Ten Sci-Fi and Fantasy Oscar Snubs Comments - Mania.com



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keithdaniel 2/22/2013 9:02:16 PM

Hanso, I'm glad to see that you've done some homework regarding Oscar nominations of the deceased and I found that intriguing.  Damn you're good and you're the man by the way!!

Well, Kara, if Hanso is right about his Oscar stats then it would seem that history may be against your argument after all.  There have been many who've wondered or even doubted if there would ever be a woman who would win either a best picture or best director Oscar until Katheryn Biglow won for The Hurt Locker so the Oscars have been known to surprise, so who knows for sure what would've taken place had Ledger lived.  Speaking of parallel dimensions, Kara, you know sometimes I wonder if you're in one whenever we disagree which would lead me to believe that you're there quite often but I'm sure the feeling is mutual isn't it?!!  Just teasing sweet thing and don't worry, we'll always have Blade Runner!!  LOL!!

Kaziklu, just because a movie didn't make back it's budget in it's initial run or even ever and is considered a financial failure doesn't mean that it won't or can't acquire an audience over time which is exactly what happened with Blade Runner.  Another example is John Carpenter's The Thing.  A movie's commercial success also isn't necessarily an indictment of whether or not a movie is any good and the likely reason why BR didn't do well at the box office back in 1982 is because it was so ahead of it's time.  Just because you and a handful of your friends and peers etc. don't like it doesn't mean that the fans of BR are in the minority or that they're only a small group.  Trust me, more people that I know like or love it than dislike or hate it and I think that if a movie like BR continues to be taught at universities it's because there's a lot to be learned from it.  BTW, you don't need a ton of action for a movie to be good.  I also don't think you get that movie and that's alright, it's not everyone's taste.  For the most part, people seem to either love or hate it.  I also don't think you realize the impact that BR has had on not only many fans of different generations but also many directors (just watch the various documentaries on the dvd/bluray).  It's influenced many other films and tv series as well such as The Crow, Dark City, City of Lost Children,12 Monkeys, Ghost in the Shell and the second Battlestar Galactica series just to name a few.  It's also influenced many video games.  Regardless, BR has an enormous following and like I said earlier if it didn't then we wouldn't have seen it return with the Director's or Final Cuts.  You're right that it's a cult movie and arguably the biggest one ever and along with the many sites dedicated to it, it also has done extremely well on home video epecially dvd/bluray over the years.  I doubt that BR would've been selected into the National Film Registry and The Library of Congress if it didn't have the great following that it has.  Over the years, it also seems to keep making the all-time sci-fi lists of various magazines and critics circles etc. and you don't get that by having a small audience.  It changed the face of film noir forever and there's really no other movie like it, despite the many films that came after and were influenced by it.  

Lastly, I would concede that the overall premise of The Road Warrior is that of a B-movie but not the overall movie itself.  From the actors, their terrific performances, the landscapes, the direction and the amazing action and stunts, it's too well done to be called a B-movie.  To me, a good example of a B-movie is one that has perhaps an inferior story, acting, production values, FX (far below it's time) and direction etc.  An example of this would be The Beastmaster (1982).  BR also isn't a B-movie and if anyone thinks it is than they must have a whole different definition.  BTW, unlike BR, The Road Warrior wasn't a flop in theaters, it grossed about $10 million in Austrialia, about $23 million in the US and some more in other territories too I believe so it made somewhat over $33 million against a $4.5 million budget.

Kaziklu 2/23/2013 8:57:54 AM

 Keith the Thing is a Cult film. Bladrunner is a Cult film. 

It also wasn't oscar worth in any catagory for the year it was released, there were better and more loved filmed released that year. 

More then that, I got 4 people that indicated they actually like it. All of them would fall into a Pre-geek chic interest in Sci-Fi. 

You are welcome to like it, my dislike of it, dosen't make it unworthy of your enjoyment, your love of it, dosen't make it oscar worthy. 

I own and enjoy the films Simply Irresistible, Soilder, and Modern Vampires. None of them are amazing films nor are then oscar worth. 

American Psycho is one of my faviourite movies, still I don't consider it snubed. 

shac2846 2/23/2013 10:59:51 AM

 Road Warrior is a really good film. Defintely a good sci-fi action film. It is considered a B movie sure but it is also a favourite among film geeks. I had to study it in a film editing class once and it made me look at it in a different perspective and made me enjoy it even more. 

Blade Runner, I have some friends who love it and others who had the same experience as your friends kaziklu who watched in a film history class and hated it. It is one of the rare films I can watch for purely visual reasons. I'll say this though, if you watch the dark days doc on the dvd it seems that Scott really didn't have an idea of where he was going with the movie. He hired a second writer to rework the script and still kept reworking and filmming things that weren't in the script and he himself could never really decide on a definitive cut until many years later. The ending is a great example. He made the decision to film the extended ending with Ford and Sean Young driving off together. But then couldn't even decide when editing it whether to use it or not. Ford talks about on the doc also about the narrative issues with the movie, I play a detective that doesn't do any detecting. I watch blade runner and get arrested by the visuals but then get upset at what a really great movie it could have been with a better script. Karas you are a fan which cut of the movie is your favourite and why. My friends tend to like the directors cut I can't decide myself. 

Also I have a John Carpenter bio and he talks about the thing and he said that after ET came out the studio felt stupid for not making a family movie about a peaceful alien. The suits thought they were going in a completely wrong direction and didn't give his version of the Thing much advertising money. Carpenter goes on to say in the book that this has been a reoccuring theme with his work in regards to the studios. He makes a movie and then they hate it and refuse to promote it. 

keithdaniel 2/23/2013 11:14:28 AM

Kaziklu, for you to say that Blade Runner wasn't Oscar worthy for it's time and that there were better films that year is just your opinion and obviously most I know both personally and from numerous fans, filmmmakers and critics strongly disagree.

And just because the Academy didn't nominate it in categories where many felt should've been by the way, especially in hindsight doesn't mean they were right to do so.  In case you haven't noticed, the Oscars aren't perfect and they've been known to snub too many films, actors and technicians who were more than worthy.  BR was one of the best examples of this where it was nominated for best art direction and best visual FX and should've at least been nominated for cinematography as well, and how it never won let alone been nominated for the latter category given how that movie was so amazingly shot is beyond words!

There's been many times where many felt that the Oscars got it wrong and BR is only one of them.  As I've stated earlier there have been many other films that many including myself felt should've been nominated in other categories including The Empire Strikes Back (arguably the best Star Wars movie and one of the best sequels ever made), and Superman: The Movie (arguably one of the greatest superhero movies ever).  I guess according to you they weren't Oscar worthy either since neither (aside from tech or score) was nominated for best picture or director.  BTW, Gandi won best picture and director for the year 1982 but as great as that was and still is as seen by many, it didn't have the originality or the kind of impact that BR has had over the years which makes the Academy look very foolish yet again!  I'm also very hard pressed to recognize any film from that same year or even afterwards that's not only as good but that has had as big in impact.  Let's face the reality of the Oscars, most of the time they vote based on politics not based on the merits of a movie, it's actors, or it's crew which is totally uncalled for.  Did you know that Alfred Hitchcock had never won an Oscar for best director for any of his films?  Although Rebecca had won for best picture, he never won an Oscar for it.  Hitchcock is widely seen by most as one of the greatest directors of all-time and has only influenced generation after generation of filmmakers!  Did you know that Psycho was nominated for 4 Oscars but none of them was for best picture?  I suppose by your argument that since the Academy snubbed it in that category then that means it was justified.  Psycho is only seen as one of the greatest and most influential horror movies ever made! 

Whether you see it or like it or not, you're in the minority opinion of not liking Blade Runner and just because you don't see that for some odd reason doesn't make me wrong.  Another example is Rotten Tomatoes where BR has a 92% fresh rating so there's obviously many who enjoy it.  Mind you, the issue here isn't whether or not you should like BR, that's a matter of taste.  The argument I'm presenting to you here is that BR does has an enormous following and has had an incredible impact on so many; both those who are in and outside the entertainment industry.   The tremendous BR following doesn't necessarily make it unworthy of your disdain, but your disdain doesn't mean that the audience for it isn't wide or unworthy of ant awards let alone the Oscars.  You're certainly free to stay in your denial but at this point if you still believe this absurd notion that BR doesn't have an enormous audience or didn't have the cultural impact that it obviously has had then you need a big time reality check because history is strongly against you!

karas1 2/23/2013 1:42:40 PM

Shac, my favorite version of Blade Runner is the original, theatrical version with the voice over.  I've seen subsequent versions without it and I miss it terribly.  I know that neither Scott nor Ford liked it and indeed, Ford tried to sabotage it by reading it in a monotone.  But I think that just gives the movie more character.  The monotone is a symptom of how strung out and emotionally dead Dekkard was at the beginning of the film.  And it does provide a wonderful film noir flavor.

I never saw the ending as being "happy" even though it's the only scene in the movie where it isn't raining.  Dekkard and Rachael will spend the rest of their lives, however long that may be, on the run, always looking over their shoulders.  Doesn't sound like a happy ending to me.

shac2846 2/23/2013 2:31:40 PM

I think I miss spoke. Not happy but Scott added another ending because he couldn't figure the movie out. I haven't watched it in a year but I believe on the dark days doc Scott says that it was as close to happy ending as he could get. From the dark days doc the one thing that seems to be a reoccuring theme is that scott knew exactly how he wanted the movie to look visually from the get go and it is beautiful. In fact a lot of the FX designers in the doc say they likely couldn't reproduce a lot of those optical effects to look the same way twice, it was just lightning in a bottle. But scott could never crack the narrative and I don't think the studio could either. The bluray currently has 5 cuts of the movie further proof that I assume the movie is just open to interpretation. That's always been my issue. I think there is an awesome movie in there somewhere they just couldn't find it in time. A lot of people love the theatrical version even though they know the studio took it over and completely redid all of scotts post/editing work thus throwing out his creative vision but I agree w you that the voice over does give that noir feel. But it's funny that each version can be interpreted in a different way.  

keithdaniel 2/23/2013 3:08:29 PM

Kara, the original ending was happy, at least to a degree, because they were shown together seemingly in love and the romantic music in the background just added to that.  I believe the studio, WB, wanted the happy ending as well as Ford's narration because they thought it was better to have those things in the movie so the audience would understand it better.  Yes, the narration added to the film noir feel but in my book, the movie overall is so strong that it really didn't need it.  I certainly didn't like the narration just after Roy Batty's death, it was totally unneeded.  As much as I loved BR, I must admit it wasn't a perfect movie.  Overall, the script, as good as it was, could've been stronger by having more go on in the middle act.

Kaziklu 2/23/2013 3:58:49 PM

 Well Keith... I don't care who disagree you know who agrees the Academy of 1982... and they are the ones that matter. 

I'm sorry that my dislike of the film, and my opinion that it was of a lower quality then the dozen other movies that were equal or better in every way to it, is so offensive to you. It's not an attack on you. You can keep liking it. 

But the Academy agrees with me. 

VermithraxPejorative 2/23/2013 6:12:25 PM

Kaziklu, sorry, but using The Oscars as an example of "the ones that matter" is not a reason for an incredible classic like Blade Runner to be snubbed. Besides, as time has gone by, Blade Runner has been garnered awards more substantial than Oscars, including being nominated as one of the most important films of all time. Blade Runner is to Science Fiction what air is to breathing.....i.e., NECESSARY!

Not liking Blade Runner in no way makes your opinion any less valid, but it does seem to taint it a bit with those, like myself, who have always felt Blade Runner is one of the greatest movies ever made.

I have 5 films I feel are of THE highest standard when it comes to movie making: (In no particular order)

To Kill a Mockingbird, A Clockwork Orange, Psycho, Alien, and Blade Runner

Then there is, to me, THE single greatest movie of all time(as I mentioned before, in an earler post): 1971's The Andromeda Strain.

 

 

keithdaniel 2/23/2013 7:54:20 PM

Kaziklu, if you think that I'm offended because you don't like BR then you need to reread my previous comments.  I recall stating that it's not a matter of whether or not you like it.  I couldn't care less if you enjoyed it or any other movie; I'm not discussing taste here.  I was criticizing your comments about BR not having a significant following and that it shouldn't have been nominated for anything, because the movie which was nominated for best visual FX and best art direction or set design, and in the opinion of most I've seen and heard believe it also should've been nominated for best cinematography.  If you believe that Gandi deserved to win for the latter two awards over BR (especially given the visual look of BR's impact on both film and culture) then I think you're out of your mind!  And, IMO, ET shouldn't have won for best FX over BR, because the latter's FX were much more original and unique.  BR is certainly one of the most beautiful movies to look at regardless of what anyone thinks of the movie itself and for the Oscars not to have nominated it for cinematography is beyond outragous.

Trust me, I lose no sleep over you and the minority that don't like BR.  I feel the same way towards the Academy Awards, because the way I see it, if they're too foolishly snotty to recognize the best movies in any given category often enough then that shame is on themselves and many of us know it.  The Oscar voters have lost too much credibility over the years to be taken that seriously anymore.  If you think the Academy is always right with their nominations let alone who they pick as the winners then you're in the minority opinion on that too. 

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