Mania Forums

Soccerdude · 06-06-2003, 12:16 PM

i hate his potrayal of the man we all know(or,at least,thought weknew before this shit)as Frank castle.

i hate the whole movie.and i only read 86 punisher comics.

MALCOLMXERXES · 06-06-2003, 12:58 PM

SOCCERDUDE,

I'm sorry you feel that way, but he worked for me, despite lacking the skull on his chest & various Plot deviations from the book.

------------------
"With Great Power comes Great Responsibility"
...And these weapons make me VERY f*ck*n' Responsible!

MALCOLM XERXES
Stuntman/Actor
MALCOLMXERXES.COM
The MX-Files

themanwithoutfear · 06-06-2003, 04:02 PM

yup dolph was great as frank.
i thought the punisher film was pretty good. it's alot more like the modern marvel films.

MALCOLMXERXES · 06-07-2003, 07:37 PM

TMWF,

I grok the fullness of the totality!

I doubt that BLADE(TM)/BLADE II(TM) would have been permitted to fly if not for the fact that THE PUNISHER(TM) let studios know that Comics audiences could handle realistic, adult motivations & behaviour from fictional characters.

------------------
"With Great Power comes Great Responsibility"
...And these weapons make me VERY f*ck*n' Responsible!

MALCOLM XERXES
Stuntman/Actor
MALCOLMXERXES.COM
The MX-Files

Andron · 06-09-2003, 08:21 AM

Dolph looked like frank, but couldn't act. Just like his He-man part!

localhero · 06-09-2003, 01:18 PM

maybe if Dolph Lundgren was a mech...

...oops i thought i was killer tofu

------------------
Cheers,
Local
aka Hunk McCoy "Is it true what they say about guys with big feet? Yes they do need big shoes."

"So let me fill my children's hearts, With heroes tales and hope it starts, A fire in them so deeds are done, With no vain sighs for moments gone."

MALCOLMXERXES · 06-11-2003, 04:04 PM

ANDRON,

MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN rocked the house as HE-MAN! He resembled the character, fought well, & was obviously having a good time in the role.

I admit to being displeased about the casting of the film when first I read of it in MARVEL AGE(TM) magazine, but once I saw the pix of MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN in costume, I was ready to be convinced.

If he had been permitted to wear the skull emblazoned on his chest, however, I would have been an immediate convert. That said, the leatherwork on the costumes in this film is immaculate!

It was not until my 9th consecutive viewing of the film on VHS that I could enjoy the film for what it is, letting go of my various biases, & was finally able to recognise the various subtleties in Design & Style.

Exempli gratia:

1) MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN'S face had been shaven & made up to resemble a deathshead, just as on the cover of THE PUNISHER(TM) #75;

2) The Minimalist acting of MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN was reminiscent of MR. DAVID CARRADINE in KUNG FU(TM);

3) MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN'S arid delivery was so subtle & my prejudice so great that I had been missing various comedic lines of dialogue for what they were, ignorant of the fact that this performance paved the way for MESSRS. GARTH ENNIS & STEVE DILLON in their excellent work, to date;

4) THE PUNISHER'S(TM) living in a sewer was a visual metaphor of his alienation from Society;

5) Subtle Comics continuity touches such as THE PUNISHER'S(TM) immense dislike of Ninjas;

6) The unusual ordnance he was packing - such as the THOMPSON SUBMACHINE GUN(TM) - which bespoke his practise of gathering up the fallen weaponry of the gangsters he has killed;

7) The fact that he starts off clean, but becomes progressively dirtier throughout the film;

8) THE PUNISHER(TM) takes several savage beatings from his enemies, including a tiny blonde female;

9) His pragmatism about dispatching lethal women as it becomes necessary to do so;

10) SHAKE'S tendency to speak in verse;

The scene in the alley when the camera pans up from THE PUNISHER'S(TM) boots to reveal his displeased physiognomy is Pure Cinematic Magic, & would have been Perfection Itself, had MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN been permitted by NEW WORLD PICTURES (AUSTRALIA) & MR. "SMILIN'" STAN "THE MAN" LEE to wear the skull on his chest!

However, I don't think that THE PUNISHER(TM) has been "considered a hero" since FRANK CASTLE went A.W.O.L. If anything, the man is an Antihero.

Also, the fact of his children being murdered does not lessen that impact, nor does it make the Moral, Legal & Ethical choices that we are forced to make when we encounter him in person any lesser; if anything, it makes those choices harder, especially for honest police personnel.

THE YAKUZA were necessary opponents for THE PUNISHER(TM) in the film because their methodology was outside of his experience, giving him & Antagonist JOHNNY FRANCO a viable arc to travel together, just as DAREDEVIL(TM) & THE KINGPIN(TM) did in their film together.

As well, no "Kung Fu" was used in the film; it was Judo, Aikido, Karate & various other Japanese fighting systems, as well as Boxing.

The skull dagger motif would have worked if it complemented the skull that should have been emblazoned on THE PUNISHER'S(TM) chest, rather than replacing it.

KEVLAR™ must shield his entire torso in order to be effective, since no *beep* is going to shoot only @ the skull on his chest. Like him, they seek targets of opportunity, especially since they are generally not well-trained, highly proficient pistoleros, as THE PUNISHER(TM) is.

Everything that THE PUNISHER(TM) does in this film serves to advance Plot & reveal Character, which is a sign of good storytelling in Comics & in Cinema.

There are those who say THE PUNISHER(TM) is a "sociopath". However, I contend that THE PUNISHER(TM) has always had a conscience, but that killing criminals does not bother it, since he feels & thinks them beneath even his contempt. If he had none, then he would have no compunction about opening fire on civilians, as TB had THE BATMAN(TM) doing in his 1989 assassination of that character.

I think & feel that other reviewers/critics are being/have been overly dismissive of MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN'S acting ability to say that he "can't" do it. It would be fairer to say that he has a limited range & technical skill, but I thought & felt that he was perfect for THE PUNISHER(TM), just as he was perfect for HE-MAN(TM) in MASTERS OF THE UNIVERSE(TM), IVAN DRAGO in ROCKY IV(TM), et cetera.

The monotone delivery was perfectly representative of a man who is in a state of mental disassociation, utterly alienated from Society, arguably even from himself.

The naked meditation in the sewer was indicative of his extensive Martial training, instead of making him like a character portrayed by HERR ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER, a character who is covered in muscle, but who does not move like a trained fighter, utters vapid one-liners, has weapons that never exhaust themselves of ammunition, suffers no lasting effects of the violence visited upon him, & who does not undergo any meaningful change to his personality during the course of the story.

...And I say that with all due respect to HERR SCHWARZENEGGER, who is a brilliant businessman, but also an actor of limited range.

------------------
"With Great Power comes Great Responsibility"
...And these weapons make me VERY f*ck*n' Responsible!

MALCOLM XERXES
Stuntman/Actor
MALCOLMXERXES.COM
The MX-Files

themanwithoutfear · 06-11-2003, 08:32 PM

good assesment of the film, man.
i always thought dolph's face had a skull look to it but thought it was just me.
also when we see him naked we see the damage this war on crime has taken on his body. and wait...didnt they use the same type of shot to establish the same idea in DAREDEVIL? yup.
just proves my point that punisher is the original modern marvel movie.

Soccerdude · 06-12-2003, 04:29 PM

malcom,u sure take the PUNISHER(TM)seriously,don't u?

not that there's anything wrong wirth that,but,u didn't need to go that far.
--------------------------------------
If u keep smoking round the school,u will spen ur life as a 6 yr old girl
"U serious"
i would have jean braid your hair.

MALCOLMXERXES · 06-13-2003, 12:51 AM

TMWF,

Thanks, B! I gotcha back, G!

************************************

SOCCERDUDE,

Yes, I take THE PUNISHER(TM) very seriously, indeed, which is why I'm here.

No, I don't HAVE "to go that far", but I LIke to do so.

------------------
"With Great Power comes Great Responsibility"
...And these weapons make me VERY f*ck*n' Responsible!

MALCOLM XERXES
Stuntman/Actor
MALCOLMXERXES.COM
The MX-Files

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06-06-2003, 12:16 PM	#1
Soccerdude Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 170	i hate his potrayal of the man we all know(or,at least,thought weknew before this shit)as Frank castle. i hate the whole movie.and i only read 86 punisher comics.

06-06-2003, 12:58 PM	#2
MALCOLMXERXES Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 177	SOCCERDUDE, I'm sorry you feel that way, but he worked for me, despite lacking the skull on his chest & various Plot deviations from the book. ------------------ "With Great Power comes Great Responsibility" ...And these weapons make me VERY fckn' Responsible! MALCOLM XERXES Stuntman/Actor MALCOLMXERXES.COM The MX-Files

06-06-2003, 04:02 PM	#3
themanwithoutfear Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 142	yup dolph was great as frank. i thought the punisher film was pretty good. it's alot more like the modern marvel films.

06-07-2003, 07:37 PM	#4
MALCOLMXERXES Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 177	TMWF, I grok the fullness of the totality! I doubt that BLADE(TM)/BLADE II(TM) would have been permitted to fly if not for the fact that THE PUNISHER(TM) let studios know that Comics audiences could handle realistic, adult motivations & behaviour from fictional characters. ------------------ "With Great Power comes Great Responsibility" ...And these weapons make me VERY fckn' Responsible! MALCOLM XERXES Stuntman/Actor MALCOLMXERXES.COM The MX-Files

06-09-2003, 08:21 AM	#5
Andron Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 26	Dolph looked like frank, but couldn't act. Just like his He-man part!

06-09-2003, 01:18 PM	#6
localhero Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 640	maybe if Dolph Lundgren was a mech... ...oops i thought i was killer tofu ------------------ Cheers, Local aka Hunk McCoy "Is it true what they say about guys with big feet? Yes they do need big shoes." "So let me fill my children's hearts, With heroes tales and hope it starts, A fire in them so deeds are done, With no vain sighs for moments gone."

06-11-2003, 04:04 PM	#7
MALCOLMXERXES Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 177	ANDRON, MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN rocked the house as HE-MAN! He resembled the character, fought well, & was obviously having a good time in the role. I admit to being displeased about the casting of the film when first I read of it in MARVEL AGE(TM) magazine, but once I saw the pix of MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN in costume, I was ready to be convinced. If he had been permitted to wear the skull emblazoned on his chest, however, I would have been an immediate convert. That said, the leatherwork on the costumes in this film is immaculate! It was not until my 9th consecutive viewing of the film on VHS that I could enjoy the film for what it is, letting go of my various biases, & was finally able to recognise the various subtleties in Design & Style. Exempli gratia: 1) MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN'S face had been shaven & made up to resemble a deathshead, just as on the cover of THE PUNISHER(TM) #75; 2) The Minimalist acting of MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN was reminiscent of MR. DAVID CARRADINE in KUNG FU(TM); 3) MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN'S arid delivery was so subtle & my prejudice so great that I had been missing various comedic lines of dialogue for what they were, ignorant of the fact that this performance paved the way for MESSRS. GARTH ENNIS & STEVE DILLON in their excellent work, to date; 4) THE PUNISHER'S(TM) living in a sewer was a visual metaphor of his alienation from Society; 5) Subtle Comics continuity touches such as THE PUNISHER'S(TM) immense dislike of Ninjas; 6) The unusual ordnance he was packing - such as the THOMPSON SUBMACHINE GUN(TM) - which bespoke his practise of gathering up the fallen weaponry of the gangsters he has killed; 7) The fact that he starts off clean, but becomes progressively dirtier throughout the film; 8) THE PUNISHER(TM) takes several savage beatings from his enemies, including a tiny blonde female; 9) His pragmatism about dispatching lethal women as it becomes necessary to do so; 10) SHAKE'S tendency to speak in verse; The scene in the alley when the camera pans up from THE PUNISHER'S(TM) boots to reveal his displeased physiognomy is Pure Cinematic Magic, & would have been Perfection Itself, had MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN been permitted by NEW WORLD PICTURES (AUSTRALIA) & MR. "SMILIN'" STAN "THE MAN" LEE to wear the skull on his chest! However, I don't think that THE PUNISHER(TM) has been "considered a hero" since FRANK CASTLE went A.W.O.L. If anything, the man is an Antihero. Also, the fact of his children being murdered does not lessen that impact, nor does it make the Moral, Legal & Ethical choices that we are forced to make when we encounter him in person any lesser; if anything, it makes those choices harder, especially for honest police personnel. THE YAKUZA were necessary opponents for THE PUNISHER(TM) in the film because their methodology was outside of his experience, giving him & Antagonist JOHNNY FRANCO a viable arc to travel together, just as DAREDEVIL(TM) & THE KINGPIN(TM) did in their film together. As well, no "Kung Fu" was used in the film; it was Judo, Aikido, Karate & various other Japanese fighting systems, as well as Boxing. The skull dagger motif would have worked if it complemented the skull that should have been emblazoned on THE PUNISHER'S(TM) chest, rather than replacing it. KEVLAR™ must shield his entire torso in order to be effective, since no beep is going to shoot only @ the skull on his chest. Like him, they seek targets of opportunity, especially since they are generally not well-trained, highly proficient pistoleros, as THE PUNISHER(TM) is. Everything that THE PUNISHER(TM) does in this film serves to advance Plot & reveal Character, which is a sign of good storytelling in Comics & in Cinema. There are those who say THE PUNISHER(TM) is a "sociopath". However, I contend that THE PUNISHER(TM) has always had a conscience, but that killing criminals does not bother it, since he feels & thinks them beneath even his contempt. If he had none, then he would have no compunction about opening fire on civilians, as TB had THE BATMAN(TM) doing in his 1989 assassination of that character. I think & feel that other reviewers/critics are being/have been overly dismissive of MR. DOLPH LUNDGREN'S acting ability to say that he "can't" do it. It would be fairer to say that he has a limited range & technical skill, but I thought & felt that he was perfect for THE PUNISHER(TM), just as he was perfect for HE-MAN(TM) in MASTERS OF THE UNIVERSE(TM), IVAN DRAGO in ROCKY IV(TM), et cetera. The monotone delivery was perfectly representative of a man who is in a state of mental disassociation, utterly alienated from Society, arguably even from himself. The naked meditation in the sewer was indicative of his extensive Martial training, instead of making him like a character portrayed by HERR ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER, a character who is covered in muscle, but who does not move like a trained fighter, utters vapid one-liners, has weapons that never exhaust themselves of ammunition, suffers no lasting effects of the violence visited upon him, & who does not undergo any meaningful change to his personality during the course of the story. ...And I say that with all due respect to HERR SCHWARZENEGGER, who is a brilliant businessman, but also an actor of limited range. ------------------ "With Great Power comes Great Responsibility" ...And these weapons make me VERY fckn' Responsible! MALCOLM XERXES Stuntman/Actor MALCOLMXERXES.COM The MX-Files

06-11-2003, 08:32 PM	#8
themanwithoutfear Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 142	good assesment of the film, man. i always thought dolph's face had a skull look to it but thought it was just me. also when we see him naked we see the damage this war on crime has taken on his body. and wait...didnt they use the same type of shot to establish the same idea in DAREDEVIL? yup. just proves my point that punisher is the original modern marvel movie.

06-12-2003, 04:29 PM	#9
Soccerdude Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 170	malcom,u sure take the PUNISHER(TM)seriously,don't u? not that there's anything wrong wirth that,but,u didn't need to go that far. -------------------------------------- If u keep smoking round the school,u will spen ur life as a 6 yr old girl "U serious" i would have jean braid your hair.

06-13-2003, 12:51 AM	#10
MALCOLMXERXES Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 177	TMWF, Thanks, B! I gotcha back, G! ********************************** SOCCERDUDE, Yes, I take THE PUNISHER(TM)** very seriously, indeed, which is why I'm here. No, I don't HAVE "to go that far", but I LIke to do so. ------------------ "With Great Power comes Great Responsibility" ...And these weapons make me VERY fckn' Responsible! MALCOLM XERXES Stuntman/Actor MALCOLMXERXES.COM The MX-Files