Mania Box Office Report: A Whole Lot of Zeros Comments -


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karas1 1/14/2013 1:41:00 PM

I saw Zero Dark Thirty yesterday.

I think there is no justification for torture no matter what the goal.  What's the difference between us and them if we sink to their level?  How are we better?

I've heard that Bin Laden was very disappointed that the USA concentrated on AlQueda and didn't just attack Muslims after 911.  That really underscores that he didn't understand us very well.  We have no problems with Muslims, just people who fly airliners into office buildings.

Did you catch John Barrowman's cameo?  I didn't know he was in the film.  And Mark Valley had a cameo at the very end.

violator14 1/14/2013 2:02:44 PM

 karas- i do see where ur coming from on the torture issue. However i do think there is a difference. The bad guys like to torture to get info, but also out of malice, and the joy of hurting someone. Even grotesquely disfiguring their victims out of "evil fun" if you will.

The CIA version's of torture is mostly mental but purely to get valuable information to prevent the bad guys from bombing more innocent civlians. They have no reason to go further than that. They wouldn't keep torturing the victim out of fun or malice.  

hanso 1/14/2013 2:28:23 PM

 I say if torturing mofos keeps me and mine safe, then torture till the heart is content.

Also, to paraphrase Jack Nicholson's Col Jessep in A Few Good Men:

" You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That torture, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way"


Wiseguy 1/14/2013 2:46:52 PM

I'll admit I'm uncomfortable with torture but given the stakes at the time I won't condemn anyone for going that far. And I wouldn't oppose going that route again given similar circumstances But I also think that as far as torture go it was probably fairly mild with some even centering in just hurting their pride.

As far as how the info was gathered I see folk argue both sides that it was gathered with or without the use of torture. This argument I find interesting and without being there none will ever know. If I torture a guy for 2 weeks then on the 3rd week I treated him to some lamb steaks and he fesses up. Now you have folk arguing both ends but how do we know that the "carrot and stick" method isn't responsible meaning that torture did work.

Anyway I thought the film was great. It spans like 10 years so it has to jump around but it manages to center on the search for UBL and show how the agency seemed more worried about finding targets to kill than UBL himself. These sort of bureaucratic decisions is what drives people mad, targets equal missions equals money equals promotion while losing sight of the primary mission.

I also liked that the film didn't show UBL, didn't thread into his line of thinking, reasoning or anything that would make you feel any empathy for him.


LOL hanso, great quote.

jedibanner 1/14/2013 3:25:45 PM

I guess Karas1 and I and a few others are in the minority here since we view that no ends justify the means.

Hanso, the quote might be interesting but somehow kind of clearly  illustrate how one mentality sees how ''war'' becomes a game and that we the ''normal'' people have apparently no say on how one acts when dealing with violence and war.

In any case, there is so much we unfortunatelly don't know about many methods of war around the's like medecine, some breakthrough have been done with a few questionable research methods...

But where does it all wonder human kind is more destined to destroy itself...mentalities like the character of Jack Nickleson is what's wrong in the military world IMO...they exist everywhere and it's just wrong.

That's my view, feel free to disagree...

Here's a quote from another great voice of our past:

''Imagine all the people living life in peace. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. I hope someday you'll join us, and the world will be as one''


Wiseguy 1/14/2013 3:47:27 PM

Oh! that's so

wildwestie 1/14/2013 3:54:35 PM

 hanso you forgot that last part, "otherwise I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to!"  Great stuff. and isn't that the same gal from zero dark thirty that's in mama? from long red hair to short dark made me not recognize her. sounds like she did well in zero. hope to see it soon.

I saw the seal team six movie on netflix. it was decent and a little shorter in length. it didn't go into the torture at all. looking forward to compare the two.

jedibanner 1/14/2013 4:52:45 PM

Coming from you Wiseguy, I'll take it as a compliment

violator14 1/14/2013 4:58:30 PM

 I suppose you guys would have came up with a much better way of getting intel out of a terrorist who had info on other terrorists ready to bomb your family and friends for no real good reason??

This stuff is for the real men who live in the real life or death scenarios. If u don't understand it, then i suggest you leave it to the big boys to handle it the way it needs to be handled. 

Wiseguy 1/14/2013 5:59:02 PM

I can't help but be reminded of Family Guy's Canadian Alcatraz guard by jedibanner

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