Afghanistan: New players, old mistakes-- Gwynne Dyer

[Space Tycoon]

I don't usually say this, but I basically agree with everything in this article:

Four invasions in less than two centuries -- all doomed to failure -- and no lessons taken to heart (http://www.hamiltonspectator.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=hamilton/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1152913813558&call_pageid=1126519607402&col=1126519607416)

By Gwynne Dyer

(Jul 15, 2006)

1839, 1878, 1979, 2001: Four foreign invasions of Afghanistan in less than 200 years. The first two were British, and unashamedly imperialist. The third was Soviet, and the invaders said they were there to defend socialism and help Afghanistan become a modern, prosperous state.

The last was American, and the invaders said they were there to bring democracy and help Afghanistan become a modern, prosperous state. But all four invasions were doomed to fail (although the last still has some time to run)....
....

[tstone]

Very astute.

[Space Tycoon]

Gwynne Dyer may not be the most upbeat fellow out there, but I have come to respect his judgement immensely.

His documentary WAR which came out on Canadian tv about 25 years ago was thought-provoking and nightmare-inducing.

[tstone]

History is a better teacher than most. Of course, there are those who think it's a dull subject. Then they get elected president.

[Space Tycoon]

Yes, but you have to realize;
"You never know what your history is going to be like until long after you're gone."

Of course, having said that;
"Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning?"


The Complete Bushisms (http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:ke49Qanm7H8J:www.slate.com/id/76886/+is+our+children+learning&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1)

[Space Tycoon]

Bump. I'm into recycling threads. Waste not, want not, I say:


A catalogue of errors in Afghanistan
By Michael Scheuer
(http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/IC09Df01.html)


Afghanistan is again being lost to the West, even as a coalition force of more than 5,000 troops launches a major spring offensive in the south of the country. The insurgency may drag on for many months or several years, but the tide has turned. Like Alexander's Greeks, the British and the Soviets before the US-led coalition, inferior Afghan insurgents have forced far superior Western military forces on to a path that leads toward evacuation. What has caused this scenario to occur repeatedly throughout history?

In the most general sense, the defeat of Western forces in Afghanistan occurs repeatedly because the West has not developed an appreciation for the Afghans' toughness, patience, resourcefulness and pride in their history. Although foreign forces in Afghanistan are always more modern and better armed and trained, they are continuously ground down by the same kinds of small-scale but unrelenting hit-and-run attacks and ambushes, as well as by the country's impenetrable topography that allows the Afghans to retreat, hide, and attack another day....

(continued.)






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[Nostromo]

From the strategic thinking file. N


http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/editorials/archives/2007/03/10/2003351728

[Space Tycoon]

"Victory" cannot bring peace, simply because there will always be a war after the war.


Exactly. This is the crux of the whole thing, really.




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[Metuzalem]

You know what's really messed up? All this is in a speech by Richard Crenna in Rambo III. I mean obviously the "writers" of that film did their research on Afghanistan so why the hell didn't we?

Interesting factoid: Afghanistan is one of only two countries in the world that begin with the letter "A" and don't end with it.

[Space Tycoon]

The other being Azerbaijan.

And as far as Rambo III goes, well, we gave a major shot in the arm to the cause iof asymmetric warfare by arming the Mujehadeen holy warriors against the Soviets. Hell, I was for it. I still think it was the right thing to do. I was just beginning to grasp geopolitical events at the time, and I surmised it was a simple matter of aiding the underdogs against a purely Evil Empire.

Flash forward 12 years or so, and we have to wonder: after everything they'd gone through, did we honestly think they would just lay down and accept our rule over their ancient land? What were we thinking? What are we still thinking?!





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[Sgt. Awesome]

I am really pissed. I had an orthodontist appointment at the same time as he was giving a lecture at my school. I saw him speak about terrorism two years ago and everyone said this years was really good... sadness...