screenshots of in-game cutscenes or just running around the field that's fine because those are fairly easy to duplicate. However, there are battle screenshots as well in there, and those would be very difficult to duplicate the exact same moment with the exact same camera angles and everything.

[Fencedude]

I doubt it. I should have spotted it before because it's so obvious, but all those screenshots are exactly alike aside from control overlays. Now, for screenshots of in-game cutscenes or just running around the field that's fine because those are fairly easy to duplicate. However, there are battle screenshots as well in there, and those would be very difficult to duplicate the exact same moment with the exact same camera angles and everything.

...thats been our point from the beginning.

[HitokiriShadow]

I doubt it. I should have spotted it before because it's so obvious, but all those screenshots are exactly alike aside from control overlays. Now, for screenshots of in-game cutscenes or just running around the field that's fine because those are fairly easy to duplicate. However, there are battle screenshots as well in there, and those would be very difficult to duplicate the exact same moment with the exact same camera angles and everything.

Even just running around in the field would be extremely difficult to duplicate as exactly as they did in those shots. Some things in the screenshot would be slightly different, like the character's animation or the screen being centered slightly differently. They might be able to get the exact same shot of a cutscene if they obtained it by setting a program to take save the picture at a precise time, but if a human was just pausing and clicking save, even that would be very hard to get exactly identical pictures of.

[ADC]

I don't think it makes the slightest bit of difference. If it looks exactly the same across both platforms, that's almost certainly the best result. If the PS3 version looks better, it'll be said that it's because of limitations in the 360 spec (whether it's the added compression required for DVD release or the heretofore unseen extra power of the Cell chip or whatever the fuck). If the 360 version looks better, it'll be a vast conspiracy noting Microsoft's $41 billion bank account and the not-so-distant financial issues Square survived. However it turns out, somebody's bound to claim it's unholy and that one group of gamers got fucked in an uncomfortable place.

[broodwars]

Well, as I noted before I'm rather annoyed that Microsoft seems to have paid off Square-Enix for the entire marketing of this game. I've yet to see a TV ad that mentions the game is even on the PS3. It would really annoy me if this game sold 2-3 times as well on the 360 because Microsoft paid off Square-Enix to get the game and then make sure the general public didn't know the game was on a competing platform.

[Suwako Moriya]

I don't think it makes the slightest bit of difference.

I figure it this way,so long as the PS3 versions graphics are good enough that I can tell what I'm doing then I'll live regardless of how it compares to the Xbox360 version.

Besides not like I'm going to bother getting the game right away. I'm still leaning towards waiting for a price drop. I can't see much reason to rush out and get it.

[Senku]

It would really annoy me if this game sold 2-3 times as well on the 360 because Microsoft paid off Square-Enix to get the game and then make sure the general public didn't know the game was on a competing platform.

That would be the Worst outcome, as PS3 owners will never see anymore ports of JRPGs that get released on the 360. (I'm hoping for the complete opposite of that situation myself)


Changing gears a bit...

Watched the promo with Leona Lewis. I was quite surprised how pretty a girl she was, as before the only picture I've seen of her was the cover of the album that "My Hands" is on, which she looked just ghastly.

She also had the right idea going, using the all-female party :)

[Randall]

It would really annoy me if this game sold 2-3 times as well on the 360 because Microsoft paid off Square-Enix to get the game and then make sure the general public didn't know the game was on a competing platform.

That would be the Worst outcome, as PS3 owners will never see anymore ports of JRPGs that get released on the 360. (I'm hoping for the complete opposite of that situation myself)

Well I have no doubt that the PS3 version will outsell the 360 version. PS3 owners are more into RPGs, fighting, action, and other games like that in Japan and America. Xbox 360 basically only has a strong selling of just shooters, online compatible games, and maybe racing in both Japan and America. All of this money Microsoft is putting into FFXIII in America and Europe is going to be wasted. JRPGs just don't sell on the 360 console and only just gets like a handful of people.

[Merr]

I doubt it. I should have spotted it before because it's so obvious, but all those screenshots are exactly alike aside from control overlays. Now, for screenshots of in-game cutscenes or just running around the field that's fine because those are fairly easy to duplicate. However, there are battle screenshots as well in there, and those would be very difficult to duplicate the exact same moment with the exact same camera angles and everything.

...thats been our point from the beginning.

Exactly. Squenix just photoshopped 360 buttons into the PS3 pics. They've even made an apologetic press release about it.

http://kotaku.com/5471186/square-enix-probing-altered-ffxiii-comparison-shots-%5Bupdate%5D

[mike.motaku]

Regardless of any pre-release whoo-haa, I just preordered my copy yesterday after swearing last year that the nearly 15 year stranglehold FF-anything has had on my life would be over. The Powers That Be are stronger than I ever thought possible.

[Ryos]

Well I have no doubt that the PS3 version will outsell the 360 version. PS3 owners are more into RPGs, fighting, action, and other games like that in Japan and America. Xbox 360 basically only has a strong selling of just shooters, online compatible games, and maybe racing in both Japan and America. All of this money Microsoft is putting into FFXIII in America and Europe is going to be wasted. JRPGs just don't sell on the 360 console and only just gets like a handful of people.

I'm sure it will worldwide, but here the 360 has a higher installed base and consequently will likely outsell regardless of which version may be better. It also helps that MS is doing a console bundle for that while the PS3's special is limited to bundling the guide. I'm not sure why Sony isn't pushing the game more, but MS certainly realizes what they have at their disposal. Even if the commercial was terrible. :P

Edit: although I guess with as much money as MS pushed at Square to break their early exclusivity, they have an extra incentive to do well here.

[Betenoire]

I'm sure it will worldwide, but here the 360 has a higher installed base and consequently will likely outsell regardless of which version may be better.

A wild card may be that the relative smaller supply of RPG on the 360 is in part due to their fanbase preferring other types of games and may not give it a shot where as the PS3 fanbase may support in a higher percentage (though since I don't have numbers this is just a hypothetical).

[Randall]

Well I have no doubt that the PS3 version will outsell the 360 version. PS3 owners are more into RPGs, fighting, action, and other games like that in Japan and America. Xbox 360 basically only has a strong selling of just shooters, online compatible games, and maybe racing in both Japan and America. All of this money Microsoft is putting into FFXIII in America and Europe is going to be wasted. JRPGs just don't sell on the 360 console and only just gets like a handful of people.

I'm sure it will worldwide, but here the 360 has a higher installed base and consequently will likely outsell regardless of which version may be better. It also helps that MS is doing a console bundle for that while the PS3's special is limited to bundling the guide. I'm not sure why Sony isn't pushing the game more, but MS certainly realizes what they have at their disposal. Even if the commercial was terrible. :P

Edit: although I guess with as much money as MS pushed at Square to break their early exclusivity, they have an extra incentive to do well here.

Well Japan did have that special edition Lightning PS3 Slim but that's probably do the fact that it's a PS3 exclusive over there. So basically it's just SCEA that needs to push it more. With all of the advertisements for FFXIII and all of the exclusive things for 360 version an average Joe may think that Square isn't even going to release the PS3 version in America anymore.

[ADC]

Well Japan did have that special edition Lightning PS3 Slim but that's probably do the fact that it's a PS3 exclusive over there. So basically it's just SCEA that needs to push it more. With all of the advertisements for FFXIII and all of the exclusive things for 360 version an average Joe may think that Square isn't even going to release the PS3 version in America anymore.
Does SCEA do any advertising anymore? I can't remember the last time I saw a commercial for anything coming out on the PS3 or PSP.

[tadakichi]

I'm sure it will worldwide, but here the 360 has a higher installed base and consequently will likely outsell regardless of which version may be better.

A wild card may be that the relative smaller supply of RPG on the 360 is in part due to their fanbase preferring other types of games and may not give it a shot where as the PS3 fanbase may support in a higher percentage (though since I don't have numbers this is just a hypothetical).

Actually, aren't 360 and PS3 pretty much even JRPG-wise, at least in North America? Looking at exclusives:

360
Blue Dragon
Lost Odyssey
Infinite Undiscovery
Tales of Vesperia
The Last Remnant

PS3
Cross Edge
Demon's Souls
Disgaea 3
Last Rebellion
Valkyria Chronicles
White Knight Chronicles

That's 6-5 in favor of the PS3. I wouldn't argue that this is evidence of equal interest on both platforms, though--more like evidence of Microsoft paying off JRPG developers in a futile attempt to gain traction in Japan.

(If you include RPGs from Western developers, 360 takes the lead due to Fable II and the Mass Effect series.)

[ADC]

If you include RPGs from Western developers, 360 takes the lead due to Fable II and the Mass Effect series. I wouldn't argue that this is evidence of equal interest on both platforms, though--more like evidence of Microsoft paying off JRPG developers in a futile attempt to gain traction in Japan.
But if you include RPGs from Western developers, it ceases to be a discussion of JRPGs. :P

[tadakichi]

If you include RPGs from Western developers, 360 takes the lead due to Fable II and the Mass Effect series. I wouldn't argue that this is evidence of equal interest on both platforms, though--more like evidence of Microsoft paying off JRPG developers in a futile attempt to gain traction in Japan.
But if you include RPGs from Western developers, it ceases to be a discussion of JRPGs. :P

Poor post composition on my part. I've changed it so the part about Western RPGs is a footnote.

[Randall]

I'm sure it will worldwide, but here the 360 has a higher installed base and consequently will likely outsell regardless of which version may be better.

A wild card may be that the relative smaller supply of RPG on the 360 is in part due to their fanbase preferring other types of games and may not give it a shot where as the PS3 fanbase may support in a higher percentage (though since I don't have numbers this is just a hypothetical).

Actually, aren't 360 and PS3 pretty much even JRPG-wise, at least in North America? Looking at exclusives:

360
Blue Dragon
Lost Odyssey
Infinite Undiscovery
Tales of Vesperia
The Last Remnant

PS3
Cross Edge
Demon's Souls
Disgaea 3
Last Rebellion
Valkyria Chronicles
White Knight Chronicles

That's 6-5 in favor of the PS3. I wouldn't argue that this is evidence of equal interest on both platforms, though--more like evidence of Microsoft paying off JRPG developers in a futile attempt to gain traction in Japan.

(If you include RPGs from Western developers, 360 takes the lead due to Fable II and the Mass Effect series.)

Mass Effect can't be counted as an exclusive because it's also on PC. Console exclusive yes but not only available choice like Fable II(which did have the 1st game on PC).

But don't forget some other PS3 exclusives like Trinity Universe, both Tears To Tiara games, Atelier Rorona, Ar tonelico III, and so on.

Cross Edge isn't really a PS3 exclusive but NIS of America has no plans to release the 360 version in America so it's only just a PS3 exclusive in America and I guess Europe too since NIS refuses to publish Xbox 360 games and their Japanese branch isn't exactally willing to develop for 360 either.

[tadakichi]

Mass Effect can't be counted as an exclusive because it's also on PC. Console exclusive yes but not only available choice like Fable II(which did have the 1st game on PC).

Well, yeah, but I meant "exclusive" in the sense of "available on one console but not the other". Otherwise I couldn't have counted The Last Remnant either.

But don't forget some other PS3 exclusives like Trinity Universe, both Tears To Tiara games, Atelier Rorona, Ar tonelico III, and so on.

All Japan-only at the moment. Rorona is coming stateside and AT3 probably will too, but I limited myself to currently available games because the discussion was about the current [J]RPG situation in North America. (EDIT: okay, Last Rebellion is still a week away. Close enough. ;))

Cross Edge isn't really a PS3 exclusive but NIS of America has no plans to release the 360 version in America so it's only just a PS3 exclusive in America and I guess Europe too since NIS refuses to publish Xbox 360 games and their Japanese branch isn't exactally willing to develop for 360 either.

Yeah, which is also why I counted Tales of Vesperia as a 360 exclusive.

[broodwars]

Well Japan did have that special edition Lightning PS3 Slim but that's probably do the fact that it's a PS3 exclusive over there. So basically it's just SCEA that needs to push it more. With all of the advertisements for FFXIII and all of the exclusive things for 360 version an average Joe may think that Square isn't even going to release the PS3 version in America anymore.
Does SCEA do any advertising anymore? I can't remember the last time I saw a commercial for anything coming out on the PS3 or PSP.

You must not have been watching the right shows, because I've seen ads for the PS3's price drop, Ratchet & Clank: A Crack in Time, Uncharted 2, and most recently MAG on TV within the past few months. It's SCEA's "It only does Everything" campaign, and it's actually fairly clever.

[Senku]

You must not have been watching the right shows, because I've seen ads for the PS3's price drop, Ratchet & Clank: A Crack in Time, Uncharted 2, and most recently MAG on TV within the past few months. It's SCEA's "It only does Everything" campaign, and it's actually fairly clever.

I have a feeling their next major ad campaign will be for GoW, and completely bypass XIII. If they decide to do a commercial for FF, it probably be just one of those trailer-types of commercials; nothing funny or clever with the actor who's doing the current commercials.

[Randall]

You must not have been watching the right shows, because I've seen ads for the PS3's price drop, Ratchet & Clank: A Crack in Time, Uncharted 2, and most recently MAG on TV within the past few months. It's SCEA's "It only does Everything" campaign, and it's actually fairly clever.

I have a feeling their next major ad campaign will be for GoW, and completely bypass XIII. If they decide to do a commercial for FF, it probably be just one of those trailer-types of commercials; nothing funny or clever with the actor who's doing the current commercials.

Sony probably might put in like one of their promo videos where they show like a montage of PS3 games and then you would just have to guess that it's FFXIII being shown.

[Senku]

Well, at least something extra is coming out, the problem being that it's a 360 system. (http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=77101)

Hey SCEA, in case you forgot, you're releasing this game!

Is there just no incentive for them to do anything?

[bleachjoj]

Well, at least something extra is coming out, the problem being that it's a 360 system. (http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=77101)

Hey SCEA, in case you forgot, you're releasing this game!

Is there just no incentive for them to do anything?

Not really they need people to know it's coming for xbox. People who are buying this already know it's coming to ps3. Also it's almost at 2million in Japan

[Fencedude]

Well, at least something extra is coming out, the problem being that it's a 360 system. (http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=77101)

Hey SCEA, in case you forgot, you're releasing this game!

Is there just no incentive for them to do anything?

Not really they need people to know it's coming for xbox. People who are buying this already know it's coming to ps3. Also it's almost at 2million in Japan

Pretty much. If you own a PS3 and are even remotely, tangentially interested in JRPGs, you probably already know about FFXIII.

The Xbox demographic are the ones more likely to be unaware, and probably represents the greatest opportunity for return on investment in terms of advertising.

We'll see how it works out though.

[broodwars]

http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=76617

Well this is curious. Apparently, Gamestop's gotten tired of waiting for Square-Enix to get their act together and start listing pre-order bonuses or limited editions, so right now their website lists a 32-page mini strategy guide pulled from samples of the official guide as a pre-order bonus.

Ehh...thanks but no thanks, GameStop. If I want the guide, I'll get the official guide and stick with Amazon's "$10 off next game purchase" offer.

[Suwako Moriya]

Well this is curious. Apparently, Gamestop's gotten tired of waiting for Square-Enix to get their act together and start listing pre-order bonuses or limited editions, so right now their website lists a 32-page mini strategy guide pulled from samples of the official guide as a pre-order bonus.

Why do I get the feeling the only purpose of that bonus is the hope that maybe Joe will be so wowed by the 32 pages, that he'll rush back to Gamestop just to buy the full version of the guide.

Heh, I guess when I think of it that way, the bonus is more of an over glorified form of advertising.

Either way the bonus is pointless for anyone that was already planning to buy the guide along with the game and for those that don't see much need to use a guide for the most part.

[Randall]

http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=76617

Well this is curious. Apparently, Gamestop's gotten tired of waiting for Square-Enix to get their act together and start listing pre-order bonuses or limited editions, so right now their website lists a 32-page mini strategy guide pulled from samples of the official guide as a pre-order bonus.

Ehh...thanks but no thanks, GameStop. If I want the guide, I'll get the official guide and stick with Amazon's "$10 off next game purchase" offer.

Yeah I think I saw that mini guide displayed in my store on Tuesday when I stopped by. I think that link is kind of funny on this part Not responsible for orders delayed due to inclement weather, incorrect address , credit card information or a mailman chocobo shortage.

[Danj]

So apparently there's going to be an official UK FFXIII launch event (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/37610/HMV-gets-FFXIII-official-launch-event?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+mcvuk%2FoXMK+%28MCV%3A+games+ industry+news%29&utm_content=Twitter) at HMV in London. Does anyone have any experience with this kind of event? Is it likely to be worth going to? If I go there, would I have any reasonable expectation of a) buying a copy of FFXIII and b) getting it signed? What time would I need to be in the queue by? Or should I just not bother and buy it from Play.com or Amazon like everyone else?

[Fencedude]

And actual Xbox 360 screens released.

And...yeah.

Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/5475017/these-are-the-xbox-360-final-fantasy-xiii-shots-you-were-looking-for)

Comparisons at Sankaku Complex (http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2010/02/19/final-fantasy-xiii-ps3-vs-xbox-360-compared-xbox-inferior/) (site so very, very not safe for work)

[broodwars]

And actual Xbox 360 screens released.

And...yeah.

Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/5475017/these-are-the-xbox-360-final-fantasy-xiii-shots-you-were-looking-for)

Comparisons at Sankaku Complex (http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2010/02/19/final-fantasy-xiii-ps3-vs-xbox-360-compared-xbox-inferior/) (site so very, very not safe for work)

Hmm...if it weren't for the missing "details" that several of the screenshots point out, I'd say the 360 screenshots were just badly compressed. If those screenshots are genuine and the visuals are that noticeable in-game (and just about every hands-on impression I've read said they noticed no differences between the two versions)...eesh.

Incidentally, I finally got around to pre-ordering the PS3 version of the game today. I figured I might as well get on with it considering we're coming up on the launch.

[Fencedude]

Hmm...if it weren't for the missing "details" that several of the screenshots point out, I'd say the 360 screenshots were just badly compressed. If those screenshots are genuine and the visuals are that noticeable in-game (and just about every hands-on impression I've read said they noticed no differences between the two versions)...eesh.

Incidentally, I finally got around to pre-ordering the PS3 version of the game today. I figured I might as well get on with it considering we're coming up on the launch.

To a great extent, this sort of thing really is only noticeable when doing a direct comparison.

Like, Bayonetta is clearly inferior on the PS3 if you look at comparison shots, but when actually playing, its much, much harder to tell, even on a really nice TV.

Not that I'm not going to take at least a little pleasure in this. Seeing the PS3 consistently getting shafted by ports was getting kinda old.

[broodwars]

To a great extent, this sort of thing really is only noticeable when doing a direct comparison.

Like, Bayonetta is clearly inferior on the PS3 if you look at comparison shots, but when actually playing, its much, much harder to tell, even on a really nice TV.

Not that I'm not going to take at least a little pleasure in this. Seeing the PS3 consistently getting shafted by ports was getting kinda old.

Indeed. I was just reading a "Lens of Truth" article earlier today comparing the two versions of Bioshock 2, and I have no idea where they found those shots of such bad graphical flaws (and I've played through the entire game twice now).

I'll definitely look forward to the "Lens of Truth" comparison between the two versions of FF XIII, though, if just to get the satisfaction of seeing the PS3 version for once crowned as the superior version. ^_-

[HitokiriShadow]

http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=76617

Well this is curious. Apparently, Gamestop's gotten tired of waiting for Square-Enix to get their act together and start listing pre-order bonuses or limited editions, so right now their website lists a 32-page mini strategy guide pulled from samples of the official guide as a pre-order bonus.

Ehh...thanks but no thanks, GameStop. If I want the guide, I'll get the official guide and stick with Amazon's "$10 off next game purchase" offer.

Oh goodie, a preview of something I'll be buying anyway. I'm so thrilled to get this instead of that LE version the UK got! :/

I'm buying it from Gamestop only because I have store credit there I want to use up. Though the fact that I'll be able to get it a bit sooner is a nice bonus. I'm taking the day off for this, so getting it at midnight instead of late afternoon (which is when Dante's Inferno arrived with the same shipping method) will make a big difference.

[Danj]

Oh goodie, a preview of something I'll be buying anyway. I'm so thrilled to get this instead of that LE version the UK got! :/

I just found out about that today and I'm thinking I should probably just preorder that instead of going to the launch event, since it'd cost less and I'd get the extras. Cheapest price for it seems to be at Amazon UK (PS3 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0035JKUDA/), 360 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0035JKUF8/)), by the way, for anyone who's looking to get it.

[Kaikou]

And actual Xbox 360 screens released.

And...yeah.

Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/5475017/these-are-the-xbox-360-final-fantasy-xiii-shots-you-were-looking-for)

Comparisons at Sankaku Complex (http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2010/02/19/final-fantasy-xiii-ps3-vs-xbox-360-compared-xbox-inferior/) (site so very, very not safe for work)

It's good to see that not only did PS3 win out on visuals, but also that S-E didn't downgrade the US PS3 version to match the 360 version.

[Senku]

Not that I'm not going to take at least a little pleasure in this. Seeing the PS3 consistently getting shafted by ports was getting kinda old.


I'll definitely look forward to the "Lens of Truth" comparison between the two versions of FF XIII, though, if just to get the satisfaction of seeing the PS3 version for once crowned as the superior version. ^_-

Can we start holding developers to a higher standard? That there is NO REASON for their game to look just as good, or better, then the 360 counterpart? Can we start blaming them for being too lazy? FF should not be some "special exception", or that S-E is the ONLY company that can utilize the PS3. (in terms of cross-platform)

The mantra of "360 is easier and better" needs to die now.

[Junker Woland]

Well, when you think about it, FFXIII on the 360 suffers the same problem as many cross-platform PS3 titles—the game wasn’t co-developed for both systems, but rather ported from a lead console.

For most high-end games, there’s always going to be differences between systems, but releases like Batman: Arkham Asylum and Dante’s Inferno prove, when a game is being created concurrently with both consoles in mind, there usually aren’t any glaring (or even really noticeable) disparities.

What developers need to stop is essentially creating console-specific games, then merely doing a crap port job and calling their title cross-platform. At this point, all the major developers should be comfortable enough with both systems to allow for true simultaneous production.

[Randall]

Well, when you think about it, FFXIII on the 360 suffers the same problem as many cross-platform PS3 titles—the game wasn’t co-developed for both systems, but rather ported from a lead console.

For most high-end games, there’s always going to be differences between systems, but releases like Batman: Arkham Asylum and Dante’s Inferno prove, when a game is being created concurrently with both consoles in mind, there usually aren’t any glaring (or even really noticeable) disparities.

What developers need to stop is essentially creating console-specific games, then merely doing a crap port job and calling their title cross-platform. At this point, all the major developers should be comfortable enough with both systems to allow for true simultaneous production.

Well it's just like those games you can find any possible platform available like sports games. Most of those are just ports and then all they do is just adjust the settings from like resolution, button commands, online gameplay, and so on to meet the required needs for each console.

They just like to make quick jobs of their games instead of putting out the effort even on best selling games which results in some games looking pathetic on some consoles and then some consoles the game will look how it should. Just like with Bayonetta it was basically made for 360 but then was ported to PS3 and so PS3 version wasn't as good as the 360 version and then it even needed an update to give you the option on installing the game or not so that the load times weren't so bad from it's lazy port.

[Talyn]

Some studios/companies prefer to make the PS3 version because they building game for the higher architecture and specs...it's easier to go backwards than to go forward. This is why Ninja Gaiden Sigma and Bio-Shock took so long to come over to the PS3... there's a lot more work and time involved in going from 360 to PS3 than going from PS3 to 360... If I had an article to attach I would but this has always been my understanding of ports... :sweat:

[Legion]

And actual Xbox 360 screens released.

And...yeah.

Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/5475017/these-are-the-xbox-360-final-fantasy-xiii-shots-you-were-looking-for)

The comments on that page are pretty funny. Lots of "who cares about small differences" comments, and how much you wanna bet these were the same people that gloated over the differences in games like Bayonetta or Ghostbusters.

[Kaikou]

NowGamer got in a final retail code copy of FFXIII for Xbox 360 and the impressions are less than encouraging for those who have to buy the 360 version.

http://www.nowgamer.com/news/2526/ffxiii-significantly-poorer-on-xbox

[ADC]

NowGamer got in a final retail code copy of FFXIII for Xbox 360 and the impressions are less than encouraging for those who have to buy the 360 version.
http://www.nowgamer.com/news/2526/ffxiii-significantly-poorer-on-xbox
It's hardly a surprise. Everybody had to know that the storage issue would come into play (three DVD9s versus one BD50), and that FMV and textures would be the first things compressed or shrunk. Still, look at the bright side: I have a PS3! ;)

[Fencedude]

NowGamer got in a final retail code copy of FFXIII for Xbox 360 and the impressions are less than encouraging for those who have to buy the 360 version.
http://www.nowgamer.com/news/2526/ffxiii-significantly-poorer-on-xbox
It's hardly a surprise. Everybody had to know that the storage issue would come into play (three DVD9s versus one BD50), and that FMV and textures would be the first things compressed or shrunk. Still, look at the bright side: I have a PS3! ;)

*reads the comments*

I expect many huffy protestations of "Well who NEEDS FFXIII when we have ME2!?"

[Kaikou]

NowGamer got in a final retail code copy of FFXIII for Xbox 360 and the impressions are less than encouraging for those who have to buy the 360 version.
http://www.nowgamer.com/news/2526/ffxiii-significantly-poorer-on-xbox
It's hardly a surprise. Everybody had to know that the storage issue would come into play (three DVD9s versus one BD50), and that FMV and textures would be the first things compressed or shrunk. Still, look at the bright side: I have a PS3! ;)

Initially all that was known to be downgraded was the CG scenes, but I have to agree on the textures being an obvious potential difference once they announced that it would be on three DVD-9's.

The PS3 was always my choice regardless. I know some people who were going to buy the 360 version due to being "achievement hoars", but I imagine they might have to rethink that choice. Achievement points or better visuals, sad thing is I bet a lot will pick achievement points...:relief:

[Betenoire]

Achievement points or better visuals, sad thing is I bet a lot will pick achievement points...:relief:

And I am sure glad I am not in the achievement points boat. :sd:

[Suwako Moriya]

The PS3 was always my choice regardless.

Heh, for me having a PS3 and no plans to ever get an Xbox360, it sort of makes the choice rather easy. Well, when the game goes down in price of course. In any case, I can't say I'm surprised by all the not-shocking revelations about the Xbox360 version being a downgrade in terms of visuals.

[Legion]

NowGamer got in a final retail code copy of FFXIII for Xbox 360 and the impressions are less than encouraging for those who have to buy the 360 version.
http://www.nowgamer.com/news/2526/ffxiii-significantly-poorer-on-xbox
It's hardly a surprise. Everybody had to know that the storage issue would come into play (three DVD9s versus one BD50), and that FMV and textures would be the first things compressed or shrunk. Still, look at the bright side: I have a PS3! ;)

*reads the comments*

I expect many huffy protestations of "Well who NEEDS FFXIII when we have ME2!?"

That reminds me of what I thought when I first heard FF XIII was coming to the 360. Is there really a significant percentage of dedicated 360 users outside of Japan who actively want Final Fantasy?

[Legion]

The PS3 was always my choice regardless. I know some people who were going to buy the 360 version due to being "achievement hoars", but I imagine they might have to rethink that choice. Achievement points or better visuals, sad thing is I bet a lot will pick achievement points...:relief:

They could try being "trophy hoars". At least they still get to be a hoar. :P

[Ryos]

Just taking a look at ye olde Gamestop flyer, it looks like preorders of the FFXIII bundle come with a faceplate. Damn it, SCEA, you've let me down. :(

[Senku]

To further prove that SCEA has no idea XIII is being released on their system, unless they add it sometime during the weekend, the latest PSN store update has no demo for the game.

Not that it's a huge deal, and it might come out after the fact (like they do for their bigger titles ie Uncharted 2); I'm just surprised that SCEA has thrown Zero bones to the NA audience. And every commercial has 360 plastered all over it.

OK, I promise to stop whining now.

*goes to load up JP Demo*

[broodwars]

To further prove that SCEA has no idea XIII is being released on their system, unless they add it sometime during the weekend, the latest PSN store update has no demo for the game.

Not that it's a huge deal, and it might come out after the fact (like they do for their bigger titles ie Uncharted 2); I'm just surprised that SCEA has thrown Zero bones to the NA audience. And every commercial has 360 plastered all over it.

OK, I promise to stop whining now.

*goes to load up JP Demo*

OK, the complete lack of PS3 marketing for this title is all on Sony, but we can't blame them for the lack of a FF XIII demo. Lord knows that the media and fans have been hounding Square-Enix for a demo since long before the game launched in Japan. It's Square-Enix that's arrogant enough to apparently decide we're not important enough to localize a demo for.

Wait, there's a demo in Japan that's not just on the Advent Children Blu-Ray? When did that happen?

[Suwako Moriya]

Not that I pay much attention to PS3 demos in general, but I would have figured a demo for US version of FF13 would have been up by now.:sweat:

[ADC]

I think Square chose not to put up a demo for FF13/ps3. Remember, FF8 and FF12 got demos distributed with other games, and those games are among the weakest in the series. They probably didn't want to jinx the new one.

[broodwars]

I think Square chose not to put up a demo for FF13/ps3. Remember, FF8 and FF12 got demos distributed with other games, and those games are among the weakest in the series. They probably didn't want to jinx the new one.

It's also worth pointing out that Square-Enix got a lot of backlash from the apparently horrid demo they put out for FF XII, and from what I've heard of the Japanese demo of FF XIII it's not that good either (too early in the game, before you obtain the game mechanics that make the battle system interesting). They probably didn't think it was worth the effort, which is annoying but then again we only have to wait until Monday night for the real deal.

[Kaikou]

I think Square chose not to put up a demo for FF13/ps3. Remember, FF8 and FF12 got demos distributed with other games, and those games are among the weakest in the series. They probably didn't want to jinx the new one.

VII was released with Tobal No. 1 as well.

[ADC]

I think Square chose not to put up a demo for FF13/ps3. Remember, FF8 and FF12 got demos distributed with other games, and those games are among the weakest in the series. They probably didn't want to jinx the new one.
VII was released with Tobal No. 1 as well.
Every rule has its exception. :sweat: Of course, I could have said, "Tobal No. What?" and you'd have been all, "Yeah, that's true."

[Kaikou]

Wait, there's a demo in Japan that's not just on the Advent Children Blu-Ray? When did that happen?

Only demo released was the one included with the special edition of Advent Children.

[Senku]

Wait, there's a demo in Japan that's not just on the Advent Children Blu-Ray? When did that happen?

Only demo released was the one included with the special edition of Advent Children.

Yeah, sorry if I wasn't clear. That's the copy I have.

Just finished it again, and I think it's an alright demo. Loving the battle music (if that's what they stuck with); the juggling was hard to time with the AI, but I suspect it gets easier with later battle mechanics.

One thing to definitely remember is to not waste attacks. If you queue 3 attacks, when only 1 will kill the enemy, the only 2 will be wasted on thin air. (instead of moving on to the next target)

[Randall]

I don't think Square ever even had plans of a demo of FFXIII in America. Probably too focused on making the 360 version and all of the other bonuses the 360 version gets. Honestly I think it's not about SCEA just ignoring the game it's just Square just doesn't have much interest in supporting the PS3 version and is only just releasing it so that Ps3 owners won't get upset. Square pretty much only wants their 360 version to sell there is no question about that. I'm going to do my part in supporting the PS3 version.

[broodwars]

I don't think Square ever even had plans of a demo of FFXIII in America. Probably too focused on making the 360 version and all of the other bonuses the 360 version gets. Honestly I think it's not about SCEA just ignoring the game it's just Square just doesn't have much interest in supporting the PS3 version and is only just releasing it so that Ps3 owners won't get upset. Square pretty much only wants their 360 version to sell there is no question about that. I'm going to do my part in supporting the PS3 version.

Yeah, that completely makes sense considering all the additional resources, time, and manpower it took to make a 360 version just for the West. They're just placating their hapless PS3 owners while chasing after their real audience of FPS-loving Halo fanboys. It all makes so much sense now, and has nothing to do with Microsoft paying them a lot of cash to steal an exclusive away from Sony.

[Junker Woland]

For those interested, EuroGamer's DigitalFoundry blog posted their PS3/360 Face-Off for FFXIII: Linku (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-final-fantasy-xiii-face-off).

Just going by their piece, despite an issue with the 360's resolution, FFXIII doesn't appear to suffer too horribly when in-game. At the very least, it doesn't seem to immediately comes across as totally janky, like the PS3 port of Bayonetta. Unfortunately, Square-Enix did a pretty half-assed job compressing the various video segments for the 360.

It'll be curious to see, once the game has been out for a bit, whether there remains any significant outcry from 360 owners over the title's deficiencies.

[SetisDagre]

Someone commented (and I agree) that most PS3 owners are already quite aware of FFXIII, so Sony doesn't need to advertise for it really that much (and Square is doing some general advertising, like the FFXIII bus that went through the Bay Area here demoing the game). They're spending more money on the 360 advertising to reach the FPS kids that likely might have never heard of the game or wouldn't normally be interested.

[Randall]

I don't think Square ever even had plans of a demo of FFXIII in America. Probably too focused on making the 360 version and all of the other bonuses the 360 version gets. Honestly I think it's not about SCEA just ignoring the game it's just Square just doesn't have much interest in supporting the PS3 version and is only just releasing it so that Ps3 owners won't get upset. Square pretty much only wants their 360 version to sell there is no question about that. I'm going to do my part in supporting the PS3 version.

Yeah, that completely makes sense considering all the additional resources, time, and manpower it took to make a 360 version just for the West. They're just placating their hapless PS3 owners while chasing after their real audience of FPS-loving Halo fanboys. It all makes so much sense now, and has nothing to do with Microsoft paying them a lot of cash to steal an exclusive away from Sony.

Well I wouldn't say that Microsoft's money has nothing to do with it because i'm sure it has some part on to why even bother making it for 360 in the 1st place when it was normally a PS3 exclusive in Japan. I'm just basically saying that the major factor is Square went out of their way to make it for 360 for outside of Japan and doesn't want to feel like it was a waste of time and money.(even if it is kind of a horrible port)

[Senku]

For those interested, EuroGamer's DigitalFoundry blog posted their PS3/360 Face-Off for FFXIII: Linku (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-final-fantasy-xiii-face-off).

Interesting read, pretty even handed. Though at parts it did sound like ammunition for Microsoft if they wanted to sue S-E over "not being equal".

I need to hook up my HD monitor and look at the comparisons again.

[Senku]

Someone commented (and I agree) that most PS3 owners are already quite aware of FFXIII, so Sony doesn't need to advertise for it really that much (and Square is doing some general advertising, like the FFXIII bus that went through the Bay Area here demoing the game). They're spending more money on the 360 advertising to reach the FPS kids that likely might have never heard of the game or wouldn't normally be interested.

But why would they get it anyway? Too be made fun of by their MW2 clan?

Preorders are still 2:1 in favor of the PS3 (yay), so I know why they are hitting the 360 crowd, and why Lakers vs. Magic this weekend is brought to you by Final Fantasy XIII.

All I ever wanted was a fancy pants PS3 version to throw money at. (but not import)

[Fencedude]

Well, like I said previously, most people who have a PS3, and are interested in FFXIII, already know about the game, probably bought their PS3 FOR this game, etc etc. While the 360 market probably has a lot more potential untapped customers.

Though I have no doubt that the PS3 version will be by far the most popular.

[Legion]

Preorders are still 2:1 in favor of the PS3 (yay)

This is for North America I presume? That's promising. I read an article recently that predicted sales for FF XIII in the UK to be 2:1 in favor of 360, which I found curious, so I've been wondering how it might play out here.

[Senku]

I read an article recently that predicted sales for FF XIII in the UK to be 2:1 in favor of 360, which I found curious, so I've been wondering how it might play out here.

That does sound a bit odd, especially since the UK is getting an LE for PS3.

[broodwars]

Well, we have our first online review from a major publication, as 1up has given FF XIII an A-. You can read the review here: http://www.1up.com/do/reviewPage?cId=3178230

I also highly recommend the most recent Active Time Babble podcast, which covered FF XIII spoiler-free for most of the 2 hr. 6 min. podcast. You can find that podcast here: http://www.1up.com/do/minisite?cId=3176689

[Fencedude]

*listens*

Whoo hoo! Xenosaga arguments! Always highly entertaining.

I think this is the guy who said FFXII was his favorite FF. Fuck him.

[DiGiKerot]

*listens*

Whoo hoo! Xenosaga arguments! Always highly entertaining.

I'm a humongous Xenosaga fanboy, but I thought that was a pretty good episode of ATB.

I think this is the guy who said FFXII was his favorite FF. Fuck him.

My impression is that Parish tends to be far more interested in RPGs mechanically than he is in characters and story - he really digs on exploration and dungeon crawling and brutal difficulty (basically, Etrian Odyssey) and unusual game systems. License board aside, there was a lot in FFXII that appeals directly to his taste in games (he's also been writing about FFVIII on his personal blog recently). So whilst he's generally a smart guy who knows what he's talking about, his taste in RPGs is pretty much the opposite of what tends to go down well in these particular forums.

[Fencedude]

*listens*

Whoo hoo! Xenosaga arguments! Always highly entertaining.

I'm a humongous Xenosaga fanboy, but I thought that was a pretty good episode of ATB.

I haven't had a chance to listen to the entire thing, I had to leave for work, but I was pretty amused that it immediately turned into that


My impression is that Parish tends to be far more interested in RPGs mechanically than he is in characters and story - he really digs on exploration and dungeon crawling and brutal difficulty (basically, Etrian Odyssey) and unusual game systems. License board aside, there was a lot in FFXII that appeals directly to his taste in games (he's also been writing about FFVIII on his personal blog recently). So whilst he's generally a smart guy who knows what he's talking about, his taste in RPGs is pretty much the opposite of what tends to go down well in these particular forums.

All teasing aside, what little I've heard from him (the FFXIII video review and the very beginning of this) makes me agree with that assessment. And thats a pretty admirable position to hold, though I don't really agree.

Of course, I don't like FFXII but do like FFVIII...

[Randall]

*listens*

Whoo hoo! Xenosaga arguments! Always highly entertaining.

I think this is the guy who said FFXII was his favorite FF. Fuck him.

Ugh please don't remind me of FFXII again. Such a letdown of a game and I even paid extra to get the collector's edition 2-disc steelbook version too as soon as it came out with my employee discount. It's probably somewhere in my room collecting dust.

[ADC]

Wired gave it a 6 out of 10 (http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2010/03/final-fantasy-xiii-review/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wired%2Findex+(Wired%3A+Index +3+(Top+Stories+2))) and mentioned a whole lot of the things I was dreading about the game: Very linear, very little exploration, very little to actually do except fight monsters. As this "Chris Kohler" guy was basing his attitudes on the JP game, he does not mention much about the story, so all may not be lost.

[Senku]

Wired gave it a 6 out of 10 (http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2010/03/final-fantasy-xiii-review/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wired%2Findex+(Wired%3A+Index +3+(Top+Stories+2))) and mentioned a whole lot of the things I was dreading about the game: Very linear, very little exploration, very little to actually do except fight monsters. As this "Chris Kohler" guy was basing his attitudes on the JP game, he does not mention much about the story, so all may not be lost.

Eh, "Chris" sounded like he didn't even try to like it. Too much "this is the way RPGs are supposed to be" kind of attitude.

[Fencedude]

Eh, "Chris" sounded like he didn't even try to like it. Too much "this is the way RPGs are supposed to be" kind of attitude.

Yeah, there has been a lot of people commenting that its not "how RPGs are supposed to be".

My opinion on that? So fucking what?

[Gatts]

For those interested, EuroGamer's DigitalFoundry blog posted their PS3/360 Face-Off for FFXIII: Linku (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-final-fantasy-xiii-face-off).

Hmm, the result of a lazy port? Not very surprising.

[Betenoire]

Well, like I said previously, most people who have a PS3, and are interested in FFXIII, already know about the game, probably bought their PS3 FOR this game, etc etc.

Not just for, but it was a major factor in me getting it when I did.

[Suwako Moriya]

Well, we have our first online review from a major publication, as 1up has given FF XIII an A-. You can read the review here: http://www.1up.com/do/reviewPage?cId=3178230

So the impression I get from all that is so long as you can accept the fact that FF13 is focused on specific aspects, it's possible to enjoy the game. It does sound like the battle system has potential and that's a curious way to handle job classes.

[broodwars]

Eh, "Chris" sounded like he didn't even try to like it. Too much "this is the way RPGs are supposed to be" kind of attitude.

Yeah, there has been a lot of people commenting that its not "how RPGs are supposed to be".

My opinion on that? So fucking what?

What's interesting is those same people also seem to be fond of complaining that the JRPG is stale and old because it "never changes" and is "predictable". -_-'

I've said before that I have reservations about some of the core series changes Square-Enix made for FF XIII, but on the other hand many of my concerns (the lack of towns, especially) are just things Square-Enix has never done particularly well (outside of maybe Star Ocean: the Last Hope) so we might just be better off without them. You really have to go into this game with an open mind, just like its spiritual predecessor FF X.

[broodwars]

It's time for some dueling video reviews, as both Gamespot (http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/rpg/finalfantasy13/review.html) and Gametrailers (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/review-hd-final-fantasy/62720) have also posted reviews of the game. Both gave the game about the same score, 8.5 and 8.6 respectively.

Now, you can watch the video incarnation for Gamespot's review, but especially after watching Gametrailers' usual excellence it's truly amateur hour by comparison and utterly boring (when the reviewer isn't vaguely gushing, he's just summarizing game features).

[Fencedude]

Now, you can watch the video incarnation for Gamespot's review, but especially after watching Gametrailers' usual excellence it's truly amateur hour by comparison and utterly boring (when the reviewer isn't vaguely gushing, he's just summarizing game features).

I may watch the GT review, but I refuse to acknowledge Gamespot's existence. Which is no mean feat, considering that I always have a GameFAQs tab open.

[ADC]

Now, you can watch the video incarnation for Gamespot's review, but especially after watching Gametrailers' usual excellence it's truly amateur hour by comparison and utterly boring (when the reviewer isn't vaguely gushing, he's just summarizing game features).
I may watch the GT review, but I refuse to acknowledge Gamespot's existence. Which is no mean feat, considering that I always have a GameFAQs tab open.
Word. GameFAQs is still robust, but Gamespot's quality went to shit after the post-Gerstmann exodus. Might help if their editorial division weren't a puppet for the sales division.

[Suwako Moriya]

Yeah, there has been a lot of people commenting that its not "how RPGs are supposed to be".

The problem with statements like that is they're often too restrictive. I mean things evolve and change over time. Which leads to varying types in the same genre.

Also, I've been thinking about it a bit more. FF13's focus on "moving forward", "cut scenes", and "battles" isn't as radical as some including myself have made it out to be. It's just that a lack of towns results in being more noticeable for some people.

That being said, I'm still waiting off on the game. I have more important things to focus on anyway. As well as pre-existing backlog to deal with.

[Fencedude]

Word. GameFAQs is still robust, but Gamespot's quality went to shit after the post-Gerstmann exodus. Might help if their editorial division weren't a puppet for the sales division.

Indeed. At least they should try to pretend that their reviews aren't just ad copy.

[Senku]

As this "Chris Kohler" guy was basing his attitudes on the JP game, he does not mention much about the story, so all may not be lost.

Don't know if you looked, but the 1up reviewer was pretty happy with the story.

Well, mostly the character interactions and their development as people; I think he said the story itself was pretty standard.

But a game driven by the characters, Hell Yeah!

[HitokiriShadow]

What's interesting is those same people also seem to be fond of complaining that the JRPG is stale and old because it "never changes" and is "predictable". -_-'

That's also usually code for "It needs to be more like a Western RPG".

I've said before that I have reservations about some of the core series changes Square-Enix made for FF XIII, but on the other hand many of my concerns (the lack of towns, especially) are just things Square-Enix has never done particularly well (outside of maybe Star Ocean: the Last Hope) so we might just be better off without them. You really have to go into this game with an open mind, just like its spiritual predecessor FF X.

The thing that finally made me actually look forward to this game was the battle system, so as long as it does that part well, I'll probably be happy with it. I'm not expecting it to be in my Top 5 FF games anyway, so it would be disappointing if it doesn't do so well in some aspects but not a big deal (I've never been expecting much from the game's story, if its decent it will be good enough for me). The key about the linearity thing is that, from what I've read from people that have actually finished it, is that its very linear until the end game. It should still have a optional content at the end game, which is where the vast majority (or virtually all of) the optional content in many JRPGs is anyway, so it wouldn't be anything particularly unique to FF13.

My main concern from what I've read is that the linearity of the dungeons themselves, not just the progression from dungeon to dungeon. If its what I think it will be like, it will be disappointing, but not that different from the bulk of FF10 and not a dealbreaker for me.

Also, for anyone who cares, Game Informer gave the game a 9/10 review in the January issue, which game out weeks ago. I guess they reviewed it based on the Japanese version.

[ADC]

Just for S&Gs, I jumped over to Metacritic and found out that FF9 has the highest aggregate score in the series (94); FF13's currently running at 83. Of course, Metacritic wasn't as well established back in the day, so we must take the old scores with a grain of salt — I mean, FF9 easily deserved a 96.

[Fencedude]

I mean, FF9 easily deserved a 96.

Pft.

[Betenoire]

Just for S&Gs, I jumped over to Metacritic and found out that FF9 has the highest aggregate score in the series (94); FF13's currently running at 83. Of course, Metacritic wasn't as well established back in the day, so we must take the old scores with a grain of salt — I mean, FF9 easily deserved a 96.

Sure it did...as long as we are using the NFL passer rating and 147 whatever is perfect.

[Fencedude]

Ok, finally listening to the rest of this podcast, and while its interesting, its rather emblematic of why I don't listen to many podcasts.

For one its two fucking hours long, and additionally, it reminds me of the kind of bull sessions I"ve had with my friends, but without all the fun of being able to actually debate your opinion. You have to hope that someone brings up the thing you are thinking...and they don't.

Meh.

[broodwars]

I was in my local GS today trading in my now-Platinum-ed and finished copy of Dante's Inferno (which I got $40 for, which is hilarious considering I only spent $20 to get the game), and ended up walking out with a pre-order for the nice hardbound edition of the FF XIII guide with still $10 to use on whatever strikes my fancy in the next few months (probably Fragile or Resonance of Fate). I was actually pretty surprised I could still pre-order that version of the guide considering Amazon's stopped taking orders for it. More pleasantly surprising are the numbers I got out for my GS's FF XIII pre-orders: apparently 78 for the PS3 version, 26 for the 360 version. Nice. Looks like Sony might actually have a multiplatform game that dramatically outsells the 360 version for once.

[Randall]

I was in my local GS today trading in my now-Platinum-ed and finished copy of Dante's Inferno (which I got $40 for, which is hilarious considering I only spent $20 to get the game), and ended up walking out with a pre-order for the nice hardbound edition of the FF XIII guide with still $10 to use on whatever strikes my fancy in the next few months (probably Fragile or Resonance of Fate). I was actually pretty surprised I could still pre-order that version of the guide considering Amazon's stopped taking orders for it. More pleasantly surprising are the numbers I got out for my GS's FF XIII pre-orders: apparently 78 for the PS3 version, 26 for the 360 version. Nice. Looks like Sony might actually have a multiplatform game that dramatically outsells the 360 version for once.

Gamestop has kind of a limit on collector's edition items on how many can be pre-ordered no matter if it's a game, strategy guide, or whatever. As long as it's still in their pre-order section on their computer then by all means pre-order if you want.

With the getting Dante's Inferno for $20 was it their trade in 2 select games and get Dante's Inferno for $20 kind of like how they're doing with FFXIII?

[broodwars]

With the getting Dante's Inferno for $20 was it their trade in 2 select games and get Dante's Inferno for $20 kind of like how they're doing with FFXIII?

It helps to once again be working for EA. ^_-

[Randall]

With the getting Dante's Inferno for $20 was it their trade in 2 select games and get Dante's Inferno for $20 kind of like how they're doing with FFXIII?

It helps to once again be working for EA. ^_-

Ah well as you can probably tell i've only been active on this forum recently even though i've been on here for maybe almost 2 years so don't know much about what the people do on here for a living but that's still cool though working for EA.

[Fencedude]

*checks for Midnight openings*

Blegh, the one where I preordered isn't doing it. Eh, whatever.

[Randall]

It's sad when you don't even know if your job where you reserved it at has a midnight opening for FFXIII or not. Eh I guess that's what happens when you only work once or twice a month.

[Betenoire]

*checks for Midnight openings*

Blegh, the one where I preordered isn't doing it. Eh, whatever.

Luckily mine is, though the manager was already dreading the Pokemon opening as he likes the game but not the kids that come with it. :sd:

Aside-also found out I am the only person at that store to preorder Sakura Wars. :depresses:

[HitokiriShadow]

*checks for Midnight openings*

Blegh, the one where I preordered isn't doing it. Eh, whatever.

I checked today and confirmed that mine is doing it. I just need to decide whether or not to take advantage of it, as I have something important going on Tuesday morning that I can't skip out on.

[Fencedude]

*checks for Midnight openings*

Blegh, the one where I preordered isn't doing it. Eh, whatever.

I checked today and confirmed that mine is doing it. I just need to decide whether or not to take advantage of it, as I have something important going on Tuesday morning that I can't skip out on.

It turns out that I'll have Wednesday off, so I'm fine with waiting till Tuesday.

[Randall]

*checks for Midnight openings*

Blegh, the one where I preordered isn't doing it. Eh, whatever.

Luckily mine is, though the manager was already dreading the Pokemon opening as he likes the game but not the kids that come with it. :sd:

Aside-also found out I am the only person at that store to preorder Sakura Wars. :depresses:

That's what happens with Gamestop or any store that sells video games for that matter most of the workers don't even know of Sakura Wars existence and always push people to pre-order the popular games.

[Betenoire]

If it makes anyone feel better (and I don't know why it would but) Best Buy's ad very prominently features the PS3 logo and the 360 logo is much, much smaller.

[Fencedude]

If it makes anyone feel better (and I don't know why it would but) Best Buy's ad very prominently features the PS3 logo and the 360 logo is much, much smaller.

WHOO HOO!!!!

Or something.

[ADC]

That's what happens with Gamestop or any store that sells video games for that matter most of the workers don't even know of Sakura Wars existence and always push people to pre-order the popular games.
I went into a Lamestop one night, seeking a game that Worst Buy didn't stock, and the fellow behind the counter pushed me so hard to reserve that Sakura Wars game that I was maybe five seconds away from walking out of the store. I told this character, I have zero interest in that game and you're only recommending it because I'm purchasing another NISA game (I think it was Mana Khemia 2), so you need to stop riding me. The moral of the story is, it doesn't truly matter whether they know about the niche titles, so long as they follow the Lamestop policy of crawling up every customer's ass so far that they can see what you had for breakfast.

[Betenoire]

The moral of the story is, it doesn't truly matter whether they know about the niche titles, so long as they follow the Lamestop policy of crawling up every customer's ass so far that they can see what you had for breakfast.

Hmm. The stores in my area are much more laid back about it. They mention a preorder with somethings but mostly just ask the general "would you like to preorder something" question. The guy at my favorite one doesn't even bother with me anymore as he figures if I want something I probably know as much if not more about it than him (going in and asking for the Sakura Wars preorder before they had any sort of listing or he had heard about it helps).

Sadly the *best* manager imo is in a town way to far to drive to. What makes him the best? He goes out of his way to stock more RPG's than the typical store and often has some of the harder to find ones in stock. To bad there is absolutely no other reason to go to that town for me.

The ones in my area have been helpful with transferring in things from other stores for me (Trusty Bell for the PS3 is a bitch to find in my area) and have no problems calling the other stores to confirm stock and hold items (the inventory system they have is horrible from what I have encountered).

[Randall]

That's what happens with Gamestop or any store that sells video games for that matter most of the workers don't even know of Sakura Wars existence and always push people to pre-order the popular games.

I went into a Lamestop one night, seeking a game that Worst Buy didn't stock, and the fellow behind the counter pushed me so hard to reserve that Sakura Wars game that I was maybe five seconds away from walking out of the store. I told this character, I have zero interest in that game and you're only recommending it because I'm purchasing another NISA game (I think it was Mana Khemia 2), so you need to stop riding me. The moral of the story is, it doesn't truly matter whether they know about the niche titles, so long as they follow the Lamestop policy of crawling up every customer's ass so far that they can see what you had for breakfast.

Well it is policy but it's also the more reservations and subscriptions to Game Informer magazine the more better chance that worker and all of the other workers for that location to get more hours besides selling the games. Niche titles only get a few copies come in because of not enough reservations on it but while games like say FFXIII that get more people to pre-order it or some really popular game get probably like 100-200 copies in 1 shipment.

But I will say it's quite surprising that co-worker actually knew of Sakura Wars existence and to know that it's being released by NISA.

[Randall]

The moral of the story is, it doesn't truly matter whether they know about the niche titles, so long as they follow the Lamestop policy of crawling up every customer's ass so far that they can see what you had for breakfast.

Hmm. The stores in my area are much more laid back about it. They mention a preorder with somethings but mostly just ask the general "would you like to preorder something" question. The guy at my favorite one doesn't even bother with me anymore as he figures if I want something I probably know as much if not more about it than him (going in and asking for the Sakura Wars preorder before they had any sort of listing or he had heard about it helps).

Sadly the *best* manager imo is in a town way to far to drive to. What makes him the best? He goes out of his way to stock more RPG's than the typical store and often has some of the harder to find ones in stock. To bad there is absolutely no other reason to go to that town for me.

The ones in my area have been helpful with transferring in things from other stores for me (Trusty Bell for the PS3 is a bitch to find in my area) and have no problems calling the other stores to confirm stock and hold items (the inventory system they have is horrible from what I have encountered).

If you're talking about America then Eternal Sonata(Trusty Bell) is no longer being sold as new at Gamestop anymore and their computers have deleted the new copies from their system and convert all of the rest of their copies to used so I imagine once that happened people picked it up as quickly as possible. Though I find it weird that the 360 version is still in their system for new and used.

That manager sounds awesome and wish I had someone like that instead of the one I have now and the district manager is a pain who doesn't know video games well then again my manager and district manager know nothing about games and ask me on the days I do work all sorts of questions like is Dragon Ball Z a fighting game? Um duh yeah. Would Yu-Gi-Oh be considered a fighting game? It's a freaking card game so no. How do you get on Xbox Live? and so on.

As for pre-orders I guess normally I would be fired but howeveri don't want to brag since it's not something to brag about but I can tell they're keeping me because i'm too useful in many other aspects. Sure when I ask for pre-order from someone I just say what I have to say and if they refuse then it just becomes like I say to myself fine ok then, i'm sorry for asking.

[untoldsorrow]

That manager sounds awesome and wish I had someone like that instead of the one I have now and the district manager is a pain who doesn't know video games well then again my manager and district manager know nothing about games and ask me on the days I do work all sorts of questions like is Dragon Ball Z a fighting game? Um duh yeah. Would Yu-Gi-Oh be considered a fighting game? It's a freaking card game so no. How do you get on Xbox Live? and so on.



I get worse questions that gives me the sense that they have no common sense such as when I am BEHIND the counter and they ask "Do you work here?" or worse, when I was waiting for the owner to come to pull the gate and open the store "Are you guys open yet?".

As for FF XIII, played and beat the japanese release so in no rush to puck it up. Will do so after I finish Resonance of Fate.

[Randall]

That manager sounds awesome and wish I had someone like that instead of the one I have now and the district manager is a pain who doesn't know video games well then again my manager and district manager know nothing about games and ask me on the days I do work all sorts of questions like is Dragon Ball Z a fighting game? Um duh yeah. Would Yu-Gi-Oh be considered a fighting game? It's a freaking card game so no. How do you get on Xbox Live? and so on.



I get worse questions that gives me the sense that they have no common sense such as when I am BEHIND the counter and they ask "Do you work here?" or worse, when I was waiting for the owner to come to pull the gate and open the store "Are you guys open yet?".

As for FF XIII, played and beat the japanese release so in no rush to puck it up. Will do so after I finish Resonance of Fate.

That store doesn't even know it's own employees and people who are not employees?

[Betenoire]

Hmmm. I might not do the midnight thing and roll my GS preorder as TRU has a deal where you can get $20 off another game with purchase of any $39.99 game and up for PS3, 360 and Wii and I sure would like Star Ocean International and 33% of is tempting me...

[Ryos]

I get worse questions that gives me the sense that they have no common sense such as when I am BEHIND the counter and they ask "Do you work here?" or worse, when I was waiting for the owner to come to pull the gate and open the store "Are you guys open yet?".

That store doesn't even know it's own employees and people who are not employees?

Those are customer questions. If I've learned nothing else from my time in customer service positions, it's that most people are dumber than I expect. :P

[Randall]

I get worse questions that gives me the sense that they have no common sense such as when I am BEHIND the counter and they ask "Do you work here?" or worse, when I was waiting for the owner to come to pull the gate and open the store "Are you guys open yet?".

That store doesn't even know it's own employees and people who are not employees?

Those are customer questions. If I've learned nothing else from my time in customer service positions, it's that most people are dumber than I expect. :P

Yeah I been with the same company for like 3 and a half years now and all I can say is that i've had some pretty dumb employees, some that shouldn't even be allowed to speak, and some that are so stupid that you wish they would just sit in some corner. Plus some customers are not always much better since have had quite a few not so bright ones in the past.

[Kouji Tamino]

Hmm, not really feeling the extreme linearity and lack of towns. One of the selling points of RPGs for me is the high level of freedom: it's one of the things I look forward to whenever I get a new game. Not a big fan of battle transitions returning, either, although having a normal battle theme again will be a nice nostalgic touch and at least there are no random encounters. The more I hear about the game, the less of a priority it becomes. At this point, I'll probably just pick it up whenever it's most convenient or ask for it as a gift.

[Ryos]

One of the selling points of RPGs for me is the high level of freedom

Freedom in JRPGs? Isn't that almost like trying to find Shakespearean prose in a fighting game? :P

[Kouji Tamino]

One of the selling points of RPGs for me is the high level of freedom

Freedom in JRPGs? Isn't that almost like trying to find Shakespearean prose in a fighting game? :P

Well, freedom probably isn't the best word, but I've always loved how, after reaching a certain part of the game, you're allowed to go almost anywhere on the map that you want whenever you want. It doesn't sound like that's even possible in this game.

[Fencedude]

Hmm, not really feeling the extreme linearity and lack of towns. One of the selling points of RPGs for me is the high level of freedom: it's one of the things I look forward to whenever I get a new game.

Ah yes, the freedom to wander around and get lost!

Anyway, the way I see it, there isn't really a "right" way to do an RPG, and there most definitely is not a "right" way to do a Final Fantasy.

[broodwars]

One of the selling points of RPGs for me is the high level of freedom

Freedom in JRPGs? Isn't that almost like trying to find Shakespearean prose in a fighting game? :P

Well, freedom probably isn't the best word, but I've always loved how, after reaching a certain part of the game, you're allowed to go almost anywhere on the map that you want whenever you want. It doesn't sound like that's even possible in this game.

Well, you get some of that with Gran Pulse late in the game (which is a huge "Calm Lands" sort of area). My general thought on this matter is that it would be nice to be able to backtrack and explore, but generally in RPGs I do it more out of obligation ("wait, what if I missed a sidequest?!") than out of general interest in seeing the old environments again. Increasingly over the years, I've grown tired of the whole "open world" nonsense in games so a more linear experience where the game is constantly moving forward (and your interactions in each area matter more) is more my kind of thing.

Sounds like Star Ocean: The Last Hope might be more your thing, since it's more of a classic-style RPG than FF XIII.

[Kouji Tamino]

Hmm, not really feeling the extreme linearity and lack of towns. One of the selling points of RPGs for me is the high level of freedom: it's one of the things I look forward to whenever I get a new game.

Ah yes, the freedom to wander around and get lost!

Anyway, the way I see it, there isn't really a "right" way to do an RPG, and there most definitely is not a "right" way to do a Final Fantasy.

That's true. However, that doesn't change a thing about my deflated anticipation and lowered expectations. I'll wait until I've played the game myself before I make any true judgments, but this place alone is evidence enough that not every Final Fantasy is going to satisfy everyone.

[Fencedude]

That's true. However, that doesn't change a thing about my deflated anticipation and lowered expectations. I'll wait until I've played the game myself before I make any true judgments, but this place alone is evidence enough that not every Final Fantasy is going to satisfy everyone.

Well of course it won't, no Final Fantasy has ever done that.

I just think that a lot of people are jumping all over the "linearity" like its a huge, glaring flaw.

Personally, after having finished SO4 (for varying degrees of "finished" anyway), I'll welcome something that doesn't have me traipsing all over the back of beyond doing random crap.

[Suwako Moriya]

I just think that a lot of people are jumping all over the "linearity" like its a huge, glaring flaw.

To be honest, I think most people were expecting the game to be linear. In part because most JRPGs tend to be linear anyway. You might get "side quests", but you still have to do the main thing stuff. You may be able to choose between doing X before Y or Y before X, but you still have to do both X and Y.

I think the issues people are having with is the way the linear is being described. We're being told there are no towns and that most of the game is essentially a straight line as it were. Although there are a few things to keep in mind.

First, there's the fact they're may actually be story lines reasons for why the game is the way it is. It might not be as simple as "no towns just for the heck of it".

Second, maybe my memory is wrong, but FF13 wouldn't be the first FF to have you figuratively go in a straight line. There's FF10 with that "Go North, Young Tidus" stuff.

Third, I suppose one ask this. Is there's much difference between being forced to go North three times in a row vs being forced to go North then West then North?

Still part of the problem is that even if people know the freedom is fake, they still want the illusion. So that way they feel they're doing more than just advancing to the next cut scene.

On a final note, I have to wonder if for a lot of RPGs both the term none-linear and linear can be misleading. That perhaps it's easier to think of some games as being more linear than others.

[ADC]

I just think that a lot of people are jumping all over the "linearity" like its a huge, glaring flaw.

Personally, after having finished SO4 (for varying degrees of "finished" anyway), I'll welcome something that doesn't have me traipsing all over the back of beyond doing random crap.
I think the issue at hand is, many of the past FFs have allowed a degree of freedom within the linear structure. You could go off course for a while. You could stop off at the town with the frogs, pigs, and little people in FF4 (French, American, Irish?). You could swing by Fort Condor or take Yuffie's advice and head toward Wutai in FF7. You could go all over the world finding all 14 characters in FF6 or just have Celes, Edgar, and Setzer if you so chose. It appears that FF13 is so linear, so collimated, that there's only this one place where you can go to screw around for a bit. That makes this game a lot more like FF10, and you all know how I feel about FF10.

Of course, I'm eagerly awaiting the shipping confirmation from Amazon, and I'm playing FF7 like a mofo in the meantime.

[Betenoire]

Still part of the problem is that even if people know the freedom is fake, they still want the illusion. So that way they feel they're doing more than just advancing to the next cut scene.


Wild Arm II did this. It gave you this massive area where you could roam, search and have random encounters but it was seriously linear as you couldn't "find" a town unless you found the right character in the previous one to tell you it existed. So in essence you character can't "find" the town he is standing right on top of if it isn't the linear time in the story for them to do so.

[Ryos]

Still part of the problem is that even if people know the freedom is fake, they still want the illusion. So that way they feel they're doing more than just advancing to the next cut scene.


Wild Arm II did this. It gave you this massive area where you could roam, search and have random encounters but it was seriously linear as you couldn't "find" a town unless you found the right character in the previous one to tell you it existed. So in essence you character can't "find" the town he is standing right on top of if it isn't the linear time in the story for them to do so.
You know, there are a lot of things I liked about the Wild Arms series, but this "innovation" pissed me off. Why is it you can run around the world but just because someone hasn't told you where an exact location is, you can't find it even if you're standing right at the entrance? It's the dumbest thing I can recall seeing. You might as well just throw in the proverbial plot boulder at that point. The "omg it's a boulder" makes more sense than that.

[ADC]

Got the shipping confirmation from Amazon.com. I'd better get going on FF7 if I want to finish it (again) before the new game hits my mailbox!

[Nosredna]

And I'm back from receiving my copy :P.

[broodwars]

And I'm back from receiving my copy :P.

Same here (along with my LE guide, which is quite nice), and the 30 minutes I spent waiting at my local GS was kind of nice. They actually had the store open and an Xbox 360 (only) available with people playing Street Fighter 4 on it, which was kind of fun to watch. Also put down $10 on Resonance of Fate, which I may or may not end up pulling depending on how the reviews shake out on that one.

Took me a good 10 minutes of wrangling with Square-Enix's ****ty online service to get my FF XIII registration code to go through, plus select a "new" Square-Enix members account to link to my old one. -_-'

I can tell already I'm going to have to buy the soundtrack to this game, just listening to the opening score.

[Senku]

Just a couple of things I wanted to post here before playing some more:

-In case you didn't know, there is no "fleeing" in this game. But you can retry battles, and you even get back items you may have used.

-Don't need to be precise with your attacks, like in the JP demo. Lightning killed off one enemy with her first attack, then moved on to the next enemy. Very glad S-E changed this from the demo

-Lastly, and least important, Lightning uses a "gunblade" as her weapon. I guess you could have assumed, but it says for sure in the equip screen.

[HitokiriShadow]

And I'm back from receiving my copy :P.

I just got back with my copy, along with the LE guide. The only other midnight release I've gone to was for FF12. There were about 15 people there for that one, there were more like 50 tonight. I was worried the LE guide was going to be another one of those ones with a random character illustration. Those are nice when you get the character you want, not so much when you get stuck with the ones you really don't (like, say, Snow). Thankfully, they aren't doing that for this one; its just a plain cover and all of the guides are identical.

Now time to start playing~

[broodwars]

Man, it's disorienting just how much this game plays itself for you in the early going with that Auto-battle command. I know it's there to complement the Paradigm Shift feature later in the game, but I really would have preferred if they didn't automate so much of the game early on.

EDIT: Vanille is apparently the narrator this time around...this is going to be painful. -_-'

[ADC]

EDIT: Vanille is apparently the narrator this time around...this is going to be painful. -_-'
Can't possibly be worse than Tidus or Vaan in that role, unless this "Georgia van Cuylenburg" is a worse voice-actor than either James Arnold Taylor or Bobby Edner. And that would make her so extraordinarily awful that she should forevermore be relegated to voice-tracking Megaman games.

[broodwars]

EDIT: Vanille is apparently the narrator this time around...this is going to be painful. -_-'
Can't possibly be worse than Tidus or Vaan in that role, unless this "Georgia van Cuylenburg" is a worse voice-actor than either James Arnold Taylor or Bobby Edner. And that would make her so extraordinarily awful that she should forevermore be relegated to voice-tracking Megaman games.

Ms. Cuylenburg is actually fine as Vanille, and her narration is noticeably softer and more tolerable than her normal speaking voice. I just despise this character already and her voice irritates me in a way that makes me think back to Selphie in FF8 (yes, I know she wasn't Voice Acted, but it's the same voice I'd attribute to Selphie).

[Senku]

I just despise this character already and her voice irritates me in a way that makes me think back to Selphie in FF8

Your loss is my gain, as she's all kinds of awesome and win for me.

But even being super cute, the angle they choose for her status screen is a little... off. The angle makes her look funny.

[Senku]

Man, it's disorienting just how much this game plays itself for you in the early going with that Auto-battle command. I know it's there to complement the Paradigm Shift feature later in the game, but I really would have preferred if they didn't automate so much of the game early on.

EDIT: Vanille is apparently the narrator this time around...this is going to be painful. -_-'

I went ahead and changed the default to be on abilities, just so it doesn't feel to automated. But even then you can use the repeat command and it's auto battle.

I could have sworn I heard Serah narrate parts, along with Vanille.

[broodwars]

Well, looks like I'll have to stop for the night after defeating the boss of Chapter 2 (who, coincidentally, was the first enemy I actually died against because by that point I had stopped taking the enemies seriously. It seems this game's starting to get willing to show its teeth.). Pity I have to go off to work in about 6 hours, because this is a game I can see myself really getting into.

And, incidentally, I'm going to switch the default off Auto-Battle once my characters start getting some actual abilities besides "Attack" and whatever the game wants to call the character's AoE attack. Before then, there's no real point in issuing manual commands. I'll give Square credit, though: this AI's pretty good. I noticed against the Chapter 2 boss that my teammates were following my lead in attacking certain targets, and then when I destroyed one of those targets they auto-targeted the other one just like it. Nice.

[Senku]

Your loss is my gain, as she's all kinds of awesome and win for me.

And as much as I like the character, I'm not feeling her VA yet. When she talks normal and calm, it's alright. But once she gets some energy going, it just sounds too twangy. It'll probably get better with character growth and all that.

Gotta love where S-E decided to put Vanille's "brand" on her body. I also enjoyed her little "Oh no, Run Away!"

Into chapter 3, so time for a break called sleep.

[Randall]

Man, it's disorienting just how much this game plays itself for you in the early going with that Auto-battle command. I know it's there to complement the Paradigm Shift feature later in the game, but I really would have preferred if they didn't automate so much of the game early on.

EDIT: Vanille is apparently the narrator this time around...this is going to be painful. -_-'

I went ahead and changed the default to be on abilities, just so it doesn't feel to automated. But even then you can use the repeat command and it's auto battle.

I could have sworn I heard Serah narrate parts, along with Vanille.

It should be easy to recognize Serah's voice since it's Laura Bailey and usually with her voice you can be blind-folded and still know it's her.

[HitokiriShadow]

Alright, I've put about six hours in and I'm a little ways into Chapter 4, so here's my spoiler-free thoughts on it so far.

I won't comment on the actual plot yet. The good news is that most of what little I knew occurred in the first 2-3 hours. I didn't know much since I was trying to avoid plot and character related information, but I would guess that most of what I avoided was just more details about that portion. The bad news is that, 6 hours in, and some characters I had seen screenshots or and names for (and couldn't avoid, because my primary non-RPG news site decided that that kind of information needed to be reported on with both screenshots and names before the jump to the actual articles) have NOT appeared yet. I can understand the need for Square to feed information to the press to build hype to a degree, and if it occurs in the first hour or two, its not a big deal, though I'd still rather not know ahead of time. But if I put this much time in and still haven't hit the stuff they've revealed.... that's problematic.

I can see why some people wouldn't like Vanille's voice and her character, but she doesn't bother me. Hope, on the other hand, has been rather annoying for the bulk of his screentime. As for the rest, they are more or less what I expected so far, but Sazh, while being more or less the type of character I was expecting, is exceeding expectations a bit in how he's being handled. He's definitely my favorite of the guys at the moment.

I had moderate expectations for both the characters and the plot. So far its more or less meeting both of them; it's decent in both areas, not blowing me away but by no means disappointing me either.

From what I've played so far, the only minor complaint I have is that the game is a bit excessive in switching back and forth between different groups and individuals in those first few hours. I'll address linearity issues at some other point, but I'm not finding it problematic. I wouldn't even be thinking about it, or at least not in that term, if I hadn't heard about people kvetching about it. The game structure, in terms of map structure and linearity, is basically like FF10 but without towns or downtime spent on puzzle solving and the scale of the maps is bigger (in the sense that you feel that the dungeons and world feels much larger than it did in 10; think 12's dungeon scale but with 10's [non-temple] dungeon design).

The battle system, what I was really looking forward to in this game, is pretty fun once it introduces the paradigm system. Not controlling allies isn't a problem because the AI is very good and you don't have time to issue individual commands to everyone once the battles get serious. I've died several times in non-boss battles, and while most of the bosses (both major and minor) have been easy so far, one did require me to retry twice (the one near the end of chapter 3).

So, my feelings toward the game so far are very positive.

[HitokiriShadow]

Took me a good 10 minutes of wrangling with Square-Enix's ****ty online service to get my FF XIII registration code to go through, plus select a "new" Square-Enix members account to link to my old one. -_-'


So apparently registering the game code just gets you some item for Final Fantasy 14. Bleh, what a waste of time.

[Randall]

Took me a good 10 minutes of wrangling with Square-Enix's ****ty online service to get my FF XIII registration code to go through, plus select a "new" Square-Enix members account to link to my old one. -_-'


So apparently registering the game code just gets you some item for Final Fantasy 14. Bleh, what a waste of time.

It's an exclusive item for Final Fantasy XIV and also like a chance to be in the beta for Final Fantasy XIV.

[Nosredna]

It's an exclusive item for Final Fantasy XIV and also like a chance to be in the beta for Final Fantasy XIV.

I signed up to be a beta tester, but I doubt they pick me with the answers I gave :sd:. I did buy the LE strategy guide, but I didn't want to open it up yet because I'm afraid, I'll start looking ahead.

[Senku]

Took me a good 10 minutes of wrangling with Square-Enix's ****ty online service to get my FF XIII registration code to go through, plus select a "new" Square-Enix members account to link to my old one. -_-'


So apparently registering the game code just gets you some item for Final Fantasy 14. Bleh, what a waste of time.

It's an exclusive item for Final Fantasy XIV and also like a chance to be in the beta for Final Fantasy XIV.

Maybe I'll waste my time registering.


Even though I've only mentioned Vanille...

I'm buying whatever Lebreau is selling :nosebleed:

[broodwars]

Took me a good 10 minutes of wrangling with Square-Enix's ****ty online service to get my FF XIII registration code to go through, plus select a "new" Square-Enix members account to link to my old one. -_-'


So apparently registering the game code just gets you some item for Final Fantasy 14. Bleh, what a waste of time.

It's an exclusive item for Final Fantasy XIV and also like a chance to be in the beta for Final Fantasy XIV.

Seriously, that's all? Bleh. Well, FF XIII and Star Ocean IV are likely going to be the only games I'll be buying from Square-Enix this year anyway, so whatever. If I get anything you guys who actually care about FF XIV might want, I'll let you know.

[Fencedude]

Part way through chapter 3 right now.

Vanille is <3

The "Lightning punches Snow in the face" counter is currently at 3, and hopefully will continue to increase!

[Senku]

I really don't think the trophy its going to be as hard as people thought it was going to be. Yeah, it's a little tedious; sometimes you have to Libra an enemy 3 times to get full info., but you can do it in the same battle. (given you have enough TP/items to cast it that many times)

I've gotten full disclosure on every enemy I've fought so far.

[HitokiriShadow]

I really don't think the trophy its going to be as hard as people thought it was going to be. Yeah, it's a little tedious; sometimes you have to Libra an enemy 3 times to get full info., but you can do it in the same battle. (given you have enough TP/items to cast it that many times)

I've gotten full disclosure on every enemy I've fought so far.

The TP is the main thing that's going to make that tedious. I've got them all so far as well, and I'm currently in Chapter 4. The only thing that could be hard about this one is if there are enemies that you only get one or two shots at and you miss them, and possibly some really hard bosses later on.

The one that will be a bitch is getting all the items, thanks to the item upgrade feature that allows some items to become new items when fully upgraded. So you'll need to max out all of them, probably some of them more than once, which will likely be very time consuming.

[HitokiriShadow]

I'm somewhere in mid to late chapter 4. Jesus Christ, __Odin___ is kicking my ass. Time to grind a bit. Edit: Or not, even just to raise Hope's HP by 50 points or so would take a long time. Ugh.

On another note, Hope is becoming a bit more tolerable.

[Fencedude]

According to the guide, you don't have to fully reveal the data on ALL enemies, only 100 of them.

Which makes things far more reasonable.

Also, it looks like getting certain trophies will give you access to PSN Avatars, which is really nice, because the current selection is shit.

[HitokiriShadow]

According to the guide, you don't have to fully reveal the data on ALL enemies, only 100 of them.


Oh, that will be pretty easy then. I'm going to go for all of them anyway though.

[HitokiriShadow]

I'm somewhere in mid to late chapter 4. Jesus Christ, __Odin___ is kicking my ass. Time to grind a bit. Edit: Or not, even just to raise Hope's HP by 50 points or so would take a long time. Ugh.


Yay, I beat him after about a dozen tries. I think I used about 2/3 of my potion supply.

[Fencedude]

Oh, hey. Does anyone know if Vanille and Fang had accents in Japanese?

[ADC]

Oh, hey. Does anyone know if Vanille and Fang had accents in Japanese?
Good Lord, please tell me there's an OFF switch to the voices! Please! :cry:

[Fencedude]

Oh, hey. Does anyone know if Vanille and Fang had accents in Japanese?
Good Lord, please tell me there's an OFF switch to the voices! Please! :cry:

Actually, they aren't bad at all.

[Betenoire]

Oh, hey. Does anyone know if Vanille and Fang had accents in Japanese?
Good Lord, please tell me there's an OFF switch to the voices! Please! :cry:

Actually, they aren't bad at all.

Agreed.

[Senku]

Oh, hey. Does anyone know if Vanille and Fang had accents in Japanese?
Good Lord, please tell me there's an OFF switch to the voices! Please! :cry:

Actually, they aren't bad at all.

I think the one I do like the least is Vanille :sweat:

[Senku]

This game just may have the best party AI...

Ever.

I really am amazed at how efficient my party members can be at times. Especially since I like to change paradigms pretty quickly.

[HitokiriShadow]

Oh, hey. Does anyone know if Vanille and Fang had accents in Japanese?
Good Lord, please tell me there's an OFF switch to the voices! Please! :cry:

Actually, they aren't bad at all.

As someone who rarely watches dubbed anime, partially because most of the ones I try to listen to just don't sound quite right to me.... FFXIII's voice acting is good. I can see why a lot people wouldn't like Vanille's accent but its done perfectly well. Also, I think that a lot of peoples' problems with Vanille's isn't just the accent, its her personality. I really don't see her kind of character going over well with 90+% of the English speaking players. The problem is that most people who complain about these kinds of things are utterly incapable of distinguishing bad voice acting from simply not liking certain aspects of the character that are reflected in how she speaks.

[Fencedude]

This game just may have the best party AI...

Ever.

I really am amazed at how efficient my party members can be at times. Especially since I like to change paradigms pretty quickly.

Every single time I've died its because I, personally, fucked up. Never once has a party member not done what I wanted them to do.

[Betenoire]

Every single time I've died its because I, personally, fucked up. Never once has a party member not done what I wanted them to do.

Yeah, party AI is nice.

Auto battle on the other hand...:sd:

[broodwars]

Also, I think that a lot of peoples' problems with Vanille's isn't just the accent, its her personality. I really don't see her kind of character going over well with 90+% of the English speaking players. The problem is that most people who complain about these kinds of things are utterly incapable of distinguishing bad voice acting from simply not liking certain aspects of the character that are reflected in how she speaks.

That's basically what I was saying earlier: I think Vanille's voice actress is doing a very capable job of playing a character I just can't stand. I can't fault the VA for performing the role just how the Japanese writers wanted it. -_-'

Well, guess it's time to get cracking and get back to the game now that I'm home again (and apparently my apartment office did not deliver my recently-arrived copy of Evangelion 1.11 to my home as I requested. -_- ). Hopefully this game doesn't spend too much time flashing back, as I'm looking forward to getting my first Eidolon in Chapter 3.

[Nosredna]

Part way through chapter 3 right now.

Vanille is <3

The "Lightning punches Snow in the face" counter is currently at 3, and hopefully will continue to increase!

I'm glad I'm not the only person who likes Vanille. I'm having a hard time liking Snow and Hope though. Although I guess it's still early.

[broodwars]

Hmm...the Crystarium System is obviously based on the Sphere Grid System, as previously stated in numerous previews, but am I the only one who finds it a bit harder to follow than that system? Yeah, I get that you have to funnel CP into the glowing line to get it to travel to and light up the crystals on the rings, but I don't like that you can't tell how far each "link" in the chain costs in CP. These initial rings are pretty linear so it doesn't matter much right now, but I can see that being an issue later on when you're trying to decide what to devote your resources towards.

[Fencedude]

Hmm...the Crystarium System is obviously based on the Sphere Grid System, as previously stated in numerous previews, but am I the only one who finds it a bit harder to follow than that system? Yeah, I get that you have to funnel CP into the glowing line to get it to travel to and light up the crystals on the rings, but I don't like that you can't tell how far each "link" in the chain costs in CP. These initial rings are pretty linear so it doesn't matter much right now, but I can see that being an issue later on when you're trying to decide what to devote your resources towards.

CP cost is listed down towards the bottom of the screen.

[HitokiriShadow]

Hopefully this game doesn't spend too much time flashing back, as I'm looking forward to getting my first Eidolon in Chapter 3.

There are lots of flashbacks. Hence why there is an entire section in your Datalog devoted to the Thirteen Days.

[HitokiriShadow]

I'm glad I'm not the only person who likes Vanille. I'm having a hard time liking Snow and Hope though. Although I guess it's still early.

Snow.... has grown on me a bit. I wasn't expecting much from him going into the game, he was pretty much what I expected, and he had some annoying moments early on. I like him a bit more recently though. He really is a good guy, he just has some problems.

Hope, on the other hand.... is a teenager, with some serious issues as a result of the events in Chapter 1. I'm in the beginning of Chapter 5, and I'd say he improved a bit for a little while and has begun to regress. I can't outright dislike him because, well, he's a teenager and he's being written like on. This is part of his character growth. But that doesn't make him less annoying to deal with.

[HitokiriShadow]

Hmm...the Crystarium System is obviously based on the Sphere Grid System, as previously stated in numerous previews, but am I the only one who finds it a bit harder to follow than that system? Yeah, I get that you have to funnel CP into the glowing line to get it to travel to and light up the crystals on the rings, but I don't like that you can't tell how far each "link" in the chain costs in CP. These initial rings are pretty linear so it doesn't matter much right now, but I can see that being an issue later on when you're trying to decide what to devote your resources towards.

Yeah, they made some annoying decisions with how the that system works. I also don't care for holding the X button down, especially when you have to choose between two paths. I'm assuming its never going to be any less linear than it is at the moment though. I certainly hope it doesn't.

[Senku]

Every single time I've died its because I, personally, fucked up. Never once has a party member not done what I wanted them to do.

I've had a couple of "What just happened?" deaths. Especially against those watchbots and "Electrokick" or something.

[broodwars]

*Goes to fight the Chapter 3 boss.*

*Dies 5 times in a row before finally winning the battle.*

OK, yeah...Square's definitely sold me on this whole Paradigm Shift system. You really do have to keep on your toes and read the flow of battle correctly. It definitely helps to have Abilities now set to the default cursor, as the AI makes some really stupid decisions with the Auto-Battle (such as choosing and keeping Blitz on a target that's moved away from a group).

Incidentally, I'm really liking Lightning in this game, with Sazh not far behind.

[HitokiriShadow]

*Goes to fight the Chapter 3 boss.*

*Dies 5 times in a row before finally winning the battle.*[quote]

You mean the wreckage of the Warmech that you fought at the very beginning of the game? That thing wiped me out almost immediately several times.

[quote]OK, yeah...Square's definitely sold me on this whole Paradigm Shift system. You really do have to keep on your toes and read the flow of battle correctly. It definitely helps to have Abilities now set to the default cursor, as the AI makes some really stupid decisions with the Auto-Battle (such as choosing and keeping Blitz on a target that's moved away from a group).Are you sure that's just not because they moved by the time they were able to execute the skill? That's happened to me a number of times when I was executing it myself. I find that Auto-Battle to be pretty effective 99% of the time. It's a heck of a lot quicker to let Auto-Battle choose the spells (and it will automatically choose the spells the enemy is weakest against, as long as you've Libra'd the enemy) than to manually pick each spell. I've only been using abilities when I specifically wanted to use Blitz on a group of enemies.

[ADC]

(and it will automatically choose the spells the enemy is weakest against, as long as you've Libra'd the enemy)
This makes it sound like Square was looking at the SMT games for ideas on how to properly do battle AI. And that suits me fine; the SMTs are about a bajillion times smarter than the artificial idiocy you get from tri-Ass. I almost regret choosing the free shipping option.